help request for first video camera

Allan Rejoso · October 4th, 2004, 10:21 AM

The fastest way to deal with discount shops is to call them (ask your Japanese friend to do it) and confirm whether they have a stock of black before filling out any order form. In most cases, I make the order by phone. Anyone of those shops could have a unit or two of black on a lucky day (but nobody knows when for sure). The black is a special edition model and most everybody who shops at the discount shops wants it, thus, you may have to call the shops (in ascending order of course) at 10:00am for a few consecutive days. If you wait until noon before you make the inquiry by phone, most likely the black cam would be sold out already.

Leigh Wanstead · October 4th, 2004, 02:38 PM

Hi Allan,

May I ask why the black is a special edition model?

I got my gs400 is black one, I really want to know why everyone want black one.

TIA

Regards
Leigh

Tommy Haupfear · October 4th, 2004, 04:02 PM

Leigh, its simply a color preference as the black GS400 is not sold anywhere outside of Japan.

Leigh Wanstead · October 4th, 2004, 04:11 PM

Dear Tommy,

THX

Leigh

Allan Rejoso · October 4th, 2004, 04:44 PM

And production-wise, quantity of black GS400 that comes out of Pany factory is limited. I guess Panasonic thinks the mainstream market still prefers silver or gray.

No disrespect to those who own the silver GS400, but placed side by side with the black, the black one looks to be the ONE to own indeed, IMO :-)

Andreas Griesmayr · October 7th, 2004, 01:16 AM

Allen, had my friend call various shops, but it prooved really difficult to get the black model. The only internet shop which had one offered it to a higher prize, so I decided and simply went down to Yodobashi Camera and picked it up there, counting the points, for the same prize as on the net, but still 150.000 Yen more expensive then the cheapest silver model on the net!
So imagine, I did spend that 15.000 yen more just to get the black one!
Finally I am shooting! Really a very appealing toy, but still so much to learn, specially with that japanese menus.
My question/problem now is the following: The software included only is in Japanese:
From where to download the english versions of the software?
But I remember having read somewhere in this forum strondotguy mentioning that it is better to get firewire connection, and than the 'Video Stream Driver' and the 'Motion DV Studio' will not be required. Still I will need some software. Which will it be then? I did get the 'Ulead Video Studio 8, 'Premiere Pro 7' and 'digital video 3' software ( I have not installed any here on my friends computer, she is picky about that...). Will any of them be enough?
back to playing with the camera,
andreas

Andreas Winkler · October 7th, 2004, 06:25 AM

Premiere Pro will do fine!

Andreas Griesmayr · October 7th, 2004, 10:23 AM

andreas, I think you had mentioned that you were thinking of getting the Kenko KNW-05 PRO II
after buying my pana GS400 I had a lot of points from that shop, so I bought a wide angle adapter, the Kenko KUW-05S. It seems that this one only is available ion Japan, but as I was curious how it compared to the Kenko KNW-05HI I asked that question at the Kenko site:
this was my question:

Andreas Griesmayr wrote:

please be so kind and inform me how do these two Kenko products compare:

KUW-05S ( as sold in Japan ), and
KNW-05HI
( the KNW-05 PRO2 must be superior, yes? )

are they identical, or which one is superior in lens quality?

and this was the surprising answer:

Unfortunately, I have no information on the KUW-05S. The KNW-05HI and the KNW-05 PRO II are, in effect, the same lens.

here was a name, but I took it out.....
Techincal Service Representative
THK Photo Products

surprising, because he says that the KNW-05HI and PRO II are the same, though they sell at a different prize....so you may consider getting the cheaper. I am very satisfied with mine, though the only thing I checked was if there was a distotion, and there is as much as none.

liebe gruesse,
andreas

Andreas Winkler · October 7th, 2004, 08:59 PM

Ahh?? Hm, thanks a lot for this information!! Then I'll try to get the HI version instead.
I guess a lot of manufacturers do the same thing, as Raynox for instance. I think the DCRxxxx and HDxxxx are similar, just one is advertised for still cams and the other for video.

Andreas, you said you get almost no distortion?! In full wide zoom back? That would be not bad for a 0.5x lens! Can you post some screen grabs?
And how about the focus? Is the picture clear from the center to the perimeter? And over the full zoom range?
How about vignetting? ...the black corners, u know...

