I'm about to start shooting a project this june, and a lot of scenes are centered around this particular grave. I don't want to use an existing tomb stone because that would be very disrespectful, even with permission I think. Basically I need to create something that looks like a tombstone... cheaply. it doesn't need anything engraved on it because I imagine I could manage that effect in post.

Any Ideas anyone?

Go to a company that makes tombstones and film one then use maybe photo impact to make the letters as a png or gif and then superimpose in a timeline over your clip, might work!

Styrofoam. Easy to shape, and give it a quick spay paint with one of those gray speckled bombs that are available for the cement/marble look.

Hugh, I'm not sure what you mean exactly by that, I need to film a lot of scenes with the tombstone and I have a specific location for it. I doubt they would let me borrow one.

Ken, Do you really think that would look realistic, it sounds like a good option because I'm not a bad artist. Can you give me some more info on that "gray speckled spray-paint"

How about borrowing a real one from a gravestone engraver in exchange for a screen credit?

maybe buy a damaged one or one that is sitting in the back room for some reason and if it has the wrong letters on it use the other side, and don't forget about the green screen possibilities

We make stuff like this out of styrofoam all the time, and if you have artistic abilities so can you. There are several types of foam insulation board which should be available from a local supplier - check you yellow pages. Most common is the blue or pink styrofoam and white bead foam. The blue foam has a smoother texture and can be carved and sanded to a nice finish. The bead foam is made from little spheres compressed together and won't give you as smooth a finish but you might like the rough texture. You should be able to find these products as thick as 3", 4" even 6" at a supplier but at Home Depot or Lowes probably only 2" thick. Sheet sizes are either 4'x8' or 2'x8' depending on the product. We have gotten big blocks as large as 4'x8'x2' to carve statues and big stones. If you can't find the thick foam you can glue together layers of 2" foam to get the desired thickness. Use panel adhesive designed for foam board - check the label because other adhesives will dissolve the foam.

A cheap keyhole saw works well to cut it, as do other handsaws. A drywall saw is also handy. Also try a variety of knives for carving, and Stanley Surform files and planes are great for shaping it. Also coarse sandpaper for finishing. Get one of those large circular cup-shaped wire brush attachments for your electric drill and try that - it's one of the most effective ways to shape the styrofoam and give it a smooth surface.

If you want to experiment with texture, get some lacquer thinner and put it in a small sprayer. DANGER - fumes will be toxic and very flammable! Only try this outdoors in small quantities, or don't try it at all if you don't feel like you know what you're doing!

You could use a Dremel tool or a round rasp bit in an electric drill to carve letters. Some of our artists like to do this with a knife however - the break-off box cutter knives are good for this.

We use a product called "Jaxsan 600" to coat the finished styrofoam. It's a rubber roofing compound that is really tough. It protects the styrofoam if you put it on heavily, and you can add more texture by adding styrofoam dust or sawdust to it. Contact the manufacturer, Plastics Coating Corporation at 304 755-9151 for info.

Here are some examples of how we use it on the stage:

Boyd, that's some really great advice, I'm probably gonna try something similiar to your process. I'm sure it'll turn out great. Thanks!

Oh wait, I have one more question, how did you add weight to your completed set pieces? Did you just anchor it from the non-visable side?

wow, really nice stuff out of styrofoam, I have had three taxidermy shops going back to the late 70's thru the 80's, and did alot of creative stuff with styrofoam, I bought blocks of blue foam, maybe 12 ft x 2x 2, looks like the best way to go

Thanks! The big face, the eagle and the brick wall all consist of plywood covered frames with styrofoam layered on top. The balustrade spindle has a piece of wood running down the center which allows it to be a structural support for a railing. Styrofoam (especially the blue/pink variety) is actually very dense and tough. You can walk on it as long as there's some sort of plywood base underneath.

There are other techniques for covering/protecting the styrofoam. A traditional method is using cheesecloth soaked in glue (such as Elmer's white glue) and wrapped around the foam.

We made our own tombstones out of styrofoam for a music video we worked on. Simply and effective.

Ken, Do you really think that would look realistic, it sounds like a good option because I'm not a bad artist. Can you give me some more info on that "gray speckled spray-paint"

There is a type of spray paint that comes out speckled for that instant textured look. You can buy it at any paint department and comes in a few different types and costs only a few bucks more then regular spray paint.

