Need reccomendations for new pc for hdv

Bruce S. Yarock · March 3rd, 2007, 02:20 AM

Update and continued problem-
We setteled on a Dell XPS model, but are still having a problem with the multicam function. Our first real hdv project is a 50 minute, 3 camera concert.
The Dell is a duo 2.4 ghz with 4 gigs of ram, a raid 0 comprised of 2 165 gig drives and a 250 gig c drive. The card is an nvidia gforce 7900, and we're using a gateway 1080p monitor.
We loaded PPro, Encore and Cineform and nothing else. Then we transfered the entire concert project to the new Dell. After some rendering, we opened the project, and the edited section plays smooth and flawlessly. But when we opened up the multi cam function (one with only 2 cameras), the playback was not smooth and in real time. It was a lot better than my old Pc, but seemed to be playing slightly in slo mo (although the audio was fine).After spending $2900 on a new PC, (not including monitor), I was pretty bummed out. The obvious problem with the slow multicam function will be trying to cut video to rythmic audio.
We plan to call Adobe today, and then Dell. Maybe we need a more powerfull chip, or a dual chip set up...I don't know. Marty mentioned having different cameras on different drives, but I have no idea if that would solve the problem, or even how to do that.
Has anyone else experienced the same problem? Is anyone doing multi cam succesfully with PPro? If so, what do we need to make this work.
Thanks
Bruce S. yarock
www.yarock.com

Dan Keaton · March 3rd, 2007, 04:48 AM

How are the drives attached to the computer? I assume that all three drives are SATA drives and each has its own SATA port on the motherboard.

Are they SATA-II drives?

Have you checked if the drives needed defragmenting?

If you wanted to run a test:

1. Defrag all drives, including the c: drive.
2. Run your multi-cam software test.
3. Move the footage for one camera to your c: drive.
4. Defrag the c: drive.
5. Run your multi-cam software test.

You may have problems geting two steams of Cineform HD footage off of one Raid 0 drive setup fast enough to do the multi-cam in real time.

By spliting the footage from one camera to another drive, you may solve your problem. If this works, then you could consider getting another drive for your computer. I recommend the Seagate 500gb or 750gb drives, but they may have come out with some larger ones by now.

Bruce S. Yarock · March 3rd, 2007, 06:32 AM

Dan,
The drives are all sata ii and are connected correctly. I haven't had a chance to try the defrag thing, but remember that this is a new system, with only one project and no other software on it.
We will try to move one of the camera streams to the c drive in one of the sequences where we have only two cameras, and see if that works.Hopefully someone here has experienced this same problem and has found a solution.
Bruce S. Yarock
www.yarock.com

Dan Keaton · March 3rd, 2007, 08:46 AM

Dear Bruce,

Yes, I feel that there is low risk that your 2 drive Raid 0 disks are fragmented. And as such, the drive fragmentation should not affect your multicam software performance.

The fragmentation of Drive C: is generally not an issue once your software is loaded and operating. Note that I said generally. In many cases, your software may load files from Drive C: when you are operating the software, and if these files are fragmented, it will affect your performance.

Also, if any of your directories are fragmented, it will affect you overall system performance.

While It may not help (until you move some of your footage to Drive C:), I do suggest that you defragment Drive C:.

It is most likely that you C: drive is fragmented.

It was probably fragmented when you purchased it. And it should have gotten more fragmented when you installed software on it.

In my opinion, Dell does not defragment their systems before they leave the factory. The process of loading software on any drive usually causes it to be fragmented.

It takes less than 2 minutes to analyze a disk to determine if it is fragmented.

With Windows XP (I do not know what to do in Windows Vista):

Start|All Programs|Accessories|System Tools|Disk Defragmenter then click on the drive you wish to defragment, then click on Analyze.

The Disk Defragmenter in Windows XP is not really very good. While it attempts to defrag most files, it leaves many small gaps between the files. These immediately fill up and cause files that you load in the future to be immediately fragmented.

A better defreagmenter for our purposes (editing video) would move all of the files to one end of the disk, leaving (if possible) one continuous open space.

If you look at the results of any Windows XP defrag, you will find files all over the disk, with many gaps in-between.

I wonder if Windows Vista's defragmenter is any better.

There are better disk defragmenters available and they do not cost very much.

Kevin Shaw · March 3rd, 2007, 09:51 AM

For what it's worth, you might try giving the Edius Pro 4 demo a try and see if the multicam performance in that software is better than the Premiere Pro solution.

Steven Gotz · March 3rd, 2007, 10:29 AM

Try this benchmark program: http://mysite.verizon.net/wgehrke/ppbm/

It will let you know if you measure up against other similar PCs, or if you have an undetected bottleneck.