Andreas Griesmayr · October 8th, 2004, 12:14 AM

.

Andreas, you said you get almost no distortion?! In full wide zoom back? That would be not bad for a 0.5x lens! Can you post some screen grabs?
And how about the focus? Is the picture clear from the center to the perimeter? And over the full zoom range?
How about vignetting? ...the black corners, u know... -->>>

Well, my information might not be of big value, I am a bloody beginner.
I certainly will try to do some sample shots, just how can I 'send' them to you? Can they be published here? If so, how to do that?
Thank's for this 'homework', but it qwill have to wait a bit, as today it is raining, and the japanese home is too small for indoor shooting with full zoom range.
I did notice an interesting, a bit disturbing fact: My first tryouts were all done in tape recording mode, and as I mentioned I found no distortions to speak of, and to my judgement the focus also seemes to be quite good until the edges. However when doing still shots to the SD card black corners DO appear when the zoom is at full wide range! They will disappear when zoomed in just a bit. Those black corners do not appear, even with the zoom on widest range, in the tape recoring mode, neither on still shots nor
while video recording.

@ Allen; thank you so much for all your very valuable help and information. I did get a step up ring to 48mm to fit that Kenko wide adapter, and I did get the original set of Pana filters, 43mm protective and ND filters. I had checked out those tripoids, they are marvelous. The smaller model is on offer now, for just about 6000 Yen. As I still got some points left, very likely my next buy. Batteries I will be able to order in Austria/Germany at competitive prizes later.

Andreas Griesmayr · October 8th, 2004, 05:51 AM

Have made some more sample fotos with and without wide angle lens, and with both the tape recording mode and SD card rec. mode;
I was surprised that all the images are stored to the SD card anyway, regardless of the recording mode chosen. ( this is how naiv I am..) More surprised I was that the image quality differs greatly between the two recording modes ( with the same pixel size and quality chosen and regardless if taken with or without the wide angle lens ).
Fotos taken in the tape recording mode are better focused resp. clearer in the detail, also the colors seem more natural, their angle of view however is less wide. This means that in the Card recording mode the max. angle of view is wider. In the card rec. mode the view of angle is about the same as the widest view of angle in the tape rec. mode when zoomed in to about 2/3rds before the 2x symbol appears.
This difference of the widest angle of view of tape rec. and SD card rec. modes also is the reason why there have been black corners at the widest angle with the wide adapter in the card rec. mode, but not in the tape rec. mode. If, in the SD card rec. mode, zoomed in to the same angle of view as is the widest in the tape rec. mode, the black corners also will have dissappeared.
About the wide angle lens: The fotos with the wide angle lens are noticable less clear/focused.
Also at the widest angle there is a noticable distortion, straight vertical lines on the far right and left sides of the foto will be bent, specially noticable towards the corners. This lines will become straight again when zoomed in untill the symbol changes to 2x.
I am curious if I have made a bad choice, or if the lens I bought still compares well with other wide angle adapters.

Andreas Griesmayr · October 13th, 2004, 06:45 AM

I cannot offer any images I have done myself yet, but these sites for comparison of wide angle converters:
here the japanese kenko site with it's own comparison shots:
http://www.kenko-tokina.co.jp/d/dv/4961607502273.html
here the more general page:
http://www.kenko-tokina.co.jp/d/dv/index.html
this man knows a lot:
http://www.bealecorner.com/trv900/accessories.html#wide
and he has put Kenko sample fotos here:
http://www.bealecorner.com/trv900/lenstest/index.html
to compare images of raynox lenses:
http://www.raynox.co.jp/english/video/egwidedvr.htm

I hope this is of help,
good luck,
andreas

Andreas Griesmayr · February 22nd, 2006, 09:57 AM

Did I ever say a BIG THANK YOU to you all?
If not, here it is: THANK YOU, Allan and all the others.
I enjoy my GS400 to the fullest, even untill today it must be the best choice!

