Here we have a mix -- 1080 is 24.00fps which makes sense going to films, but can cause trouble in the video world. Motion judder is VERY high -- or VERY BAD -- depending on your feeling about judder.

The 720p is 59.94 and is smooth as butter.

The GH1 was clearly the -- by a big margin -- the best new camera at PMA.

Three issues:

1) when I said the lens was "slow" the rep said he didn't think so. We checked, at I'm sure I saw notation the lens was "1.4 to ???." I must be been wrong because that not what the data sheet says.

2) There is NO power zoom. Now even if you never zoom while shooting video -- not having a way to make quick focal length changes is a real negative. Plus, we all know we zoom. Unfortunately, the manual ring zoom control was VERY tight so not only was zooming not smooth -- you had to use so much force the camera moved.

3) The hand grip is hard and very tiny. Not pleasant to hold.

PS: The Pana rep expressed it well -- at $1500 folks would still buy it, but not feel good. At $1200 folks would feel good. At a $1000 it would be a super bargin.

Considering the Fact that their TM300 camcorder retails for $1,300, it’s extremely unlikely that the GH1 including the 10x lens will sell for $1,000, but it would definitely sell like crazy. It would be like the Nintendo Wii for interchangeable lens cameras.

Considering the Fact that their TM300 camcorder retails for $1,300, it’s extremely unlikely that the GH1 including the 10x lens will sell for $1,000, but it would definitely sell like crazy. It would be like the Nintendo Wii for interchangeable lens cameras.

Totally different divisions with different price points. The current G1 is only $800. I can't see the upgrade costing that much more when its really the same camera with a new function. Pana is revising its USA marketing strategy because it's not happy with its sales. That could mean anything.

Sony would love to have a Wii. :)

I’ve read that and I do see your point since it’s actually selling for $670 at B&H, except for the part about it being a G1 with an added function. Theirs a better Live MOS chip, better engine, a far more advanced lens and obviously a few HD video modes. Personally, I’m expecting $1,200 to $1,300 but $1,000 would definitely be a game changer.

You say that motion judder is really noticeable in 1080p mode. Can it be because the shutter was set at a higher speed than 1/48? I mean, can you control shutter speed in video mode?

Can it be because the shutter was set at a higher speed than 1/48? I mean, can you control shutter speed in video mode?

Yes, you can set the shutter speed to 1/48th and keep it there when shooting 24fps. That's my plan-- keep the aperture wide open, shutter 1/48th and let adjust ISO to get the right exposure.

You say that motion judder is really noticeable in 1080p mode. Can it be because the shutter was set at a higher speed than 1/48? I mean, can you control shutter speed in video mode?

yes -- but the minimum is 1/60th which is "correct" for 60i and 720p60.

"1) when I said the lens was "slow" the rep said he didn't think so. We checked, at I'm sure I saw notation the lens was "1.4 to ???." I must be been wrong because that not what the data sheet says."

The rep and I were both wrong. The lens on the demo camera did say "1 4" but I missed the ":" so it really is F4.0-5.8 which is really slow. Which is what I said to the rep. Lise a stop slow than other cameras. Of course, perhaps the cmos chip is 2x more sensitive.

This makes me think the camera can't be priced much above the current still-only version. How much cost in the unit to add the AVCHD encoder and modify the firmware?

Questions:

1) Not clear to me if the 17.3mm x 13.0mm chip in a four-thirds camera is going to provide the DOF of a 35mm chip.

2) The bigger the chip, the more one can stop down without diffraction. So with a 35m frame, one could stop down to f/22. If a four-thirds camera provides the same effective area as does a 35mm camera -- then the Pana lens stopping down to f/22 is useable. But, if it's not the "same" then does diffraction set in at f/11?

So it's possible that the PAL version has 25fps and 1/50 of minimum shutter, which is closer to cinema, except for the extra frame per second.

So even if you had both PAL and NTSC options in the same camera, 24fps at 1/50 wouldn't look right either... I guess we have a first weak point in this camera if you want to use it to get a cinema look.

So it's possible that the PAL version has 25fps and 1/50 of minimum shutter, which is closer to cinema, except for the extra frame per second.

So even if you had both PAL and NTSC options in the same camera, 24fps at 1/50 wouldn't look right either... I guess we have a first weak point in this camera if you want to use it to get a cinema look.

