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Old April 2nd, 2004, 01:03 PM   #31
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Bad news with Bosscreen, folks: although it has by far the least visible grain, I can still clearly see the paraffin structure - looks like fine "smooth" grain. SD cams probably wouldn't see it, but my HD10 does show it perfectly on HD monitor.

Dang!!

I guess Germans tried all that before making the adapter with the ROTATING glass.

Okay, plan B.

Who knows of an optician to manufacture a thin, 3-5 micron grit ground glass with the exact dimensions of a CD?
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Old April 2nd, 2004, 01:38 PM   #32
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Keep in mind you don't have to rotate a huge disk the size of a CD to get rid of the grain. I'm working on a system that orbits a GG barely bigger than the 35mm frame.

-Les
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Old April 4th, 2004, 10:04 PM   #33
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SUCCESS! vibro35 it is!

Just tested the vibrating GG - successfully!

I simply used the Nikon's focus screen as GG, and attached a micro vibrating motor from old cell phone to the side of the GG's frame.

While GG stands up vertically, the motor is attached horizontally to its side.

As a result, the motor's vibration does not change the GG's distance from the cam's lens, but rather moves GG across the cam's view.

Result: it definitely eliminated all small imperfections which were otherwise highly visible with static GG.

Larger areas where GG's structure is uneven were less affected - due to the fact that the amplitide of the vibration is rather small.

So if GG is quality ground with say 3-5 micron grit, no scratches/blemishes/eneven areas, then my test shows that the vibration will completely eliminate any visible grain.

I'm now cautiously optimistic that a HD QUALITY, wonderfully small home-made adapter is possible.

Because no-one (unless i missed it) produced such adapter, I guess we should dedicate this thread to it and call the adapter vibro35.

(It seems custom to call adapter variants by the name of their developers, but alra35 just does not sound right to my ear :)
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Old April 4th, 2004, 11:11 PM   #34
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Good news Alex!

It's very important not to have the GG move in the in and out direction, as the lack of depth of field will cause an out of focus final image, making the HD image look like SD.
Post a still image grab if you can. I'd love to see the DOF effect we desire with this HD cam!
-Les
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Old April 6th, 2004, 10:27 AM   #35
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please,
post a full native mt2 hd resolution clip!!!


we need to check it out for ourselfs

thanks

ciao
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Old April 6th, 2004, 10:38 AM   #36
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vibro35

After checking the 5 micron GG made of the 52mm UV filter, I have to say that the original Nikon focus screen is still better in terms of the fine, consistent matte.

Will continue experiments with it later today.

I sure will post more detailed info as soon as it is available.

Please note that I'm not a qualified optician or craftsman, so my efforts are slow and expensive to me (buying tons of different stuff for experiments). I'm still waiting for the delivery of the set of micro screwdrivers that would allow me to have the right tools for this work. I'm more into electronics, you know.

However I'm very enthused with the fisrt tests of the vibro35, and will continue developing it until the results are definite (be it positive or otherwise.)
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Old April 18th, 2004, 06:59 AM   #37
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Hi Alex.

Your Vibro 35 sounds like the ticket.

Following all the exchanges I think the static GG is a dead end,
As mini DV gets sharper the grain will resolve needing finer grain et,- chasing one's tail!

Spinning the GG takes lots of space and rotating it doesn't sound right.-There will always be a pivot area somewhere on the GG that is not moving and be sharp- like time exposure of star field.

I've tried moving the GG like a wig wam- side to side- but again at the ends of the oscillation the screen will be static.

Vibration - one one plane is the way to go I'm sure.

How is it working out???

Vincent
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Old April 18th, 2004, 07:40 AM   #38
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I'm working on the Vibro35 version 0.7

Should be finished Monday with the test footage etc.

I'll try to post the pics of the rig, and the footage stills ASAP after the tests.
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Old April 18th, 2004, 12:15 PM   #39
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Alex, how did you isolate the motor from the housing so that the vibration won't affect the camera? It could potentially become a problem on telephoto... just thinking out loud :) Keep up the good work.
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-ztn
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Old April 19th, 2004, 01:18 AM   #40
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Hi Alex,

sounds great- looking forward to pics.

How did you find Nikon screen without markings??

I've had to resort to an Exacta reflex camera from the 1950's to get a plain GG- it is a chunk of glass and may have too much mass for your vibrate breakthrough.
In which case I may resort to a small electric motor with a bevel gear.

PS- I think we have to call it something with your name on it- Vibro35 sounds like the stuff people try to sell me on Spam mail.

keep up the brainstorms

Vincent
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Old April 19th, 2004, 09:11 AM   #41
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Vincent, Nikon has focus screen type D that is completely clear of any markings.

That's what I use as GG.

It is sold for about $30 at B&H (http://bhphotovideo.com)

Glass GG is probably a no-go as it is times heavier than the plastic D-screen in its tiny plastic frame... thus the glass will require much more powerful vibrations and they certainly will transmit to the camera's lens as well...

Stay put for the photos of my tests later today, hopefully.

>> PS- I think we have to call it something with your name
>> on it- Vibro35 sounds like the stuff people try to sell me
>> on Spam mail.

Hmmm, we dont want any obscene names for such a beautiful thing as mini35 adapter...

how'bout this: if you guys do like my results, then you can call the adapter alex35.

If you rather don't like the results, then it's vibro35 :)

Deal?
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Old April 19th, 2004, 04:46 PM   #42
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Ok- it's a deal Alex

I'm ordering the screen you recommend

Thnks--Vincent
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Old May 4th, 2004, 12:01 PM   #43
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So how is it working out?
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Old May 4th, 2004, 12:08 PM   #44
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I've been alternately incapacitated (operation)/insanely busy lately, so sorry for no progress yet.

I'm dying to continue working on it, should be able to do so later this week!
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Old May 4th, 2004, 01:18 PM   #45
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Yikes... I like your humor !!!!

Take care , I'll stay tuned for when you have time to play again!
-Les
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