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Sony XDCAM EX Pro Handhelds
Sony PMW-300, PXW-X200, PXW-X180 (back to EX3 & EX1) recording to SxS flash memory.


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Old January 3rd, 2009, 09:51 AM   #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ross Herewini View Post
Hi Craig,


So, I was wondering if you could try a couple of tests for me, to see if we can work out where it is going off track.

1. Start with a fresh card, or one where you have gone in using Explorer / Finder and removed the BPAV directory.
2. When you insert the SDHC into the MxR and into the EX1, (how's that for some acronyms), then you should get a format media message. Go ahead and format.
3. Set recoding to HQ, and record one clip. Let the record light above the card go from red to green, usually takes about 5secs on Ultra II 16GB.
4. Now try and review the clip, by firstly using clip review in camera mode, and then try play clip in media mode.

I'd like to know if you get anything at all here.
Ross, I've done the above several times. Same results.
1. Remove BPAV
2. Reformat Card
3. Set to 1080p30 and records about 10 seconds
4. Set camera for 3 second clip review and show media error
5. Set camera to media mode and I see pic icon. Attempt to play and get media error

Note that when remove SHDC card from MxR and putin Sandisk 12 in 1 reader and connect to computer via USB, ClipBrowser sees and plays clip straight from card.

Card can playback the clip. Camera can't.
I'm also noting that sometimes the card fails format on the first try and always makes it on the 2nd try.
I'm testing the same card in both MxR and both A and B slot in camera.

I have a 2nd Sandisk Ultra II 32GB card to test. A friend of mine also has Sandisk Ultra II and Transcend cards he'll bring over for me to test later.

Just to be clear, the recordings are fine. They can't playback in camera. The SDHC itself can playback the recording when hooked to Computer through Sandisk 12 in 1 reader (sans MxR).
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Old January 3rd, 2009, 10:14 AM   #62
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Originally Posted by Ross Herewini View Post

A) If you do can we go to a new test, same as above but try overcranking but limit it to 45frames for now, and try the same as above.
OR
B) If you see nothing after the first test, do you have another card that we can use to test. I'd prefer to use a 16GB Ultra II as this eliminates the MxR functionality, and means we can concentrate on why it doesn't work for you on 32GB.

I did read elsewhere where one of the forum members had tried the 32GB card and it had worked successfully. I'll post him and ask if he has tried the same thing you have attempted.
I recorded overcrank 720p30/45 for one minute. Again the clip generates media error when attempting to playback in camera.

Someone did mention they "successfully" used 32GB card but did they try playing back in camera? That's the issue. Recordings are fine. Playback in camera is not working. I'm noting that format often doesn't work on first attempt. Reinserting MxR results in successful formating.

Could it be a "contacts" issue with MxR? Again testing with 2 MxR cards. I'll try 2nd 32GB card and additional cards from friend so we can narrow this down.

I'll also try the speed test utility recommended a couple of posts back.
I don't think it's playback speed of the SDHC card because the card plays back the clip without issue when hooked to computer (ClipBrowser) with 12 in 1 reader (sans MxR).
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Old January 3rd, 2009, 10:30 AM   #63
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!!!

I'm seeing same issue with SxS cards! Can someone post how to reboot the camera? Is it simply the All Reset in the bottom menu or is there something more fundamental?
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Old January 3rd, 2009, 10:37 AM   #64
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thanks ross

Received my 5 cards xmas eve day... didn't touch them until yesterday... formatted four out of the five with sandisk sdhc 16gb cards with no probs whatsoever... haven't recorded anything yet, but I plan on shooting over/undercrank with SxS so don't anticipate any issues.

Thanks for a affordable solid state recording solution.

Greg
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Old January 3rd, 2009, 10:50 AM   #65
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Originally Posted by Craig Seeman View Post
!!!

I'm seeing same issue with SxS cards! Can someone post how to reboot the camera? Is it simply the All Reset in the bottom menu or is there something more fundamental?
Craig, I believe it's the ALL Reset.
That's odd.
Please report back.
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Old January 3rd, 2009, 10:53 AM   #66
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Thanks. Just tried that. It didn't fix the issue. No playback from SxS either.
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Old January 3rd, 2009, 02:17 PM   #67
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Originally Posted by Craig Seeman View Post
Thanks. Just tried that. It didn't fix the issue. No playback from SxS either.
Hi Craig,

Have you tried removing the BPU-30/60, then remove the Lithium Ion back-up battery. It is right under the bottom of the camera.

I had to do this on a shoot where I lost all zoom, focus auto and manual functions. It's probably not recommended, but I pulled it out to make sure I got a complete "Cold Reboot". I don't know how to remove it nicely, I was panicking when I did it during a shoot, so had no time to read the manual, or look for the right tool.



One other thing to check is which version of the Firmware you are running? You probably already know how to check it, but in case you don't, you hit the <Cancel> <Select><Menu> buttons together, and that will open the Maint Menu. Scroll down to <IF> and you will see it there.

Thanks Craig.
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Old January 3rd, 2009, 03:08 PM   #68
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Ross, removing the lithium battery is a legit user function. It's on page 119 of EX1 printed manual.

I removed and reinserted lithium battery in the camera. Turning on camera asks for time/date which of course verifies the batter was removed and reinserted.

Unfortunately I still get Media Error after recording a clip for a few seconds and attempting to playback (SxS card).

