Many have written that you can lock the exposure after setting it, but you don't have specific control over the settings. With lenses that have an aperture ring, you can manually lock the aperture, but then how is shutter speed controlled? These video modes will improve in the future.

I thought I read that the shutter is locked at 1/60 or 1/125. So setting exposure would entail using a combination of ISO and Aperture. If you want shallower depth of field in bright conditions, you'd want to use ND filters. Note though, I'm just guessing.

have you seen Michael's video yet?

It looks great, such a shallow DOF and nice colours. Only one thing, on some takes, where there's a variation in the whole frame's light balance, as something moves in, or like when the train lights come in, what looks like AE turns the picture lighter or darker.

as for the literature, looks like you can lock exposure before shooting, maybe Michael didnt know?


btw, excuse to ask it again,but didnt get any answers. Does Shake do good 30p to 25p conversions?

Vincent Laforet's short film he shot with a preproduction camera is up, quarter-rezed:

Canon Digital Learning Center - Sample Video: EOS 5D Mark II (http://www.usa.canon.com/dlc/controller?act=GetArticleAct&articleID=2086)

I think it looks pretty good... smugmug's supposed to be hosting a 720p and full 1080p version at some point.

http://blog.vincentlaforet.com/2008/09/22/without-further-ado-reverie/

Wow the depth of field, bokeh, and low light IQ look fantastic. Is that CMOS wobble in the helicopter scenes or just helicopter wobble?

Pat

Sounds like a very interesting cam. I cannot wait to check it out. However its primary reason for being is as a class-leading still photo device, I would buy one for its stills abilities alone. I do a fair amount of stills work as well. This 5D MkII may be a real boon to those shooting corporate/industrials, as well as photo journalists. I'd love to pick one up. I think it's ultimately going to lead the way in defining a product category, and will set a higher standard for all forthcoming pro-level DSLR's.
SW

. I don't see people setting down their XL H1 for a 5DII. For them it's more of a demo of the core imaging ability in future products.

I don't agree. It's not a matter of setting them down...more a matter of getting something that you can't get from any 3 CDD camera. The 5DII can produce a look in and of itself that an H1 can't without a quality 35 mm adapter. And beyond the inherent DOF and FOV, there's the latitude, and ISO advantages which are significant.

Compare the size and weight of a 5DII and an XL-H1 with a P&S adapter on the front.

Size, Weight, true 35mm DOF and FOV, latitude, low light, 1080p recorded to a CF card.

I can see a lot of reasons to use this as a dedicated filming tool for any number of practical and aesthetic reasons.

If the IQ ultimately delivers.

Footage looks amazing. Really. I am blown away. I don't see myself buying an EOS 5D Mark II. I will be waiting till NAB to see what products the competition will announce and see where the market is going. But I think within a year I will be shooting with 35mm photography glass in front of my camera. What a nice world we live in.

Looks like the Heli shots were gyro stabilized (credits), but I didn't see any significant rolling shutter - maybe just a touch in the tunnel and in the scan down the tall building from the heli... but overall an amazing camera - a sign of things to come.

Perhaps the disciplines will merge sooner than anyone expected... interesting developments!

When I go storm chasing I have always had to make a choice, shoot video or shoot stills. There just isn't time to mess about with multiple cameras. having seen the quality of the video from the 5D it could be that this may be the camera for me. I will be watching this one very carefully. One small issue will be that stills lenses don't track focus as accurately as a video lens when you zoom so mid shot zooms may go out of focus. I think getting focus right will be difficult with the small rear LCD so shooting anything that is comming towards or going away from you will be tricky.

Vincent Laforet's short film he shot with a preproduction camera is up, quarter-rezed:

Canon Digital Learning Center - Sample Video: EOS 5D Mark II (http://www.usa.canon.com/dlc/controller?act=GetArticleAct&articleID=2086)

I think it looks pretty good... smugmug's supposed to be hosting a 720p and full 1080p version at some point.

Without further ado: Reverie Vincent Laforet’s Blog (http://blog.vincentlaforet.com/2008/09/22/without-further-ado-reverie/)

Wow. The low light performance is amazing. The Heli shot of the skyline just floored me. As an amateur videographer (with some extra cash to spend on toys ;)) my biggest disappointment with the HD camcorder revolution is low light performance. This seems to be a quantum leap forward (yes, not incremental) in low light performance for both retail cams and Prosumer cams as well.

