Michael Mann's "Collateral" at DVinfo.net

Keith Loh · July 25th, 2004, 06:08 PM

I didn't know it was HD until I saw the trailer in front of "The Bourne Supremacy" today. What do people think of the look?

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0369339/

Technical details according to IMDB:

Camera
Panavision Cameras and Lenses
Sony HDW-F900 CineAlta
Thomson VIPER FilmStream Camera, Zeiss Digiprime Lenses

Film negative format (mm/video inches)
Video (HDTV)

Cinematographic process
HDTV (1080p/24)

Aspect ratio
2.35 : 1

Rob Belics · July 25th, 2004, 08:10 PM

It is not shot entirely in HD, only portions of it. I have not seen it but was told you can tell when HD is used. HD was used for a look of sorts during those portions.

Keith Loh · July 26th, 2004, 12:03 AM

The first trailer I saw as a Quicktime gave me no indication that there was any video. But the trailer now showing in the theatres is really noticeably not film.

Robert Knecht Schmidt · July 26th, 2004, 01:21 PM

The HD looks really flat, doesn't it?

Heath McKnight · July 26th, 2004, 02:02 PM

I read it was 100% Viper, but that may have been a misprint or a misunderstanding.

heath

Robert Knecht Schmidt · July 26th, 2004, 02:33 PM

That would make sense. It's really tough to fit a decked-out CineAlta in a car.

Nick Medrano · July 26th, 2004, 09:06 PM

Hey as soon as I saw the trailer for Collaterral, I knew it was shot on video..and I could tell even with the quicktime internet clips because of the video noise in the night scenes.

By the way, doesn't that trailer look boring as hell? Didn't do it for me.

And...The Bourne Supremacy was shot on film, but I thought it looked terrible. Aahhh, maybe my eyes are going bad...

I, did, however hate the cinematography in TBSupremacy.

Damn, am I negative or what?

Rob Belics · July 26th, 2004, 10:24 PM

They used the Viper and Sony's F900 for the video parts. Mainly the night exteriors and the cab scene.

Heath McKnight · July 26th, 2004, 10:45 PM

But the question is why? Why not use film or all HD?

hwm

Josh Bass · July 27th, 2004, 01:45 AM

I have the most recent issue of American Cinematographer, which has an article on Collateral. They used HD for exteriors and some other stuff, since it can see into the shadows better than film can, using available light, and they wanted LA to be as much a character in the movie as any other character--using HD for exterior work would allow them, using available light, to see a lot of stuff they wouldn't have been able to on film. Some film was used, for interior scenes, I believe. The whole movie was a combo of F900, Viper, and film footage. I guarantee nothing of what I've just written to be completely right, but it's real close.

Robert Knecht Schmidt · July 27th, 2004, 01:53 AM

"Why not use film or all HD?"

Mann is an experimental director making experimental choices. He did the same thing on Ali.

Heath McKnight · July 27th, 2004, 06:42 AM

What did he use on Ali? I felt he shot way too loose on Ali, almost sloppy, I feel. But The Insider, wow, that was awesome. As far as setting up shots, Mann considers Ridley Scott to be in the upper "2%."

heath

Yi Fong Yu · August 5th, 2004, 01:35 PM

hey guys!!!

glad you guys have a thread already. i had been reading a movie-review & they mentioned HD. so i checked the specs on imdb and noticed you guys are already talking about it. this is ali:
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0248667/technical

this is phantom menace:
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0120915/technical

both ali and phantom use a mixture of film and digital. however... for collateral i ONLY see HD and unless imdb is wrong i think collateral is 100% all digital.

i'm looking forward to seeing this flick digital or not! =).

Charles Papert · August 5th, 2004, 01:45 PM

Collateral was indeed a mix of HD and film. Josh reported the story correctly. One of my pals was an operator on the show and he has confirmed this.

Mann is interesting in that he is using whichever medium suits him for a given scene--not for the look, not for the economics, but for the capabilities. HD has given the director a way to shoot night exteriors that expose similar to the way the eye sees, something he discovered while shooting the opening scenes of "Ali" where Will Smith is running at night. I think he likes being an innovator as well. But he still seems to prefer the look of film when shooting in a controlled setting.

Heath McKnight · August 5th, 2004, 02:01 PM

Yi,

Phantom Menace's printed format, other than 35 mm, was digital for DLP-equipped theatres. It wasn't shot digitally at all, other than digital effects.

hwm

July 25th, 2004, 06:08 PM	#1
Keith Loh Air China Pilot Join Date: May 2002 Location: Vancouver, B.C. Posts: 2,389	Michael Mann's "Collateral" I didn't know it was HD until I saw the trailer in front of "The Bourne Supremacy" today. What do people think of the look? http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0369339/ Technical details according to IMDB: Camera Panavision Cameras and Lenses Sony HDW-F900 CineAlta Thomson VIPER FilmStream Camera, Zeiss Digiprime Lenses Film negative format (mm/video inches) Video (HDTV) Cinematographic process HDTV (1080p/24) Aspect ratio 2.35 : 1 __________________ -- Visit http://www.KeithLoh.com \| stuff about living in Vancouver \| My Flickr photo gallery

