Adam,

I don't know what you mean - the audio is still 1 frame behind the video, but it's there. What do you mean exactly?

Well, I have not been using my nF for a while, but when I first got it and was testing it, Vegas could not recognize the sound at all. I had to open the files in VLC and export the sound to a separate .wav file and use that in Vegas instead of the original sound within the mxf file.

When I mentioned it here, Dan said their files were perfect and it was a Vegas problem. I have not been using my nF since as it is quite worthless to me if I have to go such tricks to get the sound out of it.

Dear Adam,

May I recommend that you download Vegas 9.0e and run a test?

I think you will find that audio is not a problem.

Well, I have not been using my nF for a while, but when I first got it and was testing it, Vegas could not recognize the sound at all. I had to open the files in VLC and export the sound to a separate .wav file and use that in Vegas instead of the original sound within the mxf file.

When I mentioned it here, Dan said their files were perfect and it was a Vegas problem. I have not been using my nF since as it is quite worthless to me if I have to go such tricks to get the sound out of it.

Yes, that was a problem with one of Vegas minor updates, if I remember correctly - it's now gone in the current 9.0e.

But, the 1-frame audio lag is still there....

Dear Piotr,

Just to confirm, are you using 1.6.29?

In order for us to duplicate what you are reporting, I will need some info:

Are you using Embedded or Analog Audio Input to the nanoFlash?

What file format: QT or MXF or MPG?

What bit-rate?

Video Details: 1080 / 720, frame rate, Pulldown Removal and any other special options?

Our testing has not shown the 1 frame delay that you are reporting. But, we can re-test.

Our tester did say that it was difficult to check the audio/video sync exactly in Vegas. But we also test it in other NLEs.

Yes, I have 9.0e but this happened before that time. I'll have to check it again, then. Thanks.

Just to confirm, are you using 1.6.29?


Nope - I'm on the 1.5.126. I've spent enough time beta testing - perhaps in the future, I'll be able to afford some more. I'll only upgrade when the power saving mode is back.

Sorry if my statement on the audio lag introduced confusion; can any Vegas user confirm it's now OK with the current 1.6.29?

Dear Piotr,

As far as we know the audio sync is fine in 1.6.29.

(1.6.29 is a production level release, not a Public Beta. It has been out since June 29, 2010)

We are reporting, in another thread any problems with 1.6.29 that we find or are reported to us.

http://www.dvinfo.net/forum/convergent-design-nanoflash/481519-nanoflash-firmware-1-6-29-a.html

Dear Friends,

We have been working with Sony concerning the Green Frame in the Timeline issue.

This issue is only in Sony Vegas, no other NLE, as far as I know.

We have found a way to eliminate the "Green Frame". We have implemented this in an internal firmware release and this improvement will be in our next firmware release.

As we are making other improvements and we have lots of testing to do, please understand that it will be a few weeks before we post the new release.

Yes, that was a problem with one of Vegas minor updates, if I remember correctly - it's now gone in the current 9.0e.


I've witnessed the absence of sound on one clip made with latest Nano 1.6.29 and played with Vegas 9.0e . VLC played the clip correctly with audio.

I've witnessed the absence of sound on one clip made with latest Nano 1.6.29 and played with Vegas 9.0e . VLC played the clip correctly with audio.

Yes, exactly my problem, except it is not just one clip, it is all of them. And I have just double-checked, the problem still exists in Vegas 9.0e. It is only with the files produced by the nF. The .mxf files created by my EX3 do not have that problem. So, clearly, the problem is with the nano.

Adam, this was the case for only one MXF file created by the Nano. The MP4 file recorded in parallel by the EX1 from its BPAV folder played the audio in Vegas.

What I meant was that all of my nano clips have that problem.

Dear Adam,

Are you saying that all files that you record on the nanoFlash are such that the audio is not played in your copy of Sony Vegas 9.0e?

Does the audio play in Sony's Clip Viewer, version 2.30 or the VLC Player?

Dan, we went through this months ago, and I stopped using my nF after that (what is the point of using it if I cannot get any sound out of it?).

It plays in VLC, but there is no sound in Vegas. Not in 9.0c which I used back then, not in 9.0e which I use now.

As you can see in the picture, the entire sound time line shows nothing. And no sound plays either. None whatsover. Nada. Zilch.

Dear Adam,

I wanted to be certain what you meant by "that" problem.

Your situation is unusual.