I was also impressed with the wide angle shots with the camara mounted on the vehicle. You can see some bouncing around of the camara but overall not too bad. OIS based camcorders cannot give you that smooth of a shot on a auto mount in my experience. Could that be due to sensor size, I wonder?

Looks like a new purchase is in my future. . .

if you look as his lenses used you will see that there is about $20,000 of lenses there....

"
EF Lenses used in the making of REVERIE:
FD 7.5mm f/5.6 (converted to EF mount)
EF 16-35mm f/2.8L II USM
EF 24-70mm f/2.8L USM
EF 50mm f/1.2L USM
EF 85mm f/1.2L II USM
EF 135mm f/2L USM
EF 200mm f/1.8L USM
EF 400mm f/2.8L IS USM
EF 500mm f/4L IS USM
TS-E 24mm f/3.5L
TS-E 45mm f/2.8
"

Expect to get caught up in the lens addiction with this thing.... I know when I upped to the 1ds3, I had to replace most of my glass with "L" glass to catch up to the 21MP.

Maybe at 1080 rez it won't matter so much.... ?? but fast glass ain't cheap.

Rick, sensor size alone doesn't affect image stability one way or the other, but huge files can presumably be smoothed with something like Mercalli with less evidence that they've been tampered with in post.

Forgive me if this has been answered - but what do we know about the 12 minutes?

From what I read on Luminous landscape, I believe the review said it just stopped at 12 minutes and he wasnt sure if it was sensor heat or not.

My question would be is it due to simply filling up the card?
Can you keep slapping those cards in there to keep recording?
Or is there a break in which the camera needs to rest after each 12 minute cycle.

That is one of my main questions about the camera...along with what does this mean for camera life? It has 150k shutter life...but if you use the video...how long will it go till it has had enough? Anyone find info from Canon on this somewhere?

The one thing that is disappointing is that it doesnt have the 100% bright viewfinder that you find on the A900. Canon went from 96-98% on the 5D. Why not just give that 2% extra I dont know. (With the exception of there is not much separating this from their 1ds camera)

Peace

dAlen

Here is the link for the BEHIND THE SCENES VIDEO of REVERIE by Vincent LaForet
from both Canon XH A1 camcorder - and a few clips for the Canon EOS 5D MKII

Behind The Scenes Video Vincent Laforet’s Blog (http://blog.vincentlaforet.com/2008/09/23/behind-the-scenes-video/)

the shutter is up and out of the way during vid mode.... so would only count as 1 click per clip?

the overheating issue is a concern of mine as well.... even if the cam only shoots a few mins to a card, but can output vid live thru hdmi... will it overheat and through an error and need a break? I see no mention of fans, fins, or whatever other cooling methods that other cams ( red, sony ex ) require.

I need another backup cam to my 1ds3 anyways... so I'll find out as soon as I get one of these 5d2's.

Disagree that a wide assortment of glass would be needed. The Canon EF 24-105mm f/4L IS USM, Canon EF 70-200mm f/2.8L IS USM and 2x canon extender would be a pretty decent kit. This is top of the line L-glass that could be had new for around $3K.

One other thing.
On Luminous landscape it mentioned that the 5DII would do over 47bits.
It seems on dpreview it was said it would do 35bits.

35bits is better than hdv's 25bit for sure.
going over 47 should give you good footage for choma key.

It could be they are both right...
Maybe it is that the camera can do 47bits, but the cards are at 35bits?

Anyone got any info/input in regards to this?
That would be great to have some 50bit footage that is good for pulling a good key.

Peace

dAlen

p.s.
And again, that heating bit...wonder if that is what was really going on at the end of 12 minutes and if so what the time frame is before you can start shooting again.

My only issue with the heating issue, is that if you use this thing regularly and push it in terms of video...maybe you risk burning out the processor. Question is how robust this will be for heavy use.

Also, Im being optimistic saying this, if its not a heating issue and just a limit in the recording media...then as media goes higher you can record longer. (Just saw the new 100gb cards at dpreview. Its 35bits per second though...so you wouldnt get close to the 50bit for pulling chroma key...at least not with those cards.)

