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The View: Video Display Hardware and Software
Video Monitors and Media Players for field or studio use (all display technologies).


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Old October 4th, 2009, 10:24 AM   #256
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Andrew, I've got an observation and comment:

That wider shot of your's used a flash, as is easily seen by the brightness inside the hood and the angle of the sun (in front of you and to the left). If you had shot that pic without the flash, you'd see the DP1 image even better. Any field monitor would have had roughly the same image at that angle, I would imagine.

Now turn that monitor around at some slight angle from the sun...add some bright sand or rocks behind/below you and try it...now that's another ballgame!

We did a number of productions in the hills, forests and trees of southern Brazil, and our monitors were not much problem. But here...my NZ mountain/forest friend...it's a whole different show. You have the hole, but we have the sun straight up overhead and reflecting off light granite rocks and/or sand.

The bottom line seems to be: "if it weren't made for sunlight, then it just don't run right..."
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Old October 4th, 2009, 04:17 PM   #257
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Fair enough. In my experience the dp1 shows noticeably more image in day/sunlight than any of the other monitors we use (including the RED monitor), but thats far from a comprehensive list. It sounds like you've had other LCDs that fared about as well.

If you get a monitor that rocks in the equatorial sun, be sure to let us forest/hill dwellers know about it! hehe.

cheers!
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Originally Posted by Stephen Armour View Post
The bottom line seems to be: "if it weren't made for sunlight, then it just don't run right..."
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Old October 4th, 2009, 04:30 PM   #258
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My dp1 never stops amazing me on my xlh1 when I am out shooting. However i have a small problem.


I am having trouble running straight dv through my xl2 to it and my gl2 (which doesn't have a svhs port asi tii uses 1/8 to three vga out.

The svhs cable should work, but it is so big and heavy I would rather not use it!

why cant i use the yellow video cable? If I can, what setting does it have to be on as i tried them all.

I am obviously missing something here.
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Old October 4th, 2009, 07:58 PM   #259
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Andrew Dean View Post
Fair enough. In my experience the dp1 shows noticeably more image in day/sunlight than any of the other monitors we use (including the RED monitor), but thats far from a comprehensive list. It sounds like you've had other LCDs that fared about as well.

If you get a monitor that rocks in the equatorial sun, be sure to let us forest/hill dwellers know about it! hehe.

cheers!
-a
Believe me Andrew, if I find one like the dp1, especially for it's good price...I'll shout it loud and clear!

In the meantime...I'm crying over having to pay transreflective prices, even for the "cheaper" Marshalls. We just can't afford to lay out the beans and run the customs gauntlet to import a monitor into Brazil that really doesn't cut the reflective mustard.

It just "ain't worth it, my friend".

Abraço, Steve
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Old October 4th, 2009, 08:26 PM   #260
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dale Guthormsen View Post
I am having trouble running straight dv through my xl2 to it and my gl2 (which doesn't have a svhs port asi tii uses 1/8 to three vga out.
why cant i use the yellow video cable? If I can, what setting does it have to be on as i tried them all.
I dont see any reason you cant run the composite out from the camera into the dp1. (thats what it sounds like you are describing. 1/8" to 3 rca plugs- one yellow (composite) and one red and one white (stereo audio).

You'd hook the composite plug to the composite input on the dp1 and change to the "av" input.

The xl2 has bnc or rca outputs, doesnt it? So a simple RCA cable from the output to the composite input on the dp1.

Apologies if this is something you already know, but, you change the input by (when facing the monitor) pressing the button on the back to your far left. Then change the input by pressing the button on the far right, and once you have it set to "av" (or whatever input you want), you press the button second from the right to "accept" the change.

cheers!
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Old October 6th, 2009, 12:10 PM   #261
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Originally Posted by Charles Papert View Post
Earlier this year I organized the "Great Daylight Monitor Shootout" where we tested some 15 monitors for their daylight viewability.
Hey Charles,

I still fly a Pro II rig with the 5" Pro II P43 monitor. If you were to get a P43 monitor today, which one (out of the ones that you tested that have a FL generator) would you get?

I toyed around with a Steadicam Flyer / JVC HD110 (stripped to the bone) combo awhile back, and the only monitor I tested that would work 90% of the time in exterior shots was the Marshall V-LCD84SB-AFHD unit. It's pricey but gives a lot of bang for the buck for full on sunlight uses.
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Old October 6th, 2009, 03:59 PM   #262
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Regarding the reflective surface of the DP1--very simple fix, a diagonal sunshade. I checked Hoodman's site and am shocked that they don't offer these for smaller LCD panels, very strange (old-style for CRT monitors here. You can easily mock one up for your monitors with cardboard (make sure it is matte black on the inside) and see how you like it. The steeper the diagonal angle, the shorter the "tunnel" but the more severe the viewing angle which is not great for LCD's, so it requires some experimenting. For those who haven't used a diagonal shade, the idea is that the front panel is reflecting the black surface of the bottom panel of the shade plus the ambient light is reduced, which delivers a really clean image.