As I understand it:

You can record video and audio in your nanoFlash.

When you play back the files in your nanoFlash you have video and audio.

When you play the files in VLC Player you have video and audio.

When you play the files in Sony Vegas 9.0e, you have no audio.


This certainly sounds like a Sony Vegas problem to me.

Just yesterday, one of my friends had problems with video capture with his Sony Vegas 9.0e. A simple download and re-install fixed the problem.

As far as I know, no one else has your symptoms.

I just checked my Sony Vegas 9.0e, using one of our sample files with audio, and it plays fine.

This has nothing to do with video capture, Dan. And my Vegas has no problem with the sound of any other source.

I just checked my Sony Vegas 9.0e, using one of our sample files with audio, and it plays fine.

Had you offered me to upload one of my own files and checked it out, I would have been much more impressed. As it is, I feel robbed of thousands of dollars with no recourse.

Dear Adam,

I will be happy to have you upload one of your files.

We want you to be happy.

Are the other files that you are playing successfully in your copy of Sony Vegas Sony XDCam 50 Mbps 4:2:2? You may be using other codecs, which may work fine.

It still sounds like a Vegas issue to me. I will send you our file upload instructions.

Then we will play your files in our copy of Sony Vegas 9.0e.

Dear Adam,

I have emailed you our file upload instructions and my phone numbers.

Thank you, Dan, I have uploaded the file. The other MXF files I have are from the EX-3, which, I believe, is 35 Mbps 4:2:0. However, it is the audio I do not get, the video is flawless and well worth it.

Hi,

the uploaded file is a 1080p30 "true 30" file, as opposed to the more commonly used 29.97 frame rate.
True frame rates have at best limited support in most NLE's - unfortunately Vegas does not play the audio in this case.

Tommy Schell

OK, I have now told Vegas to use the 29.97 drop-frame rate instead, and it still does not play the audio.

Any solutions?

Dear Adam,

Tommy was saying that the frame rate of the take was True 30 frames a second.

Can you please set your camera to record in the normal 1080p29.97 instead of 1080p30 (True).

Sony Vegas does not play audio when the frame rate is True 30 frames a second.

It did not come from my camera, it came from the HDMI port of my computer. As you may recall, one of the main reasons for me getting the nano was to be able to capture my computer screen so I can create software tutorials.

Meanwhile, I have installed Audacity and told Vegas to use it as an external audio editor. Audacity says it can handle MXF files, but not this one...

Dear Adam,

Some Non-Linear Editors will properly handle the audio from 1080p30 (True) sources.

You may try a demo download of Edius.

Or you could ask Sony Creative Software to see if they will support your needs. They may have a way to tweak your Vegas settings so the audio will play.

Is there any way to get the computer to output 29.97 instead of true 30 over HDMI?

Tommy

Is there any way to get the computer to output 29.97 instead of true 30 over HDMI?

Tommy

I have just tried it and it offered 30i and 29i but not 29.97i. When I chose either, it worked, which surprised me as the manual of my monitor does not mention it. Normally I have it set to 60 Hz and that is how I made that file.

I'll have to dig out my nano and see if it makes any difference, probably over the weekend.

Though it still does not make sense to me. It shows the video just fine. It is the video rate that is 30 fps. The audio rate is 48 kHz. So, if anything, it should have trouble with the video not the audio (not that that would make me happier). When I ran the same file through VLS and saved the output to a .wav file and I drag the .wav file on the timeline, it plays both the audio and the video and they are perfectly synchronized. So I seriously doubt the problem is with using true 30.

OK, I have just run two different tests. I used SUPER® to convert the .MXF file to a .MPG file in the stream copy (no transcoding) mode. This time even VLC could not hear the sound, though it saw the video. Then I used SUPER® to convert it to a .wav file, again in the stream copy mode. That was success. And if I drag the .wav on the Vegas timeline, it has no problem with it.

So, at least, now I have a workaround. It is an extra step, but it is much simpler to get the .wav out of it with SUPER® than with VLC. I can live with that.

Dan, I found some Nano MXF files that play sound in either Vegas 9.0e but not in VLC 1.05 (1.10 stutters on MXF audio files) . I recorded the Sony EX1 in parallel to SxS, so I have the same scene with audio. These were recorded on December 29, 2009, though I can't remember which firmware. I have not loaded beta firmware but usually get to the official release firmware within a week of announcement.LongGOP100 MBps at 1080p30. Vegas shows the audio in the time-line.

