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-   -   Low light issue FS100 vs EX1 (http://www.dvinfo.net/forum/sony-nxcam-nex-fs100-cinealta/513247-low-light-issue-fs100-vs-ex1.html)

Svein Rune Skilnand January 7th, 2013 01:58 AM

Low light issue FS100 vs EX1
 
2 Attachment(s)
Hi.
I am wondering if my FS 100 has a low light problem or if there are some settings I don`t understand. Shooting with my EX1R alongside my FS100, my EX1R gives me a brighter image when set to default settings. I have attached to JPEGs to try and explain.

The EX1R has the following settings:
F2.8, 0db,1/60, Doug Jensens Picture profile ( from training DVD )

The FS100 has the following settings:
F2.8, 0db,1/50, Doug Jensens Picture profile ( from training DVD ), Metabones Adaptor, Tokina 11-16

It was my understanding that the FS 100 would be the King of low light. Is there something about the gain I don`t understand?

Any input appreciated.

Bill Pryor January 7th, 2013 03:35 PM

Re: Low light issue FS100 vs EX1
 
That's really weird. You don't have the ND filter on the lens, do you?

Mestizo Devon January 7th, 2013 03:52 PM

Re: Low light issue FS100 vs EX1
 
No ND on the FS100

Darren Levine January 7th, 2013 07:29 PM

Re: Low light issue FS100 vs EX1
 
the ex1 isn't a slouch in low light, im wrapping up a comparison of 5d2/ex1/c100 this week, and while the distinctions are obvious, the ex1 is still remarkable at only a half inch

as for your matching difficulties, research just what each cameras gain settings is equivalant to in ISO and native sensitivity.

or just skip that part and find out the highest gain setting you find acceptable in each, and then see just how much difference there is between the two

Svein Rune Skilnand January 8th, 2013 01:31 AM

Re: Low light issue FS100 vs EX1
 
Hi everybody.
No, there is no ND- filter on the FS100. Or, well, there is a variable ND- fader filter from Genus on the lens, but that was set to minimal or no ND.

If I turn the gain up it is better than the EX1, cleaner image, but I sure wouldn`t trade my EX1 at this point for an FS100. I would just add lights.

6 db is as high as I would go on the EX1, 9db is acceptable, but doesn`t look nice. Or at least that is my opinion.

On the FS100 I can go as high as 21db, but that was connecting my camera to my 32" Samsung TV via HDMI and just looking at the image. Not sure how that would hold up in post.

I believe I read somewhere that the native ISO on the FS100 is 800. Not sure what that means in db. I wonder if a firmware upgrade would improve? Maybe my FS100 should be set at 9 db, maybe that equals 0 db on my EX1. Maybe the db settings are just"off". Just a tought as these are different "families" of cameras.

As of right now I am a little frustrated as I don`t know what is wrong, or if this is as good as the camera gets.

Gabe Strong January 8th, 2013 02:45 AM

Re: Low light issue FS100 vs EX1
 
Umm....sorry to break this to you but there is NO zero setting with ANY variable ND!!!
That's one of the disadvantages of having no built in ND, there is NO 'off' setting on
any ND filter you put on the lens. The Heliopan gives you 1-6 stops of ND, in other
words, when you turn it to the 'minimum' it is still giving you a stop of ND. The Genus
on the other hand, gives you 2-8 stops of ND, so in other words if you have a Genus variable ND
on the lens, even when you set it to 'minimum' you are STILL getting 2 STOPS OF ND! Take
that variable ND off the lens and look at the difference!!

Svein Rune Skilnand January 8th, 2013 03:05 AM

Re: Low light issue FS100 vs EX1
 
Gabe.
I feel embarrased. You are completely correct. I bought it as a package. When the lens arrived I put the ND- fader filter on, then attched the Metabones and then the lens. I did this on a bright day, so didn`t notice anything wrong. Till I wanted to shoot inside.

What a relief....

Here I have been messing with picture profiles, gain settings, trawling the web and.......

Thanks. Thank you so much. I didn`t realize the filter went from 2-8 stops. I just bought it and was happy to have found a solution.

Looks like I will be buying a mattebox instead.

Gabe Strong January 8th, 2013 09:46 AM

Re: Low light issue FS100 vs EX1
 
No problem we've all been there.....or at least I have more times than I want to admit.
I actually use a different solution instead of a matte box.....the Xume solution.
But that's because I do almost no 'narrative' shooting. The Xume setup is
just freaking sweet....and pretty cheap. I'll have a review up soon.

Les Wilson January 9th, 2013 09:19 AM

Re: Low light issue FS100 vs EX1
 
So can you post an updated split between the two at equal settings?

Svein Rune Skilnand January 9th, 2013 01:27 PM

Re: Low light issue FS100 vs EX1
 
Thanks, Gabe.

Les. Unfortunately I can`t at the moment. My colleague will be using my EX1Rs the next month. He left me with my FS100 all alone....

But I will try and upload a new comparison when the cameras return in the beginning of February.

James Hobert February 23rd, 2013 08:18 PM

Re: Low light issue FS100 vs EX1
 
Hi SRS,

Would love to see the updated side by side (without ND's on of course :)

Got the two cameras back yet?

Thanks!

Also, if you have an extra moment try doing what someone previously suggested in raising the ISO/gain on each to see how they compare at higher gain/ISO levels. I'm guessing that's when you'd see the FS100 really take over but it would be fascinating to see the two side by side.

Matt Davis February 24th, 2013 03:45 AM

Re: Low light issue FS100 vs EX1
 
This thread got me intrigued, so I've dug out my EX1 and FS100, put them side by side looking at a fairly plain matte white(ish) target, used Zebras at 70 and twiddled briefly with each to ensure equal WB and no Picture Profiles.

At 720p25 on the EX1 and plain 1080p25 on the FS100, they're identical.

1/50th at 5.6, no ND. Switch to 720p50 on the EX1, slight drop of light, maybe third of a stop to bring the zebras back to match the FS100? Half? Little half? Hard to tell.

Switch to 1080p25, and we need to open up to f4.8 - so maybe a full stop between 720p and 1080p at 25fps.

These are really rough observations as, has been previously stated, the EX1 iris readout is a little coarse and the FS100's zebras can be vague. I also tried my C100, and it was roughly a halft stop more sensitive, and these would all follow the general '400 for EX1 1080, 500 for EX1 720 and FS100, 850 for C100' rule of thumb. And whilst thinking of thumbs, thumbs up for the EX1, still cooking after all these years.


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