Hey guys,

I just recently received an f350 and so far I'm loving the camera itself. Absolutely stunning pictures.

The problem I've encoutered is that I was told that it would be no problem to double up the camera as a deck (no heads to wear out etc..) and that I could simply plug it in throught the IEEE 1394 connection and the camera would act as an external hard drive essentially.

I run a Mac G5 with Final Cut Pro 5. Unfortunately I've now found out that Sony has drivers for the PC but nothing for the Mac yet. Apparently some beta drivers are in the works? Does anyone know anything about the beta drivers and where I might find them?

I have heard that the initial drivers also only support the 25Mbps data rate which is very disappointing as Discovery Channel HD recently announced that they would accept the 35Mbps footage as full quality HD. I've scoured the internet for news and info on this topic, but I guess the technology is too new for there to be much.

Any help would be GREATLY appreciated.

Thanks,

Jeremy Spruston

At NAB, the Sony reps said sometime in late June was when they expected to have software available to transcode the .MXF into .MOV for FCP ingest. I haven't heard anything different than that.

There is a software solution from Flip4mac that I believe runs about $500.


-gb-

Thanks for the reply Greg... I have downloaded the flip4mac software, but it doesn't seem to work as a solution for the f350. It does add a 'Sony Xdcam' and 'Sony Xdcam (local files)' option in the Import menu in Final Cut Pro, but I am unable to access the actual files on the camera. I'm assuming that some sort of driver is needed to make the actual computer recognize the camera as a device so I can see the files on the Professional Disc.

I hope the made sense. It's all pretty frustrating!

http://www.flip4mac.com/fusetalk/forum/categories.aspx?catid=20&flcache=7429398

So lucky of you to have your f350!
I wonder your information about import XDCAM MXF into
FCP. Please post it if it's solved. Thanks.



Oh, if you transport the MXF files to PC and copy them to Mac.
Then can you import them to FCP by Flip4Mac?

I read something recently about the FCP5.1 Universal upgrade that deals with the MXF thing. I think you can do the upgrade really cheaply, so you might want to go check that out on the Apple site.

About no head wear--true, but I think the laser wears, or some part of it or something. There is a finite life.

I'm not completely sure, but isn't the Final Cut 5.1 upgrade just the Universal Binary version? Or, as someone who just purchased 5.0 (now 5.0.4), do I have to shell out more cash just to get 5.1?

Greg is right on this one--soon to be released but not released yet.

True, it's the Universal version but I'm fairly sure I read something about XDCAM in relation to that version.

True, it's the Universal version but I'm fairly sure I read something about XDCAM in relation to that version.

Bill, it was announced at NAB '06 that an 'impending' software update would be able to handle XDCAM HD, CANON 24/30F, and JVC 24/30P. Your guess is as good as mine on what timeframe 'impending' means. No one seems to have any info on that.

The 5.1 upgrade is the universal binary but it's also worth the $49 upgrade for G5 owners because they've improved render times for that processor as well.

-gb-

p.s. I was up in Overland Park a couple weeks ago. Had some awesome BBQ at a KC Masterpiece restaurant.

Damn--next time call me. KC Masterpiece is only adequate. You need to go to Arthur Bryant's to get the real thing.

I'm actually heading out to shoot for a few weeks with my new f350 (pretty excited to actually get in the field and use it!!). I work for a sportfishing television show, so the camera will definitely be put through the outdoor paces.

Just a little concerned that when I get back I'm going to be stuck with some discs full of footage that I can't yet utilize in the editing suite. I'm planning on shotting in 60i at 25 Mbps just in case (though I would like to shoot at 35 Mbps). Anyone have any other suggestions to make my future editing work easiest?

First of all Joy Kwan, sorry I haven't been back in touch. Been quite busy recently. The smallest file I have is around 92mb in size. I take it you are wanting XDCAM HD footage?

Jeremy, the shooting format is an issue with XDCAM HD at the moment unfortunately. Also AFAIK only the decks have the ability to output an HDV compatible stream. So recording at 25mbps is not a way of ensuring HDV compatibility unless you have the decks with the relevant option board installed.

My suggestion would be to record at 35mbps, and then ingest into the NLE using the 350's HD SDI out. This isn't ideal I know. Thats the trouble with being an early adopter. However I can assure you that it won't be long now before the various NLE's gain full compatibility.

Thanks Simon,

I've been told that the HD SDI coming out is uncompressed video. Is that true? If so, I'll have to figure out a different method of digitizing, as I believe the bitrate would be too high for my external FW800 drives (or so I've been told anyways). Machine control would be a bit of an issue too. I've also heard that the variable bitrate of the 18 and 35 Mbps may not work as well as the constant bitrate of the 25?

So many questions!! Thanks for all of your help so far guys. I'm pretty pumped to get out and shoot with this camera, just have a feeling I'll be tearing my hair out to get at the footage later.

The 35mbps mode of the XDCAM HD is superior to the 25mbps mode (hence the reason Discovery accept it unrestricted now).

Yes, the signal out of the HD-SDI is uncompressed, but how it saves onto your computer depends on the codec used. As I mentioned, shooting 25mbps mode will not enable you to stream like HDV unless you have the XDCAM HD deck with the relevant option board installed. So regardless of the datarate used the same problem exists.

Which editing system are you using at the moment?