I have shots from later on that day (prebuffer on) with audio that play in both Vegas and VLC. The difference is that the silent-in-VLC Nano MXF files have audio recorded only to the right channel while the proper files have the same audio in both channels with that EX1 audio input mode that routes the left mic to both channels. For the Silent-in-VLC files, Vegas shows the audio in the right channel for both Nano and SxS. I had one shotgun mic in two channel record mode for the Silent-in-VLC recordings and in Channel1-to-Both-Channels mode for the proper recordings.

Here are the two files, prebuffer off.
Index of /Videos/Nanoflash/Test_SilentNano (http://gentlemensfightingclub.com/Videos/Nanoflash/Test_SilentNano/)

Stan, what are your Vegas Project settings? Would you mind creating a very short 10MByte Nano file (say 18 MBps setting for LongGOP) with audio from your BlackMagic HDMI out and emailing it to me? I don't think Yahoo allows for a total encoded size of greater than 25 MBytes.

I added another file from the same day with same Nano settings but different Sony EX1 microphone configuration (microphone in both XLR inputs). VLC allows viewing the codec information and shows that all of these MXF files have different audio Stream orders. The MXF files, both Eseals_01189001.MXF with VLC sound and Rays_01134001.MXF with no VLC sound, have the same Stream ordering as show in in VLC's Codec Information.

Eseals_01189001.MXF Nano file, microphone in both XLR inputs, LongGOP 100 MBps

Rays_00001135_01.MP4 SxS file, microphone in right XLR input, LongGOP 100 MBps

Rays_01134001.MXF Nano file, microphone in right XLR input, LongGOP 100 MBps

Rays_00001135_01_mxf_SonyClipBrowserExportMXFforNLE.mxf : SxS MP4 file exported from Sony ClipBrowser 2.6 under "Export MXF for NLEs"

Rays_00001135_01_mxf_SonyClipBrowserExportforXDCAM422.mxf : SxS MP4 file exported from Sony Clip Browser under "Export for XDCAM HD422

My nanofile opened in VLC shows two audio tracks, one mono, the other 1-channel (not sure what the difference is, but that is how VLC reports it). VLC plays the sound the same regardless of which audio track I choose.

Vegas says there is one audio track and it is stereo but does not play the sound.

The .wav file created by SUPER® has one mono track according to both VLC and Vegas.

At any rate, if VLC sees two mono channels and Vegas sees one stereo channel, that shows some kind of format incompatibility somewhere. The original that was recorded by the nano had stereo sound, so it is strange that it looks like two mono tracks to VLC (and apparently to SUPER®).

The Sony XDCAM Viewer plays both the audio and video and says the audio is in the AES-3 format with 2 channels

Of course, the Viewer is a 32-bit app, while Vegas is a 64-bit app, so it is an unfair comparison.

Dear Adam,

It could be that a file recorded with 1.6.29, our latest release may work for you.

I believe that we had some problems in this area, last December.

I do not know of any similiar problems reported with 1.6.29.

This is all strange... I never had any problem with audio channel mapping in Vegas. The original SxS mxf files are read as 4-channel (with only channel 1 and 2 actually containing audio), while those from the nanoFlash - as 2 channel. In both cases, the 2 channels that contain the audio are arranged as a single, stereo track...

Piotr, where do you get SxS MXF files? Aren't they MP4 ?

ClipBrowser MXF and Nanoflash MXF appear to have a different MXF structure, at least from viewing them from VLC. Check the PNG files in my link above that show the Codec Details from VLC. Nano's MXF uses 24 bits/sample and two Streams, one Channels=1 and Channels=Mono . ClipBrowser exports 16 bits/sample with four Streams, three with Channels=1 and Channels=Mono . Though, I'm reporting MXF files that play in Vegas and are silent in VLC.

Gints,

You're right - the native format of SxS files is mp4 (mpeg-2 in the mp4 wrapper, to be exact), and you can read them directly by Vegas.

However in my workflow, I always preferred to re-wrap from mp4 container to the mxf (ClipBrowser does it on the fly using the "Export for NLE" option). This way, I'm always working with mxf regardless of whether the clips come from the SxS or the nanoFlash.

Again: both SxS and nano mxf audio is OK here (in VLC as well as Sony MXF Player, or NLEs such as Vegas and Edius).