Enzo:

I bought my PRO back in '97 with the PROII monitor; about a year later the XCS TB6 was introduced and I saw for myself that the image, while mathematically not as bright, showed better contrast in daylight and was thus more viewable. I also liked many of the extra functions on that monitor including zoom and squeeze, and that it was a 16:9 display (way ahead of its time!) While the case is roughly the same size (turned sideways), the image size is generally much larger because of the aspect ration and zoom functions. With 2:35 framing, it's close to twice as large.

I actually have a Flyer monitor on my "Nimblecam" lightweight rig that I put together, it's obviously not a high brightness display (and is SD) but the anti-reflective coatings are good enough that I find it delivers enough image to be able to frame by under most conditions. Eventually I hope to replace it with an HD daylight viewable version.
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Old October 6th, 2009, 09:07 PM   #263
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Charles Papert View Post
Enzo:

I bought my PRO back in '97 with the PROII monitor; about a year later the XCS TB6 was introduced and I saw for myself that the image, while mathematically not as bright, showed better contrast in daylight and was thus more viewable. I also liked many of the extra functions on that monitor including zoom and squeeze, and that it was a 16:9 display (way ahead of its time!) While the case is roughly the same size (turned sideways), the image size is generally much larger because of the aspect ration and zoom functions. With 2:35 framing, it's close to twice as large.

I actually have a Flyer monitor on my "Nimblecam" lightweight rig that I put together, it's obviously not a high brightness display (and is SD) but the anti-reflective coatings are good enough that I find it delivers enough image to be able to frame by under most conditions. Eventually I hope to replace it with an HD daylight viewable version.
Charles,

LOVE the "Nimblecam".

Although the Pro II rig is what works best for me most of the time (I got it in '03, I used an Ultra before that), I am always looking for a lighter version (overall) for the newer dinky HD cams (I sometimes use a modified SK rig for those cams).

I tried a modified Flyer with the Marshall V-LCD84SB, worked pretty well, but I did not much like the gimble set-up on the Flyer (but the V-LCD84SB monitor was great in bright exterior situations). I have also tried adapting a ton of SK P43 monitors (because they can be had on the cheap) on other small rigs, but it's a pretty dinky unit with not so good contrast for bright situations, but it does get the job done. I tap into the camera's VF feed to pick up the cam generated frame lines (and info set if I need it). So I well understand the "Nimblecam"!

I have actually used the TB6, it's a nice unit with a great control layout. My Pro II monitor was modified (before I got it) by NY so it's 16:9 / 4:3 switchable (I can then generate 2:35:1 frames off of that). But on your recommendation, I will take another look at the TB6, so thanks for the heads up!

'97, I imagine that was not the first flyer you had, but I still have a few years on you :)
The Steadicam - Enzo Giobbe (I was actually two years old in that photo, I just looked mature for my age, honest).
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Old October 6th, 2009, 09:23 PM   #264
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Haha Enzo, you did indeed have a few years on me--I flew for the first time in '83, took the workshop in '85, and bought a battered Model 1 in '89 (for the princely sum of $6K! it was with the non-adjustable 16mm arm though--my old school pix [url=http://web.mac.com/chupap/Archive/Home.html]here]/url]). Flew plenty of BL's in the 90's. Sadly the "heavycam" days are back with us in the form of Genesis/F35's with onboard decks--ridiculous combo.

As I mentioned earlier, the Nebtek Solar 7-SC monitor is going to be the hot one to keep an eye on; otherwise Transvideo is making a beautiful Steadicam-appropriate unit (quite a bit more money though).
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Old October 6th, 2009, 10:48 PM   #265
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Charles Papert View Post
Haha Enzo, you did indeed have a few years on me--I flew for the first time in '83, took the workshop in '85, and bought a battered Model 1 in '89 (for the princely sum of $6K! it was with the non-adjustable 16mm arm though--my old school pix [url=http://web.mac.com/chupap/Archive/Home.html]here]/url]). Flew plenty of BL's in the 90's. Sadly the "heavycam" days are back with us in the form of Genesis/F35's with onboard decks--ridiculous combo.

As I mentioned earlier, the Nebtek Solar 7-SC monitor is going to be the hot one to keep an eye on; otherwise Transvideo is making a beautiful Steadicam-appropriate unit (quite a bit more money though).
Wow, a Model 1 at 1/10 the original price:) Damn, that's a hard way to get into flying a rig. I would have assumed that by '89 all the Model 1's had been long gone. Working with that 16 arm must have been a real pain. Setting up the Model 1 correctly was not easy, and not having an adjustable arm must have made it treacherous.