Thanks again Simon,

I'm currently using Final Cut Pro. The real difficulty for me right now is even getting the camera recognized as a device on my mac. Don't have a way to even look at my files yet.

I'm heading out on my shoot today and I'm not sure how much internet access I'll have, but hopefully I'll be able to periodically post some of my experiences in the field.

Thanks!

Thanks Simon. Would you please put the MXF files with its folder (you can zip it) on your website?
http://www.simonwyndham.co.uk/reel.htm
Thanks for your generous.

First of all Joy Kwan, sorry I haven't been back in touch. Been quite busy recently. The smallest file I have is around 92mb in size. I take it you are wanting XDCAM HD footage?

According to the latest information I have from a contact at Sony, their downloadable application for reading the MXF files is due out at the end of the month. It's also believed from other sources that Apple may have their update to FCP ready by month's end as well.

Apple/Sony are currently doing an XDCAM HD seminar tour and I'll be attending the Dallas session on the 28th of this month.

-gb-

Do you have a link or any info on that Sony/Apple tour? I'd be interested in attending one.

Hi Bill,
goto

http://seminars.apple.com/

down toward the righthand side is the Multicity tour link for the
Mobile editing with Final Cut Studio and Sony's XDCAM-HD System.

Regards,

Paul

Thanks! I signed up for the Chicago one on Aug. 1

Why do I have this funny feeling that Bill is getting ready to pull the trigger on this camera?

Just planning ahead. In the past, from the time I start getting interested in a new camera, it takes about a year or so before we're actually ready to do something. The ol' DSR500 is still doing just great, and shooting 16:9 with the way I've got the settings tweaked and all, the quality is fine for what we do. Everybody's happy with it.

However, things change. What interests me about XDCAM HD is the tapeless workflow. I was not a proponent of going tapeless until I learned more about the system. There are some excellent advantages over tape for us, and the optical discs are about the same price as DVCAM tape and, from what I've read, are equally rugged, maybe moreso, and you can stick them on the shelf and file them for years, just like tape.

My big emotional problem, however, is going from 2/3" to 1/2" chips. I'm not sure if I'm ready for that. Allegedly the higher resolution format looks better, and keeping everything 24p might save us some significant space on our interactive CD and web stuff. So the tradeoffs might be worth it. The 2/3" chip version will probably be out by the time we're ready, but I dont' know if we can justify the cost. The 500 was only about $15K and lens about the same, so the whole package was $30K, plus another $20K for a couple of DSR 1800 decks. So we went from Betacam to DVCAM for $50K. The 2/3" chip camera and a useable lens would probably get very close to $50K, I'm guessing. But, with the XDCAM flow, we might get by with one deck in the network, and we really wouldn't need the pricey one that also records, because who the heck wants a master in XDCAM HD? Most of our stuff is released on DVD, on CD or web. On the rare occasion where I've done tape to 35mm transfers, we send the lab the show on a hard drive.

So...hmmm...maybe I'll wait for the 2/3" camera. On the other hand, a 1/2" one is a little smaller and lighter, and I could get a better lens cheaper...Damn, you see why I have to start thinking about these things a year in advance. There's also the emotional distress--like, when we went from a BVW camera to a DSR camera--alas, the pain and embarassment of not using a Sony Broadcast camera anymore, the angst of having only a "professional" model, and oh the humiliation of a DV25 format. Of course, the fact that everything looked better sorta made up for all that; still, the ego can suffer tremendously, though I'm accustomed to that because everytime I open up my little white iBook in a coffee house, everybody with the big wide screen Power Books looks at me with lightly concealed scorn, and now that the Professional Photographer Flat Black laptops are out, I'm sliding even farther down the self esteem scale. So hell, I can handle 1/2" chips; I'll just wear all black when I shoot and they'll think I'm an indy filmmaker.

My big emotional problem, however, is going from 2/3" to 1/2" chips. I'm not sure if I'm ready for that.

To be honest, especially in HD mode, that doesn't seem to be an issue from my usage of the cameras. The picture quality from these babies is fantastic. Even the half res slow motion. I'd wager most people he wouldn't know. It looks as good as the none slow motion stuff.

On the other hand, a 1/2" one is a little smaller and lighter,

Wouldn't bet on it. These cameras are roughly the same size and weight as the SD XDCAM's.

alas, the pain and embarassment of not using a Sony Broadcast camera anymore, the angst of having only a "professional" model,

Why so? The BBC still uses the 500 and 570 as a mainstay of many of its productions. Make no mistake. the 500 is a true broadcast camera.

Simon,

so let me get this straight, I can output 35mbs HDV through the HD-SDI port in the 350 straight into my Decklink HD card using whatever compression I choose in FCP.

If that's true I'd be interested to see how the picture looks using DVCPro HD compression. Hopefully when Alister is back from chasing storms I'll be able to test it!

Simon,

so let me get this straight, I can output 35mbs HDV through the HD-SDI port in the 350 straight into my Decklink HD card using whatever compression I choose in FCP.

If that's true I'd be interested to see how the picture looks using DVCPro HD compression. Hopefully when Alister is back from chasing storms I'll be able to test it!

It's not HDV per se, it's MPEG2@HL. You should be able to capture to DVCPRO HD if you wish. Some folks have already been doing that with other cameras that are not native DVCPRO HD cameras.

-gb-

Simon, I was being sardonic about the "broadcast" issue, since the DSR500/570 was not sold by the "Broadcast Division."