October 7th, 2004, 01:16 AM	#66
Andreas Griesmayr Regular Crew Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Amstetten Austria Posts: 140	finally here it is, my GS400 Allen, had my friend call various shops, but it prooved really difficult to get the black model. The only internet shop which had one offered it to a higher prize, so I decided and simply went down to Yodobashi Camera and picked it up there, counting the points, for the same prize as on the net, but still 150.000 Yen more expensive then the cheapest silver model on the net! So imagine, I did spend that 15.000 yen more just to get the black one! Finally I am shooting! Really a very appealing toy, but still so much to learn, specially with that japanese menus. My question/problem now is the following: The software included only is in Japanese: From where to download the english versions of the software? But I remember having read somewhere in this forum strondotguy mentioning that it is better to get firewire connection, and than the 'Video Stream Driver' and the 'Motion DV Studio' will not be required. Still I will need some software. Which will it be then? I did get the 'Ulead Video Studio 8, 'Premiere Pro 7' and 'digital video 3' software ( I have not installed any here on my friends computer, she is picky about that...). Will any of them be enough? back to playing with the camera, andreas

October 7th, 2004, 10:23 AM	#68
Andreas Griesmayr Regular Crew Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Amstetten Austria Posts: 140	kenko talk andreas, I think you had mentioned that you were thinking of getting the Kenko KNW-05 PRO II after buying my pana GS400 I had a lot of points from that shop, so I bought a wide angle adapter, the Kenko KUW-05S. It seems that this one only is available ion Japan, but as I was curious how it compared to the Kenko KNW-05HI I asked that question at the Kenko site: this was my question: Andreas Griesmayr wrote: please be so kind and inform me how do these two Kenko products compare: KUW-05S ( as sold in Japan ), and KNW-05HI ( the KNW-05 PRO2 must be superior, yes? ) are they identical, or which one is superior in lens quality? and this was the surprising answer: Unfortunately, I have no information on the KUW-05S. The KNW-05HI and the KNW-05 PRO II are, in effect, the same lens. here was a name, but I took it out..... Techincal Service Representative THK Photo Products surprising, because he says that the KNW-05HI and PRO II are the same, though they sell at a different prize....so you may consider getting the cheaper. I am very satisfied with mine, though the only thing I checked was if there was a distotion, and there is as much as none. liebe gruesse, andreas

October 8th, 2004, 05:51 AM	#71
Andreas Griesmayr Regular Crew Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Amstetten Austria Posts: 140	difference of view of angle in the tape and the card rec. modes Have made some more sample fotos with and without wide angle lens, and with both the tape recording mode and SD card rec. mode; I was surprised that all the images are stored to the SD card anyway, regardless of the recording mode chosen. ( this is how naiv I am..) More surprised I was that the image quality differs greatly between the two recording modes ( with the same pixel size and quality chosen and regardless if taken with or without the wide angle lens ). Fotos taken in the tape recording mode are better focused resp. clearer in the detail, also the colors seem more natural, their angle of view however is less wide. This means that in the Card recording mode the max. angle of view is wider. In the card rec. mode the view of angle is about the same as the widest view of angle in the tape rec. mode when zoomed in to about 2/3rds before the 2x symbol appears. This difference of the widest angle of view of tape rec. and SD card rec. modes also is the reason why there have been black corners at the widest angle with the wide adapter in the card rec. mode, but not in the tape rec. mode. If, in the SD card rec. mode, zoomed in to the same angle of view as is the widest in the tape rec. mode, the black corners also will have dissappeared. About the wide angle lens: The fotos with the wide angle lens are noticable less clear/focused. Also at the widest angle there is a noticable distortion, straight vertical lines on the far right and left sides of the foto will be bent, specially noticable towards the corners. This lines will become straight again when zoomed in untill the symbol changes to 2x. I am curious if I have made a bad choice, or if the lens I bought still compares well with other wide angle adapters.

October 13th, 2004, 06:45 AM	#72
Andreas Griesmayr Regular Crew Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Amstetten Austria Posts: 140	Kenko vs. Raynok images I cannot offer any images I have done myself yet, but these sites for comparison of wide angle converters: here the japanese kenko site with it's own comparison shots: http://www.kenko-tokina.co.jp/d/dv/4961607502273.html here the more general page: http://www.kenko-tokina.co.jp/d/dv/index.html this man knows a lot: http://www.bealecorner.com/trv900/accessories.html#wide and he has put Kenko sample fotos here: http://www.bealecorner.com/trv900/lenstest/index.html to compare images of raynox lenses: http://www.raynox.co.jp/english/video/egwidedvr.htm I hope this is of help, good luck, andreas

February 22nd, 2006, 09:57 AM	#73
Andreas Griesmayr Regular Crew Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Amstetten Austria Posts: 140	Thank's Did I ever say a BIG THANK YOU to you all? If not, here it is: THANK YOU, Allan and all the others. I enjoy my GS400 to the fullest, even untill today it must be the best choice!