It never shoots 25fps or 30fps. This is a 50i/60i 1080 interlace camera or a 720p50/p60 camera.

The photo-jpeg is only 30fps no matter your region.

Edited... Double post.

Yes, but the data sheet says the sensor shoots 25-30 progressive fps and then converts the stream to interlaced with a 3:2 pulldown. Anyway I meant that the 1080i50 mode may have a minimum shutter speed of 1/50. Also I guess it's pretty clear that "interlaced" mode is just a disguised progressive.

By the way, I know you've already played with it and you may know better, but the specs say 60 -1/4000 sec of shutter speed. Are you sure it cannot be set to 1/48?

Yes, but the data sheet says the sensor shoots 25-30 progressive fps and then converts the stream to interlaced with a 3:2 pulldown. Anyway I meant that the 1080i50 mode may have a minimum shutter speed of 1/50. Also I guess it's pretty clear that "interlaced" mode is just a disguised progressive.

No 2-3 pulldown is used with 25/50. Yes, the shutter speed at 50i is 1/50th.

Looking at the spec., it shoots 24p -- which gets 2-3 pulldown -- and 25p which does not.

"
Questions:

1) Not clear to me if the 17.3mm x 13.0mm chip in a four-thirds camera is going to provide the DOF of a 35mm chip.



Of course that DOF will be different. Micro 4/3 is ~ half the size of S35mm frame, 2/3" is half the size of micro 4/3.

Two of the most talked films at the Oscars were shot with 2/3" cameras (Slum Dog Millionaire and "... Benjamin Button". Not to mention the winner :-)

Shallow DOF is not the universal pancea to become a filmaker.

Interesting find. iMovie 09 refuses to import the "24p" AVCHD. According to the Pana press release the 24p is NOT carried by 60i.

"Both lenses are compatible with the newly announced LUMIX DMC-GH1 digital camera, which can record High Definition (HD) AVCHD 1080/24p video, and its award-winning sister camera, the LUMIX DMC-G1 digital camera."

Also interesting -- note that FCP reports the video is 24.0fps and not 23.976fps.

So it's possible iMovie is rejecting the video because it's not 23.98fps as it should be for video.

Attached is a readout from an XDCAM EX 23.976 clip.

OK -- I'm sorry I've been confusing on the frame rates.

The fancy brochure says 24p using 2-3 pulldown to 60i (59.94i).

One press release says 1080/24p which I would expect to be 23.976fps.

And, the camera's video clips actually are 1080p24.0.

Here's the deal -- if pulldown is used to 59.94i then the capture must be 23.976. If no pulldown is used, the rate can be either 24.0 or 23.976.

So how is Pana clocking the chip?

Looking at the 720p photo-jpeg clip, it is 30.0fps. Looking at the 720p AVCHD clip it is 59.94. This would say it can be clocked at either 24.0 or 23.98.

My guess would be Pana has decided to skip the needless use of pulldown. Which is good. But, if they choose 24.0 rather than 23.98 while they'll get cheers from some -- it will break editing for far more.

Acording to this: ProLost: Panasonic GH1 (http://prolost.blogspot.com/2009/03/panasonic-gh1.html) the micro 4/3 sensor used in the GH1 has the same height as the sensor in a RED One (remember that sensor was a little smaller than a real s35mm negative). So yes, it'll have something quite close to real cinema DOF.

Valeriu is right. Shallow DOF is not the magic key to real filmmaking, but hey, this is actually the FIRST really low cost camera (I mean, I supose it will be below $2,000) shooting 1080p24 with a sensor really close to s35mm. I bet that shooting in the right conditions and the right way, the clips from this camera will look much more like standard film than many other pro cameras costing 10 or 20 times more. From that point on it's up to the user to shoot real movies or family vacations and birthdays.

GH1 Live MOS Skew on Vimeo (http://vimeo.com/3523210?pg=embed&sec=&hd=1)

Here's a little skew (rolling shutter) test on the GH1. You can find the original clip here: http://vms.slashgear.tv/video/183.mp4

Judge yourselves having in mind that this is a pre-production camera.

I was inspired to do the same thing with Steve's 1080p/24fps clip, it's a bit more telling:
GH1 Rolling Shutter on Vimeo (http://vimeo.com/3577044)

Hope you don't mind, Steve.