March 3rd, 2007, 04:48 AM	#17
Dan Keaton Inner Circle Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Augusta Georgia Posts: 5,421	How are the drives attached to the computer? I assume that all three drives are SATA drives and each has its own SATA port on the motherboard. Are they SATA-II drives? Have you checked if the drives needed defragmenting? If you wanted to run a test: 1. Defrag all drives, including the c: drive. 2. Run your multi-cam software test. 3. Move the footage for one camera to your c: drive. 4. Defrag the c: drive. 5. Run your multi-cam software test. You may have problems geting two steams of Cineform HD footage off of one Raid 0 drive setup fast enough to do the multi-cam in real time. By spliting the footage from one camera to another drive, you may solve your problem. If this works, then you could consider getting another drive for your computer. I recommend the Seagate 500gb or 750gb drives, but they may have come out with some larger ones by now. __________________ Dan Keaton Augusta Georgia

March 3rd, 2007, 08:46 AM	#19
Dan Keaton Inner Circle Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Augusta Georgia Posts: 5,421	Dear Bruce, Yes, I feel that there is low risk that your 2 drive Raid 0 disks are fragmented. And as such, the drive fragmentation should not affect your multicam software performance. The fragmentation of Drive C: is generally not an issue once your software is loaded and operating. Note that I said generally. In many cases, your software may load files from Drive C: when you are operating the software, and if these files are fragmented, it will affect your performance. Also, if any of your directories are fragmented, it will affect you overall system performance. While It may not help (until you move some of your footage to Drive C:), I do suggest that you defragment Drive C:. It is most likely that you C: drive is fragmented. It was probably fragmented when you purchased it. And it should have gotten more fragmented when you installed software on it. In my opinion, Dell does not defragment their systems before they leave the factory. The process of loading software on any drive usually causes it to be fragmented. It takes less than 2 minutes to analyze a disk to determine if it is fragmented. With Windows XP (I do not know what to do in Windows Vista): Start\|All Programs\|Accessories\|System Tools\|Disk Defragmenter then click on the drive you wish to defragment, then click on Analyze. The Disk Defragmenter in Windows XP is not really very good. While it attempts to defrag most files, it leaves many small gaps between the files. These immediately fill up and cause files that you load in the future to be immediately fragmented. A better defreagmenter for our purposes (editing video) would move all of the files to one end of the disk, leaving (if possible) one continuous open space. If you look at the results of any Windows XP defrag, you will find files all over the disk, with many gaps in-between. I wonder if Windows Vista's defragmenter is any better. There are better disk defragmenters available and they do not cost very much. __________________ Dan Keaton Augusta Georgia

March 3rd, 2007, 10:29 AM	#21
Steven Gotz Trustee Join Date: May 2002 Location: Clermont, FL Posts: 1,520	Try this benchmark program: http://mysite.verizon.net/wgehrke/ppbm/ It will let you know if you measure up against other similar PCs, or if you have an undetected bottleneck. __________________ Steven Gotz http://www.stevengotz.com

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March 3rd, 2007, 02:20 AM	#16
Bruce S. Yarock Trustee Join Date: May 2004 Location: Pembroke Pines, Fl. Posts: 1,842	Update and continued problem- We setteled on a Dell XPS model, but are still having a problem with the multicam function. Our first real hdv project is a 50 minute, 3 camera concert. The Dell is a duo 2.4 ghz with 4 gigs of ram, a raid 0 comprised of 2 165 gig drives and a 250 gig c drive. The card is an nvidia gforce 7900, and we're using a gateway 1080p monitor. We loaded PPro, Encore and Cineform and nothing else. Then we transfered the entire concert project to the new Dell. After some rendering, we opened the project, and the edited section plays smooth and flawlessly. But when we opened up the multi cam function (one with only 2 cameras), the playback was not smooth and in real time. It was a lot better than my old Pc, but seemed to be playing slightly in slo mo (although the audio was fine).After spending $2900 on a new PC, (not including monitor), I was pretty bummed out. The obvious problem with the slow multicam function will be trying to cut video to rythmic audio. We plan to call Adobe today, and then Dell. Maybe we need a more powerfull chip, or a dual chip set up...I don't know. Marty mentioned having different cameras on different drives, but I have no idea if that would solve the problem, or even how to do that. Has anyone else experienced the same problem? Is anyone doing multi cam succesfully with PPro? If so, what do we need to make this work. Thanks Bruce S. yarock www.yarock.com

March 3rd, 2007, 06:32 AM	#18
Bruce S. Yarock Trustee Join Date: May 2004 Location: Pembroke Pines, Fl. Posts: 1,842	Dan, The drives are all sata ii and are connected correctly. I haven't had a chance to try the defrag thing, but remember that this is a new system, with only one project and no other software on it. We will try to move one of the camera streams to the c drive in one of the sequences where we have only two cameras, and see if that works.Hopefully someone here has experienced this same problem and has found a solution. Bruce S. Yarock www.yarock.com

March 3rd, 2007, 09:51 AM	#20
Kevin Shaw Inner Circle Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Sacramento, CA Posts: 2,488	For what it's worth, you might try giving the Edius Pro 4 demo a try and see if the multicam performance in that software is better than the Premiere Pro solution.