Everything is still a mystery, so I could be wrong. However, I do believe the 12 minutes at one time recording is probably due to the fact that files can be no bigger than 4GB on a FAT32 formatted drive. Somebody have a calculator? Mine says that could be the case if the video is around 40 mbps.

I'm sure Vincent probably shot pretty heavily with it, I'm assuming he would have reported any heat issues.

record time due to taxes

CCDs overheat, CMOS not like that, you could rec for much longer.

The limit in record time is to avoid be considered a "video recorder", and therefore another kind of taxes (at least in the EU) will be applied to it. the same happens to many other devices.

Disagree that a wide assortment of glass would be needed. The Canon EF 24-105mm f/4L IS USM, Canon EF 70-200mm f/2.8L IS USM and 2x canon extender would be a pretty decent kit. This is top of the line L-glass that could be had new for around $3K.

if one is going for shallow depth of field ( why else use this camera ) then f4 ain't gonna cut it.

The cream of the crop from canon for SDOF are...200 f1.8, 100 f2, 85 f1.2, 50 f1.2 & f1.4, 35 f1.4, 24 f1.4

with the exception of the 50 1,4.... all over $1G

Now what I would like to see for 5D Mark II is this:

A handle that is attached to the tripod socket, then extends upwards so you get a grip just above the flash mount..... and the handle should then be extendable forward ...
in order to get it balanced in relation to the lens you use....

Then, this is mandatory... I want to be able to attach an exernal display, on that handle which are to be connected to the HDMI port... (is this possible at all (anyone)?, and hopefully it should then be possible to turn off the built in display in order to save some power.... and if possible/needed maybe an external display running on its own batteries....

Then at last I would like some optional mic clamps on either side of the handle as well as an optional socket for an XLR-BP professional box (or similar) on the handle.....

Could someone here please make a render of such handle and send it ASAP to Canon.
Or eventually just make it ...

How do you use this puppy in video mode while running/walking or standing still and holding it away from your eyes (above/below/left/right) anyway?

Or is Canon soon to release the 5Dfdh Mark II where the f stands for flippable display with a handle?

I'm just shocked at how the 5DII looks when cut inro the Laforet XH A1 footage. (I'm looking at 720p, don't see the 1080p.) I would expect to be more shocked at 1080p.

record time due to taxes... The limit in record time is to avoid be considered a "video recorder", and therefore another kind of taxes (at least in the EU) will be applied to it.Sorry but that's incorrect, as demonstrated here: http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/929807-post172.html (from our Nikon D90 discussion thread (http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/digital-video-industry-news/128802-nikon-d90-has-720p24-over-hdmi.html)). The referenced CNEN tax limit applies to devices which record 30 minute clips or more, and this is not the case with the Canon 5D Mk. II or the Nikon D90.

if you look as his lenses used you will see that there is about $20,000 of lenses there....Wow, yeah. LOL! I don't think my discretionary spending goes this high!

As already alluded to - Maybe not all this glass is needed for sufficiently good results. For my reasons, the Low Light performance in 1080p is my only interest (plus having a much better SLR than the Rebel XTi I have now) and maybe shallow DOF for specific scenarios (I am no budding filmmaker). I already have the 50mm/f1.2 Canon lens. Yeah it's a cheap lens (and I am sure the lens itch will hit after I get this - LOL) but with an unsubstantiated opinion based on what I have seen up to this point, I'm feeling like this lens + the MKII will outperform any Prosumer and lower HDCam on the market today. Again, this is using the low light performance criteria only!

I wonder how well it could capture something like fireworks? I never see fireworks on video look any decent at all except for the Pro cams for television shows. For example the 4th celebration in Washington DC on PBS.

Exciting stuff . . .

Sorry but that's incorrect, as demonstrated here: http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/929807-post172.html (from our Nikon D90 discussion thread (http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/digital-video-industry-news/128802-nikon-d90-has-720p24-over-hdmi.html)). The referenced CNEN tax limit applies to devices which record 30 minute clips or more, and this is not the case with the Canon 5D Mk. II or the Nikon D90.