We have a graveyard up the road...Some old graves markers were simply made out of of wood. The top of the plank was curved to keep rainwater from settling. The Hawaiians took a plank also curved at the top so that it could be surfed in religious observance. Thus was born the sport of surfing.

There is a type of spray paint that comes out speckled for that instant textured look.

If you use styrofoam be sure to test any spray paint on a scrap before using it on a finished project. The solvent in spray paint will eat into the styrofoam and make a mess; generally speaking it's a bad idea to use spray paint on styrofoam. If you do a base coat with the Jaxsan product I mentioned, that *might* protect the foam but again I would do a test and let it sit overnight. You may not see a problem at first, but after several hours sometimes the solvent will gradually eat into the foam.

As a general rule, only use water-based paints on anything which is made from styrofoam.

When a boy scout we were out camping. At the end of the trip, one of the trucks wouldn't start. The adults decided to siphon some gas into a cup so they could prime the carburettor. They used a Styrofoam cup. Within seconds all they had was the lip of a cup and a puddle of petroleum products on the ground.

Definitely stick with water-based paints.

Not as grand as Boyd's, but I made a number of styrofoam grave stones to put in the yard at Halloween. Idea is that they are 18th century so all the names have worn away . . .

If you use styrofoam be sure to test any spray paint on a scrap before using it on a finished project. The solvent in spray paint will eat into the styrofoam and make a mess; generally speaking it's a bad idea to use spray paint on styrofoam. If you do a base coat with the Jaxsan product I mentioned, that *might* protect the foam but again I would do a test and let it sit overnight. You may not see a problem at first, but after several hours sometimes the solvent will gradually eat into the foam.

As a general rule, only use water-based paints on anything which is made from styrofoam.

Good point. I had only used it on wood myself. How about a primer spray, or some other pre-coating befor using the spray paint. What would work?

Paint on the stones I did is just a high quality grey laytex. It stuck just fine to the 2" blue insulation board. When dry I applied several different washes with thinned down paint to simulate weathering.

Good idea, too, to look at some photos of real stones

http://www.graveaddiction.com/cemindex.html

How about a primer spray, or some other pre-coating befor using the spray paint. What would work?

The important thing is to use only water-based paints on styrofoam. The solvents used in most spray paints will eat into the styrofoam. And it may be a slow process which isn't immediately visible. Same thing with panel adhesives - use only water based adhesives also.

Many years ago when I was teaching, a student made a big wedding cake out of a number of stacked styrofoam disks glued together with "Liquid Nails" panel adhesive. It looked good when I saw it in the afternoon. The next morning when we came into the shop it looked like a Swiss cheese with big holes where the solvent leached through overnight, the whole thing was ruined.

Rosco makes a variety of products to coat styrofoam: http://www.rosco.com/us/scenic/index.asp

We don't use these very often though since we like the "Jaxsan" product described above. But I would still be careful with any solvent based spray paint because the solvent may penetrate your primer. Test with a scrap of styrofoam and let dry overnight instead of taking a chance ruining a finished piece.

Nice stuff Boyd! Any particular adhesive you use to make the larger blocks?

Two other tips for headstones:

1) There's all sorts of pre-carved wood goodies at home depot, like spirals, edging, etc, that aren't that expensive and look great when put on your form headstone....

2) You can texture the thing by using simple paper mache - this is particularly good for an old-looking head stone. Also, if you have a mold or form (say of a skull), you can paper-mache the inside of the that, let it dry, then apply in to your headstone.

It's tougher than you'd think - unless it really ges wet, it holds it's shape...
john
evilgeniusentertainment.com

Nice stuff Boyd! Any particular adhesive you use to make the larger blocks?

Just look through the panel adhesives in any large hardware store or home center. Read the labels and you will find some which are recommended for "foam board insulation."

When we were doing big projects with styrofoam we used an industrial spray adhesive called "Stay Put II" which comes in 30 lb pressurized cannisters. Our local distributor stopped carrying it however, so we usually just get panel adhesives from local stores for small projects. But you can order it from Outwater Plastics - aerosol spray cans would be more practical for little jobs:

http://www.outwatercatalogs.com/2006_master/lg_display.cfm?page_number=229&catalog=otm

By the way, something not mentioned yet in this discussion is the MESS involved when working with styrofoam. Don't do this inside your house! The shavings from sanding/shaping/sawing are statically charged and stick to everything. Will also make a mess outside if they blow around, your neighbors won't be happy ;-) Be sure to have a good shop vacuum handy. You should also wear goggles for eye protection. Little flecks of styrofoam can really irritate your eyes.