There were no workshops in '77. Everything to do with the Steadicam was strictly OJT. I went down to CP when they had the first few built and asked Ed if I could borrow one for a day. He had made up a special long VF extension for me to use with my Elclair NPR and Cine 60 gear head, then asked if he could use the design for his 16CP 16mm units, so we had a bit of history at that point.

His comment to me was that Garrett was 6'3" - 6'4" and a lefty, I was 6'1" and right handed, and Garrett had pretty much designed the rig for himself.

But he let me have it anyway (actually for a few more times after that). From my experience in racing Group II autos I knew that it's best not to fight the equipment, and once I learned how the rig wanted to be handled, it was pretty much a done deal.

A few weeks later Harvey (from Cinemobile) called me and said they had a show that wanted to use a Steadicam, and if they purchased one, would I operate? Right place, right time, kind of thing. BTW, Cinemobile purchased a Model 2 as well (when it became available). It's major claim to fame (other than a few hardware tweaks) was a rotatable monitor!

Yes, boo on heavycams! the Pro II handles the Genesis and F35 pretty well, and the focus puller has the pleasure of strapping on the outboard and all those Dionic 90's, but we have now gone full circle and are tethered to each other again.

In case there are any focus AC's on this board that I might work with in the future, I LOVE focus pullers, they are the greatest people on earth! (side note: we "flyers" live or die on the skill of our "puller" ;)

Charles, I will take a look at the Nebtek Solar 7-SC as well. Again, thanks for sharing your considerable experiences and knowledge.
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Old October 7th, 2009, 11:05 AM   #266
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Andrew,


I did everything right except set the new setting with the second button, DAh!!



thanks.
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Old October 8th, 2009, 12:42 AM   #267
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Originally Posted by Dale Guthormsen View Post
Andrew,


I did everything right except set the new setting with the second button, DAh!!



thanks.
glad you got it figured out :)
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Old November 5th, 2009, 09:29 AM   #268
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Hey all, just ordered the DP1 today and I'm curious what sort of mounting options I have with the JVC HD110u? I'd love to be able to mount it on top of the camera of course, but I'd also like to know if there's some sort of arm that could attach to the tripod and give me an additional mounting option.
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Old November 5th, 2009, 03:57 PM   #269
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mounting options

there's been a few threads discussing this, but here's what works for me:

I have a manfrotto quick release that i mount to my tripod head. Manfrotto by Bogen Imaging | 357 Pro Quick Release Adapter | 357

On the side of the QR base are some threaded holes for storing extra camera screws. Instead of a camera screw, i screw in a noga arm: Noga | DG14CA-SA Cinematic Arm with Hot Shoe | DG14CA-SA | B&H

Then, on top of the noga i have mounted a giottos mini ball head: Giottos | MH1004 Mini Ball Head | MH1004-320 | B&H Photo Video

You'll pay a couple hundred for this setup, but its simply magic. The arm is long enough to mount the monitor wherever you'd want it around the camera, but its compact and out of the way. You dont put any stress on the camera (especially not the dicey hot shoe).

The ball head is a little redundant to the function of the arm, but i've found that often i want to make a minor adjustment to the angle of the screen without wanting the entire assembly to go floppy. Plus, with the ball head, i find it easier/safer to mount the screen to an already mounted arm.

Adding a lock washer between the noga and the QR protects you from accidently unscrewing the arm from the QR plate. (just a FYI).

One DP i film with really wanted the monitor on the cam when he did some jungly handheld stuff. I messed around with the hot shoe adapter from noga (i hate their shoe adapter) and was never happy with a setup. Finally i just removed the QR base from the tripod and let it travel with the camera- noga attached. Worked an absolute treat. A minor addition of weight, but at the bottom of the camera and without any of the "floppiness" you can often get from a jiggly shoe mount.

Thems my opinions anyways. Gotta be cheaper solutions out there, but i found this one to be my fave. No stress on the camera, and while on the tripod the monitor moves with the camera like you'd expect. Also, you can quickly and easily detach the cam from the tripod either leaving the monitor behind (release the QR plate) or take the monitor with you (release the tripod plate).

Here's a pic of the noga and smallhd to see what i'm talking about. (this rig happened to already have a manfrotto QR on it, so i just used it.
http://www.dvinfo.net/forum/attachme...1&d=1257458068

found a few more pix i had previously uploaded:
http://www.dvinfo.net/forum/attachme...s-monitor1.jpg

http://www.dvinfo.net/forum/attachme...s-monitor2.jpg
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Last edited by Andrew Dean; November 5th, 2009 at 05:06 PM.
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Old November 10th, 2009, 01:20 PM   #270
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Got the DP1 package and I'm really excited about it! I can't believe what a great deal it is, 2 batteries, sun shade and the cables for less than $1000. Here are a few pics of my setup with the DP1.

Flickr: Evan Agee's stuff tagged with dp1
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