So taxes on video cameras are different than on still cameras?
I was hoping to keep this simple for my little mind. lol

As far as I understood it, in Hungary (EU) all electronics here are 20% tax.
Have no clue if there are different additional things (fees)...nor how to find out. (Wrote the Hungarians who are supposed to know and never heard back.)

I have considered buying quite a few things through B&H photo, as the price, by the time you pay for the tax and the mark up (especially the mark up) in the Hungarian stores...it is much cheaper to get it from them, even with the 20% tax.

The only thing I know you cant get is the Nikon from them overseas because of NIkons rules. Canon, warranty...who cares, with the mark up here it would still be cheaper to get it there and fix it here if needed.

Anyway...havent made any purchases from B&H yet...still sorting through what it is I actually need to buy.
But...if anyone from Hungary...(or other E.U. states) have ordered video/camera equipment through B&H, would love to know how it went. - I know there a good store...just more concerned about how things are treated as it crosse the border.

Peace

dAlen

CCDs overheat, CMOS not like that, you could rec for much longer.I wonder how limited, or unlimited it is if you hook it up to a computer with the HDMI chord and record that way. (not saying that is optimal...just curious.) Guess one thing is that macs dont have HDMI...and you would need probably a G raid system for that. (but then again its already compressed video coming out...)

Peace

dAlen

I am sure you could hook up a HDMI cord to the camera and shoot your video direct to a computer, but doesn't that defeat the object of having a small portable camera?

Regarding taxes, the extra tax for full video capability would be an extra 13%. I am sure that most pros wouldn't mind paying this. The 4GB limitation for windows is a small factor, however that is not the true reason for the 12 minute limitation or 5 minutes for the D90.

I am sure you could hook up a HDMI cord to the camera and shoot your video direct to a computer, but doesn't that defeat the object of having a small portable camera?

I don't even think we know if this is possible yet. A "live" feed coming out of the HDMI port while recording is yet to be confirmed. It would definitely be nice though!!!

I am sure you could hook up a HDMI cord to the camera and shoot your video direct to a computer, but doesn't that defeat the object of having a small portable camera?

Regarding taxes, the extra tax for full video capability would be an extra 13%. I am sure that most pros wouldn't mind paying this. The 4GB limitation for windows is a smnall factor, however that is not the true reason for the 12 minute limitation or 5 minutes for the D90.

Just to make sure I understand you correctly.
I would pay Hungarys 20% electronic tax and then the E.U.s 13% video tax?
Whoo thats getting up there. :)

But its good to know. Maybe a plane ticket to the states is cheaper... :)

Peace

dAlen

Sandisk released 45bit cards today it appears. (16gb and 32gb.)
This sounds good.

If what Michael said at Luminous Landscape is true, that this camera can do over 47bits...then this is a bit of a step up from HDVs 25bit. (and better than the initial 35bit that I saw at dpreview...suppose based on cards that were already out.)

The main issue will be the editing of compressed material.
Not lossless...have read some peoples concern about this as well.

Would love to see full HD footage from this camera side by side with something that uses an uncompressed workflow and then is compressed. (Dont have the equipment to view such a test...but would be cool to hear what other experience.) Main point is how acceptable this will be for paid work. ;)

peace

dAlen

edit: seems its only the 16gb card that is 45bits.
Oh well...wonder how long that will last. :)

It seems that the 32gb card is being advertised for the new canon 5DII.
Says it can store an hour and half of full HD video. Now that is cool. Does this mean the time is up now from 12 minutes to an hour and half...or will there be a pause and heat issue.

edit: seems its only the 16gb card that is 45bits.
Oh well...wonder how long that will last. :)

these are 45 MegaBYTES per second - the 5DmII video is somewhere in the range of 35-35 MegaBITS per second, which is only about 4.5-5.5 megabytes/second. Even sandisk's Ultra II line has write speeds that are close to twice what the 5DmII needs.

The cream of the crop from canon for SDOF are...200 f1.8, 100 f2, 85 f1.2, 50 f1.2 & f1.4, 35 f1.4, 24 f1.4

with the exception of the 50 1,4.... all over $1G

The 100/2 is $350, not over a grand.

And you don't need $20,000 in lens. The 35/2 is $200. The 50/1.4 is $300. And the 85/1.8 is $350. All great lenses that are close to the L primes in quality and as good or better than the L zooms.

