Sony BVS-3100 switcher sync at DVinfo.net

Go Back   DV Info Net > The Tools of DV and HD Production > Open DV Discussion

Open DV Discussion
For topics which don't fit into any of the other categories.


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old March 22nd, 2013, 12:17 PM   #1
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Arkansas City, Kansas
Posts: 27
Sony BVS-3100 switcher sync

Hello All,

I just acquired a Sony BVS-3100 switcher, that I would like to use in a church. I am having a sync problem with the switcher. When i switch between the different sources the video rolls. I was under the assumption that the BVS-3100 did not require external sync, because it was listed as having an "Internal Sync Generator" (obviously i was wrong?). We have been using a Videonics MX-Pro DV switcher for several years in the church, but we were limited to 4 sources.

If i can get this switcher to work properly i have 3 Sony DSR-250 cameras, 1 Sony DSR-370 camera (w CCU), 1 GoPro Hero2 camera, 1 Sony DSR-20 VTR, a Computer (with a composite output) and a Color bar generator that i would like to switch between using this switcher.

The program output of the switcher will be going to a Projector, as well as several monitors throughout the church and a DVD recorder.

What do i need to do/purchase to make the system work properly? The Sony DSR-370 is the only piece of equipment that i have that accepts "genlock".

Any help would be greatly appreciated!!

Thank you!!
Zach Legleiter is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 22nd, 2013, 05:53 PM   #2
Inner Circle
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Vancouver, British Columbia (formerly Winnipeg, Manitoba) Canada
Posts: 4,087
Re: Sony BVS-3100 switcher sync

A sync generator creates a blackburst sync signal suitable for genlock.

A frame store sync switcher negates the need for genlock as it will delay incoming signals until they are in sync with the internal sync clock.
__________________
Shaun C. Roemich Road Dog Media - Vancouver, BC - Videographer - Webcaster
www.roaddogmedia.ca Blog: http://roaddogmedia.wordpress.com/
Shaun Roemich is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 22nd, 2013, 06:43 PM   #3
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Hilversum, The Netherlands
Posts: 184
Re: Sony BVS-3100 switcher sync

I would try and find another switcher.. Shouldn't be that hard with SD stuff being thrown out at an amazing rate..

Switchers from that era (and professional ones especially) were not designed to sync up sources themselves.. they expected all sources to be synced to the switcher..

You need something like a datavideo or panasonic switcher which has frame/linesync's on all inputs.
8 sources is a lot for such a switcher though. However I know datavideo also made switchers that could handle a variety of inputs, which would mean you could hook up sources to the best quality possible (the DSR-370 can output component, DSR-20 can output Y/C etc)
Sander Vreuls is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 22nd, 2013, 08:44 PM   #4
Trustee
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Honolulu, HI
Posts: 1,430
Re: Sony BVS-3100 switcher sync

Back in the day, I used to hook up BVS-3200 switchers for our editing suite. Our sync generator was a Horita BSG-50. I had sync going from the Horita's 6 outputs to the switcher, then every camera CCU or video deck's TBC. Since it's not possible to hook up your DSR-250 and Gopro with a CCU, or your DSR-20 to a TBC, you're out of luck on this one. The only thing you can properly connect at this point is your DSR-320.

As above, the only way to sync without genlock is to find a switcher that has a built in "frame synchronizer." For this purpose I used the Datavideo SE-800.
Warren Kawamoto is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 23rd, 2013, 02:14 PM   #5
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Arkansas City, Kansas
Posts: 27
Re: Sony BVS-3100 switcher sync

Thank you all for your help!! The switcher was donated to the church, so i would like to do what i can to get it to work. All the mixer's that I have found online (that have internal sync) are way to expensive, or are limited to 4 sources. Which takes us back to the point we were in with the Videonics MX-Pro that we are currently using.

I found this info from wikihow.com:

The link can be found here: How to Synchronize Multiple Cameras to a Video Switcher: 18 steps

"Other video devices like VCRs, camcorders and cameras that do not have phase controls and external reference connectors can be timed into a switcher system with a Time Base Corrector. A TBC is a device that takes an unsynchronized signal and corrects it to synchronize with a switcher. Connect the TBC to the switcher the same way that a professional camera is connected with video and genlock cables. Time the TBC to the system by supplying some color bars to the input of the TBC (perhaps from a pro camera or a color bar generator) and adjusting the H-Phase and S/C Phase on the TBC the same way you did for the cameras. Once it is phased in, simply run a video cable from the video out of any camera, VCR or any other unsychronized device to the TBC in. The TBC "shakes hands" with the switcher for that device. A TBC also has "proc amp" controls that let you tweak in the colors, brightness contrast,etc. to match the switcher environment. These controls do not effect the timing; only the look. Professional VCRs (or VTRs) often have a built-in TBC."

Now knowing this, do i need to purchase a TBC for each of my (non genlockable) sources? If so, How would i hook this up?

Thank you all for your help/support!!
Zach Legleiter is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 23rd, 2013, 03:28 PM   #6
Inner Circle
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Vancouver, British Columbia (formerly Winnipeg, Manitoba) Canada
Posts: 4,087
Re: Sony BVS-3100 switcher sync

The cheapest TBC with genlock input I could find at B&H was this one:

TV One 1T-TBC-GL Multi-Standard Time Base Corrector 1T-TBC-GL

You need one for each non-genlockable source.

As you can see, it gets expensive fast.
__________________
Shaun C. Roemich Road Dog Media - Vancouver, BC - Videographer - Webcaster
www.roaddogmedia.ca Blog: http://roaddogmedia.wordpress.com/
Shaun Roemich is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 23rd, 2013, 04:46 PM   #7
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Arkansas City, Kansas
Posts: 27
Re: Sony BVS-3100 switcher sync

Yes i can see that, say i were to get 7 of the TBC you listed...