October 4th, 2004, 10:21 AM	#61
Allan Rejoso Major Player Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Tokyo, Japan Posts: 569	The fastest way to deal with discount shops is to call them (ask your Japanese friend to do it) and confirm whether they have a stock of black before filling out any order form. In most cases, I make the order by phone. Anyone of those shops could have a unit or two of black on a lucky day (but nobody knows when for sure). The black is a special edition model and most everybody who shops at the discount shops wants it, thus, you may have to call the shops (in ascending order of course) at 10:00am for a few consecutive days. If you wait until noon before you make the inquiry by phone, most likely the black cam would be sold out already.

October 4th, 2004, 02:38 PM	#62
Leigh Wanstead Trustee Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: NZ Posts: 1,276	Hi Allan, May I ask why the black is a special edition model? I got my gs400 is black one, I really want to know why everyone want black one. TIA Regards Leigh

October 4th, 2004, 04:02 PM	#63
Tommy Haupfear Wrangler Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Greenville, SC Posts: 1,415	Leigh, its simply a color preference as the black GS400 is not sold anywhere outside of Japan.

October 4th, 2004, 04:11 PM	#64
Leigh Wanstead Trustee Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: NZ Posts: 1,276	Dear Tommy, THX Leigh

October 4th, 2004, 04:44 PM	#65
Allan Rejoso Major Player Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Tokyo, Japan Posts: 569	And production-wise, quantity of black GS400 that comes out of Pany factory is limited. I guess Panasonic thinks the mainstream market still prefers silver or gray. No disrespect to those who own the silver GS400, but placed side by side with the black, the black one looks to be the ONE to own indeed, IMO :-)

October 7th, 2004, 06:25 AM	#67
Andreas Winkler Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Kaohsiung, Taiwan Posts: 125	Premiere Pro will do fine!

October 7th, 2004, 08:59 PM	#69
Andreas Winkler Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Kaohsiung, Taiwan Posts: 125	Ahh?? Hm, thanks a lot for this information!! Then I'll try to get the HI version instead. I guess a lot of manufacturers do the same thing, as Raynox for instance. I think the DCRxxxx and HDxxxx are similar, just one is advertised for still cams and the other for video. Andreas, you said you get almost no distortion?! In full wide zoom back? That would be not bad for a 0.5x lens! Can you post some screen grabs? And how about the focus? Is the picture clear from the center to the perimeter? And over the full zoom range? How about vignetting? ...the black corners, u know...

October 8th, 2004, 12:14 AM	#70
Andreas Griesmayr Regular Crew Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Amstetten Austria Posts: 140	. Andreas, you said you get almost no distortion?! In full wide zoom back? That would be not bad for a 0.5x lens! Can you post some screen grabs? And how about the focus? Is the picture clear from the center to the perimeter? And over the full zoom range? How about vignetting? ...the black corners, u know... -->>> Well, my information might not be of big value, I am a bloody beginner. I certainly will try to do some sample shots, just how can I 'send' them to you? Can they be published here? If so, how to do that? Thank's for this 'homework', but it qwill have to wait a bit, as today it is raining, and the japanese home is too small for indoor shooting with full zoom range. I did notice an interesting, a bit disturbing fact: My first tryouts were all done in tape recording mode, and as I mentioned I found no distortions to speak of, and to my judgement the focus also seemes to be quite good until the edges. However when doing still shots to the SD card black corners DO appear when the zoom is at full wide range! They will disappear when zoomed in just a bit. Those black corners do not appear, even with the zoom on widest range, in the tape recoring mode, neither on still shots nor while video recording. @ Allen; thank you so much for all your very valuable help and information. I did get a step up ring to 48mm to fit that Kenko wide adapter, and I did get the original set of Pana filters, 43mm protective and ND filters. I had checked out those tripoids, they are marvelous. The smaller model is on offer now, for just about 6000 Yen. As I still got some points left, very likely my next buy. Batteries I will be able to order in Austria/Germany at competitive prizes later.