Camcorders: Red Scarlet Cam Replaced With a "New Vision" (http://gizmodo.com/5053579/red-scarlet-cam-replaced-with-a-new-vision)

Hi Nathaniel, Scarlet isn't being replaced; it's being redesigned. At any rate we already have a dedicated discussion thread for that topic -- please refer to http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/red-digital-cinema/133906-scarlet-changing.html for anything related to Scarlet's redesign in order to keep this 5D Mk. II discussion thread on topic. Thanks in advance,

The 100/2 is $350, not over a grand.

And you don't need $20,000 in lens. The 35/2 is $200. The 50/1.4 is $300. And the 85/1.8 is $350. All great lenses that are close to the L primes in quality and as good or better than the L zooms.

sorry... I meant the 135 f2.....

I got rid of my 50 1.4 ( my copy was crap ), and 85 1.8 as I did not think they were as good as my 50 1.2 and 85 1.2..... never had a 35 f2... but my 35 1.4 is fantastic.

And the video has been released....

Canon Digital Learning Center - Sample Video: EOS 5D Mark II (http://www.usa.canon.com/dlc/controller?act=GetArticleAct&articleID=2086)

Aaron, that link has already been posted:

http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/941285-post153.html

See our guidelines for posting links to this thread:

http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/940489-post107.html

Even though there's only 30P option for frame rates, I can't help but find myself extremely giddy with this new camera. I desparately want one now. Not for filmmaking or narrative work. But I love take photojournal vacations. And I usually want a still camera and an HD camera. Problem with HD cameras is that the one's I want to use are usually too big to lug around on a vacation. And the "toy" HD cameras just to have the robustness I want.

The 5D MarkII is exactly what I wanted. A bitchin' still camera with a bitchin' HD video feature.

But that's not what I'm giddy about. I'm giddy because I think this ties into what I was talking about in another thread. I think there a several hints at what Canon may be proposing for future HD cameras (a possible XL replacement). Well, at least I hope it's providing hints. Also, I think Canon keeping the camera locked into 30P with no other frame rate options is a testament to that theory...save 24P for something coming at NAB.

Oh, pretty please, pretty please!!!!

these are 45 MegaBYTES per second - the 5DmII video is somewhere in the range of 35-35 MegaBITS per second, which is only about 4.5-5.5 megabytes/second. Even sandisk's Ultra II line has write speeds that are close to twice what the 5DmII needs.

I dont get it...Michael at Luminous landscape said it was over 47 (the 5DII).
Dpreview said 35.

So between the two numbers thats how I came up with my theory...but now there is the bytes vs. bits. (Im confused now.)

Anyway... :)

Peace

dAlen

I dont get it...Michael at Luminous landscape said it was over 47 (the 5DII).
Dpreview said 35.

So between the two numbers thats how I came up with my theory...but now there is the bytes vs. bits. (Im confused now.)

there are 8 bits in a byte. as far as I know, a bit is the singular data unit (one 1 or 0) but that is just too impractical for many applications in todays computing world so we often use Bytes. most storage companies use bytes while the video world uses bits because it makes their stuff look more impressive. their marketing guys are hoping that you dont know the difference between Mb and MB.

........... as far as I know, a bit is the singular data unit (one 1 or 0) but that is just too impractical for many applications in todays computing world so we often use Bytes. most storage companies use bytes while the video world uses bits because it makes their stuff look more impressive.
OK, a bit is indeed a 1 or 0, a single "bit" of data.

A byte is normally taken as 8 bits, so can have any of 2 to the power 8 values (256). Typically, a byte may represent a single character of text (letters, capitals, numbers, symbols etc) or the level of a video single. (One byte for luminace, another two for colour.)

Take each a million at a time (actually 1028x1028) and you get Megabits (Mb) and Megabytes (MB) - note the significance of whether it's a capital or small "B".

Those relate to capacity, when we talk of speed there are Megabits/second (Mbs) and Megabytes/second (MBs), and obviously one 1MBs will be eight times as fast as 1Mbs.

Very often, capacity is more normally spoken of in terms of MB (MegaBYTES), whilst speed is more normally referred to in terms of Mbs (MegaBITS/second), and there are valid reasons why.