The switcher has 4 black burst outputs so let me make sure i am understanding this...

I would take the video output out of camera 1 and put it into the TBC's Video "IN", Then take one of the black burst outputs (from the switcher) and go into the Genlock "IN" on the TBC. Then take the Video "OUT" of the TBC and go into switcher input 1. Then take the Genlock "LOOP" output of TBC #1 and put it into TBC #2's Genlock "IN" in a "daisy chain" configuration, and then set up the second camera just as i would the first... and so on with the third camera, GoPro, VTR and Computer.

With the DSR-370 (that is genlockable) I would take one of the blackburst outputs (from the switcher) and go into the Genlock "IN" on the back of the CCU, and take the video output of the CCU and put it into one of the switcher inputs.

Is this correct??
Zach Legleiter is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 23rd, 2013, 04:51 PM   #8
Inner Circle
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Vancouver, British Columbia (formerly Winnipeg, Manitoba) Canada
Posts: 4,087
Re: Sony BVS-3100 switcher sync

Yup. The only issue might be the latency created by the run to the 370, in which case you'd need to go into the engineering menu and adjust the sync phase slightly.
__________________
Shaun C. Roemich Road Dog Media - Vancouver, BC - Videographer - Webcaster
www.roaddogmedia.ca Blog: http://roaddogmedia.wordpress.com/
Shaun Roemich is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 23rd, 2013, 05:09 PM   #9
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Arkansas City, Kansas
Posts: 27
Re: Sony BVS-3100 switcher sync

Shaun, Could i get around that issue with the 370 by putting the 370's CCU in the "daisy chain" configuration with the rest of the equipment?

For example: Camera 1's genlock looped through to Camera 2's genlock, Camera 2's genlock looped through to Camera 3's genlock, Camera 3's genlock looped through to the 370's CCU, then looped out the the CCU to the GoPro's genlock, the GoPro's genlock looped through to the Computer's genlock then the Computer's genlock looped through to the VTR??
Zach Legleiter is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 23rd, 2013, 05:15 PM   #10
Inner Circle
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Vancouver, British Columbia (formerly Winnipeg, Manitoba) Canada
Posts: 4,087
Re: Sony BVS-3100 switcher sync

Cable length is the enemy here. If the CCU is close to the TBC, you should be fine. In that case, phase is on the CCU, if you need to make adjustments.
__________________
Shaun C. Roemich Road Dog Media - Vancouver, BC - Videographer - Webcaster
www.roaddogmedia.ca Blog: http://roaddogmedia.wordpress.com/
Shaun Roemich is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 23rd, 2013, 05:19 PM   #11
Inner Circle
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Vancouver, British Columbia (formerly Winnipeg, Manitoba) Canada
Posts: 4,087
Re: Sony BVS-3100 switcher sync

I overstate the obvious by saying try ONE TBC before buying 7, I trust...
__________________
Shaun C. Roemich Road Dog Media - Vancouver, BC - Videographer - Webcaster
www.roaddogmedia.ca Blog: http://roaddogmedia.wordpress.com/
Shaun Roemich is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 23rd, 2013, 05:22 PM   #12
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Arkansas City, Kansas
Posts: 27
Re: Sony BVS-3100 switcher sync

I understand....

We will have everything mounted in a rack inside a control room. So the cable length from the TBC to the CCU should be less than 3 feet. Likewise roughly the same length from the TBC's to the switcher.

The 370 has 165ft of 26-pin CCU cable, and the DSR-250's have individual A/V snakes that are about 150ft long the A/V Snakes carry Composite video, XLR audio, and Clear-Com intercom.
Zach Legleiter is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 23rd, 2013, 05:24 PM   #13
Inner Circle
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Vancouver, British Columbia (formerly Winnipeg, Manitoba) Canada
Posts: 4,087
Re: Sony BVS-3100 switcher sync

The timing only matters at the last item in the chain before the switcher, ie. the TBC or CCU.
__________________
Shaun C. Roemich Road Dog Media - Vancouver, BC - Videographer - Webcaster
www.roaddogmedia.ca Blog: http://roaddogmedia.wordpress.com/
Shaun Roemich is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 23rd, 2013, 05:26 PM   #14
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Arkansas City, Kansas
Posts: 27
Re: Sony BVS-3100 switcher sync

I understand... Thanks so much for the help!
Zach Legleiter is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 23rd, 2013, 05:28 PM   #15
Inner Circle
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Vancouver, British Columbia (formerly Winnipeg, Manitoba) Canada
Posts: 4,087
Re: Sony BVS-3100 switcher sync

And good luck to you!
__________________
Shaun C. Roemich Road Dog Media - Vancouver, BC - Videographer - Webcaster
www.roaddogmedia.ca Blog: http://roaddogmedia.wordpress.com/
Shaun Roemich is offline   Reply
Reply

DV Info Net refers all where-to-buy and where-to-rent questions exclusively to these trusted full line dealers and rental houses...

Professional Video
(800) 833-4801
Portland, OR

B&H Photo Video
(866) 521-7381
New York, NY

Z.G.C.
(973) 335-4460
Mountain Lakes, NJ

Abel Cine Tech
(888) 700-4416
N.Y. NY & L.A. CA

Precision Camera
(800) 677-1023
Austin, TX

DV Info Net also encourages you to support local businesses and buy from an authorized dealer in your neighborhood.
  You are here: DV Info Net > The Tools of DV and HD Production > Open DV Discussion

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

 



Google
 

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 01:34 PM.


DV Info Net -- Real Names, Real People, Real Info!
1998-2017 The Digital Video Information Network