Thanks Boyd!

Great info (I always wondered how they made such huge blocks for things like LORD OF THE RINGS).
john
evilgeniusentertainment.com

Well that might be something completely different....

Urethane foam is very nice for carving. It's completely different from styrofoam, has a much finer "grain" to it and can be good for this sort of thing. Also nice for statues where you want fine detail. It can be sanded smooth. But kind of nasty to work with, the dust is like itching powder!

But Hollywood especially likes to work with spray foam. You can build rough shapes out of wood, chicken wire, styrofoam... anything. Then you spray a two-part foam (mixes in the nozzle as you spray) and it expands to a much larger volume. Very cool stuff. There are different densities, so you can make something strong enough to walk on or very light and fragile. But there are some serious health issues related to the fumes, so we have decided not to use it anymore. You need the proper kind of ventillation and respirators, it's not for hobbyists! But it's a really fast way to cover large surfaces, and it tends to create rock-like textures all by itself.

Here's an example from a few years ago. We took a bunch of rough-cut styrofoam chunks (an electric chain saw works well for this) and sprayed over the whole thing to create a rough rocky texture:http://tech.operaphilly.com/sets/carmen/shop/sample01/03.pdf

Very cool.

Maybe because I was raised on the original STAR TREK, which used so much faux rock, but I am fasinated by this stuff.

Where would you order the spray form and what's the genral cost?

Great info Boyd -

john
evilgeniusentertainment.com

Just a thought,if you want to see some spectacular created settings and how to produce stuff like that, take a look at some taxidermy creations as far as rocks, water etc, when I had my shops rocks or similar stuff can be created with a base of styrofoam, wood, plaster, etc, then you spray a solution on elmers white glue and water, then sprinkle some sand, whatever grain you wanted, then airbrush to a certain color. i guess a tombstone could be created in this manner.I think you could buy powdered or granulated granite and that would work in place of sand

Where would you order the spray form and what's the genral cost?

We were using the Dow Froth Paks:

http://www.dow.com/buildingproducts/frothpak/

See the photo at the bottom of this page. It's a self-contained kit which you discard when done:

http://www.dow.com/buildingproducts/frothpak/prod_config.htm

Looking in our records, we paid $220 for the 180 kit (makes 16.6 cubic feet of foam) and $530 for the 600 kit (50 cu ft of foam):

http://www.dow.com/buildingproducts/frothpak/prod_config.htm

But keep in mind these were prices from September 2003. If you're interested in using something like this, find a local foam/insulation company. They should be able to quote you a current price and order for you.

However, this really isn't something to play around with in your basement :-) There are serious safety issues related to using a product like this. You need the proper respirator for the fumes, and as the foam cures it releases a lot of heat, possibly enough to be a concern. We were lucky to have a local vendor who is also an opera fan. He came over to our shop and spent awhile with our scenic artist demonstrating how to use the foam and relating a lot of interesting stories about various projects he's done (my favorite was about a "grotto" he created in the basement of a North Jersey mobster :-)

We haven't used it since learning of some city ordinances related to the amount of flammable/pressurized containers we could have on site without a special license. And the health issues are also a concern. But it's very impressive stuff and I'm sure we will eventually want to work with it again.

I think there are electric powered hot wire cutters like soldering irons for finer shaping and engraving work on foam. Long ago in Perth W.A., I think Paul Ritter, noted architect and city planner was using them to carve negative molds for his sculpcrete process.

I think I saw them again in the "how-we-dunnit" clips on the "Whale Rider" DVD extras, where they detailed the construction of the big wooden sea canoe.

IMPORTANT HAZARD ISSUE - Like the setting vapours, I think you need to stay out of the hazardous fumes from hot wire work.

Yes, you can buy hot wire cutters and I have made them myself. But be REALLY CAREFUL. Burning some kinds of foam can release cyanide gas! I would stay away from this technique myself. You will find it easy to carve, sand and saw styrofoam with inexpensive handyman tools.

Yes, you can buy hot wire cutters and I have made them myself. But be REALLY CAREFUL. Burning some kinds of foam can release cyanide gas! I would stay away from this technique myself. You will find it easy to carve, sand and saw styrofoam with inexpensive handyman tools.
Indeed! This is a material hazard for anything containing Polyurethanes.

Thanks 4 the links Boyd - it looks kind of intimidating - but fun.

john
evilgeniusentertainment.com