A good rule of thumb to remember is that at a data rate of 100Mbs, 1GB corresponds to roughly 1 minute. Hence, at the (roughly) 35Mbs we're talking about for this camera, a 16GB card will hold about 45 minutes.

When speeds are used in relation to cards, they show the MAXIMUM speeds which the cards can transfer data. Whether or not they will make it depends on a lot of other things, how fast a computer system, what connection system etc. But theoretically, a 45MBs rated card is well over ten times faster than the speed of the data from the camera.

(actually 1028x1028)

Actually 1024 x 1024.

how will the Mark II change a wedding videographer industry? When a photographer will offer the clients both photos and video as a package?

Actually 1024 x 1024.
My apologies!

Actually 1024 x 1024.

Actually, a megabyte was officially redefined as exactly one million bytes in December 1998, and the new term "mebibyte" was created to describe the original binary definition of megabyte. For more details see Mebibyte - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mebibyte).

(I grew up with binary megabytes and Windows still uses them, but the decimal usage is taking over.)

how will the Mark II change a wedding videographer industry? When a photographer will offer the clients both photos and video as a package?

Photographers can already offer both (by buying a video camera) and the Mark II won't make that any easier, but it may inspire more photographers to try their hand at video. What's more interesting is what this camera offers to videographers in terms of depth of field control, as a supplement to proper video cameras which are more practical for the demands of recording a wedding.

Sorry but that's incorrect, as demonstrated here: http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/929807-post172.html (from our Nikon D90 discussion thread (http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/digital-video-industry-news/128802-nikon-d90-has-720p24-over-hdmi.html)). The referenced CNEN tax limit applies to devices which record 30 minute clips or more, and this is not the case with the Canon 5D Mk. II or the Nikon D90.

I could be wrong, but I think people are misunderstanding this. What Canon has said (and that supports the tax concept) is that "continuous" shooting would be limited to 29 minutes 59 seconds or 4 gig - whichever comes first.

This is clearly not an overheating issue and that has been shown with the D90 too. You can begin to record immediately after the 5 minutes with the Nikon - over and over so there's no cool down time.

With the 5DII the word "continuous" would seem to be clear that there isn;t a 4 gig card restriction (really good news) but a 4 gig or 29:59 clip length - but both are stipulated a "continuous" and "clip length". with 1080p averaging about 12 minuted per 4gig.

In other words in in HD you are limited to a 4 gig (buffer, FAT ?) clip size and in SD a 29:59 Clip length. -as they say, "or which ever comes first."

It would make sense that you can shoot with a 16 gig card and put as much as 48 minutes of 1080 footage on it, in as many clips as you like, as long as none surpass 4 gigs.

That's how I read it anyway

... Canon has said (and that supports the tax concept) is that "continuous" shooting would be limited to 29 minutes 59 seconds or 4 gig - whichever comes first.Well, the CNEN tax argument is supported by the 29:59 limitation, not the 4GB limitation.

And as I mentioned previously (http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/937315-post33.html), I think they're needlessly confusing things in their press release by mentioning the potential recording capacity of a 4GB card in the same paragraph as the 4GB file size limitation.

To some folks it gives the mistaken impression that a 4GB card is the maximum usable size, which wouldn't make any sense. Of course it can use CF cards that are 8GB, 16GB, 32GB etc. Their copy writer would have done better to mention the potential recording capacity of one of those cards instead.

The 100/2 is $350, not over a grand.

And you don't need $20,000 in lens. The 35/2 is $200. The 50/1.4 is $300. And the 85/1.8 is $350. All great lenses that are close to the L primes in quality and as good or better than the L zooms.

It's part of the game - photographers always list their arsenal of expensive glass. But countless films have been shot with a fraction of the range he listed...in fact most I bet.

I've directed a number of commercial projects with three Zeiss Super Speeds. A 24mm, 50mm, 85mm is a great core for film making and has been for ever. My current kit of Nikon primes for all uses is 20mm, 28mm, 50mm, 85mm, 105mm and 135mm.
They range from 1.2 (50mm) to 2.8 (20mm) and the whole kit cost less than $3000.

You could put a killer set of L glass together for 1/2 that.

<<Their copy writer would have done better to mention the potential recording capacity of one of those cards instead.[/QUOTE]>>

That would be "ex" copy writer at my company.