When I go into Media mode after recording multiple clips I can see them all. I can get clip info and move from clip to clip in that mode. So it's clear the camera does see the clips and obviously can display the meta data on the clips. In Media mode when I hit play I get black screen and flashing read tally light on back of camera. The only way to get out of that is to turn off camera.

Last edited by Craig Seeman; January 3rd, 2009 at 03:50 PM.
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Old January 3rd, 2009, 04:18 PM   #69
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Ross - not to take focus away from the rest of the discussion, but wanted to let you know that I received my MxR in the mail today and shot some test footage using the SanDisk Ultra II 15MB/s card.

I shot 1080p30 (regular speed) and 720p60 over 30fps (overcranked). The latter was shot for about 1.5 minutes. No problems whatsoever. I viewed the footage in-camera after recording, pulled the footage using Sony's XDCAM Transfer and Clip Browser off my MBP (ExpressCard inserted directly into computer), and ingested the footage and played it back in After Effects to test some motion tracking stuff without an issue. Not a single issue anywhere during this test.

I have it loaded as my primary card at this point and will be shooting on it regularly as I shoot over the next couple of weeks (no major planned shooting right now, though).

Just a quick note to let you and others know that there's another success story out there, including full overcrank.

I foresee myself picking up another couple of cards from you in the near-term - this is a GREAT solution to the Sony SxS cards at 1/8 the price point (for 16G)!

Thanks again, Ross!
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Old January 3rd, 2009, 04:20 PM   #70
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Originally Posted by Craig Seeman View Post
Ross, removing the lithium battery is a legit user function. It's on page 119 of EX1 printed manual.

I removed and reinserted lithium battery in the camera. Turning on camera asks for time/date which of course verifies the batter was removed and reinserted.

Unfortunately I still get Media Error after recording a clip for a few seconds and attempting to playback (SxS card).

When I go into Media mode after recording multiple clips I can see them all. I can get clip info and move from clip to clip in that mode. So it's clear the camera does see the clips and obviously can display the meta data on the clips. In Media mode when I hit play I get black screen and flashing read tally light on back of camera. The only way to get out of that is to turn off camera.
Hi Craig,

Can I just confirm that when you go from record to review, that the card has finished it's TOC writing, ie that the slot has a green light over it, not red?

We found that with slow media, like Lexar SSD, we ended up getting media errors when going to preview as the camera had not finished doing it's TOC writing.

Have you tried going into Media mode ie opposite to Camera mode and tried playback from the thumbnail screen? Do you still get the same errors?

Sorry if you have already covered these areas, just wanted to be on the same page as they say, because I hear there is a 3 week turnaround at some Sony places.
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Old January 3rd, 2009, 05:34 PM   #71
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TOC done light is Green before playback is attempted.
In Media mode seeing and advancing through thumbnails works. Playback does not.
BTW this issue is BOTH SxS and MxR so I don't think it's your cards at issue.

My friend dropped by and we tried some "irrational" tests and we FOUND the pattern!

Turn YPbPr/SDI Out Select - OFF
Playback WORKS. Both SxS and MxR last clip review WORKS. Media Mode Playback WORKS.

Turn YPbPr/SDI Out Select - SD or HD
Playback does NOT WORK. Both SxS and MxR last clip review results in Media Error. This has no impact on going right back into record or anything else
Media mode playback does NOT WORK. Black screen when attempting playback. Cards is briefly accessed (light goes Red the goes Green and stays Green) and tally light flashes. Camera locks up and must be shut off.

My guess is that there is either an issue with Sony's install of the new firmware or they screwed up the hardware.

Just confirming that with YPbPr/SDI Out Select - OFF - All playback and clip review works NORMALLY.

BTW there is over 3 week turnaround at Sony here locally. It does seem to be an issue with Camera and not cards though.
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Old January 3rd, 2009, 06:50 PM   #72
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Hi Craig,
Just curious did you install firmware upgrade yourself or Sony did it? I know someone who did it himself and his camera lost some functionality. I suspect that there was a bug.
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Old January 3rd, 2009, 08:05 PM   #73
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Sony did it since I needed battery drain and fading back panel also addressed. I'm wondering if Sony did a "funky" firmware install unless there's a bug in the firmware itself.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark Krichever View Post
Hi Craig,
Just curious did you install firmware upgrade yourself or Sony did it? I know someone who did it himself and his camera lost some functionality. I suspect that there was a bug.
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Old January 3rd, 2009, 11:33 PM   #74
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I shot 1080p30 (regular speed) and 720p60 over 30fps (overcranked). The latter was shot for about 1.5 minutes. No problems whatsoever.

Just a quick note to let you and others know that there's another success story out there, including full overcrank.
Ryan,
Actually if you had tried to overcrank 24P at 60FPS, it would of failed.

Overcranking 30P at 60FPS, takes less data rate than overcranking 24P at 60FPS.
24P needs about 20% higher datarate to overcrank.
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Old January 3rd, 2009, 11:41 PM   #75
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Originally Posted by Craig Seeman View Post
Turn YPbPr/SDI Out Select - OFF
Playback WORKS. Both SxS and MxR last clip review WORKS. Media Mode Playback WORKS.
Wow... nice find.
This is odd since I've been monitoring using SDI and playing back on my EX1..?
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