July 26th, 2004, 12:03 AM	#3
Keith Loh Air China Pilot Join Date: May 2002 Location: Vancouver, B.C. Posts: 2,389	The first trailer I saw as a Quicktime gave me no indication that there was any video. But the trailer now showing in the theatres is really noticeably not film. __________________ -- Visit http://www.KeithLoh.com \| stuff about living in Vancouver \| My Flickr photo gallery

July 26th, 2004, 01:21 PM	#4
Robert Knecht Schmidt Wrangler Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Cleveland, Ohio Posts: 1,933	The HD looks really flat, doesn't it? __________________ All the best, Robert K S Search DVinfo.net for quick answers \| The best in the business: DVinfo.net sponsors

July 26th, 2004, 02:02 PM	#5
Heath McKnight MPS Digital Studios Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Palm Beach County, Florida Posts: 8,531	I read it was 100% Viper, but that may have been a misprint or a misunderstanding. heath __________________ My Final Cut Pro X blog

July 26th, 2004, 02:33 PM	#6
Robert Knecht Schmidt Wrangler Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Cleveland, Ohio Posts: 1,933	That would make sense. It's really tough to fit a decked-out CineAlta in a car. __________________ All the best, Robert K S Search DVinfo.net for quick answers \| The best in the business: DVinfo.net sponsors

July 25th, 2004, 08:10 PM	#2
Rob Belics Major Player Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: St. Louis, MO Posts: 581	It is not shot entirely in HD, only portions of it. I have not seen it but was told you can tell when HD is used. HD was used for a look of sorts during those portions.

July 26th, 2004, 09:06 PM	#7
Nick Medrano Major Player Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: San Antonio, TX Posts: 331	Hey as soon as I saw the trailer for Collaterral, I knew it was shot on video..and I could tell even with the quicktime internet clips because of the video noise in the night scenes. By the way, doesn't that trailer look boring as hell? Didn't do it for me. And...The Bourne Supremacy was shot on film, but I thought it looked terrible. Aahhh, maybe my eyes are going bad... I, did, however hate the cinematography in TBSupremacy. Damn, am I negative or what?

July 26th, 2004, 10:24 PM	#8
Rob Belics Major Player Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: St. Louis, MO Posts: 581	They used the Viper and Sony's F900 for the video parts. Mainly the night exteriors and the cab scene.

July 26th, 2004, 10:45 PM	#9
Heath McKnight MPS Digital Studios Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Palm Beach County, Florida Posts: 8,531	But the question is why? Why not use film or all HD? hwm __________________ My Final Cut Pro X blog

July 27th, 2004, 01:45 AM	#10
Josh Bass Slash Rules! Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Houston, Texas Posts: 5,472	I have the most recent issue of American Cinematographer, which has an article on Collateral. They used HD for exteriors and some other stuff, since it can see into the shadows better than film can, using available light, and they wanted LA to be as much a character in the movie as any other character--using HD for exterior work would allow them, using available light, to see a lot of stuff they wouldn't have been able to on film. Some film was used, for interior scenes, I believe. The whole movie was a combo of F900, Viper, and film footage. I guarantee nothing of what I've just written to be completely right, but it's real close. __________________ The Bass' camerawork The Bass on IMDB

July 27th, 2004, 01:53 AM	#11
Robert Knecht Schmidt Wrangler Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Cleveland, Ohio Posts: 1,933	"Why not use film or all HD?" Mann is an experimental director making experimental choices. He did the same thing on Ali. __________________ All the best, Robert K S Search DVinfo.net for quick answers \| The best in the business: DVinfo.net sponsors

July 27th, 2004, 06:42 AM	#12
Heath McKnight MPS Digital Studios Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Palm Beach County, Florida Posts: 8,531	What did he use on Ali? I felt he shot way too loose on Ali, almost sloppy, I feel. But The Insider, wow, that was awesome. As far as setting up shots, Mann considers Ridley Scott to be in the upper "2%." heath __________________ My Final Cut Pro X blog

August 5th, 2004, 01:35 PM	#13
Yi Fong Yu Trustee Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Vulcan Posts: 1,564	hey guys!!! glad you guys have a thread already. i had been reading a movie-review & they mentioned HD. so i checked the specs on imdb and noticed you guys are already talking about it. this is ali: http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0248667/technical this is phantom menace: http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0120915/technical both ali and phantom use a mixture of film and digital. however... for collateral i ONLY see HD and unless imdb is wrong i think collateral is 100% all digital. i'm looking forward to seeing this flick digital or not! =). __________________ bow wow wow

August 5th, 2004, 01:45 PM	#14
Charles Papert Wrangler Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Los Angeles, CA Posts: 6,810	Collateral was indeed a mix of HD and film. Josh reported the story correctly. One of my pals was an operator on the show and he has confirmed this. Mann is interesting in that he is using whichever medium suits him for a given scene--not for the look, not for the economics, but for the capabilities. HD has given the director a way to shoot night exteriors that expose similar to the way the eye sees, something he discovered while shooting the opening scenes of "Ali" where Will Smith is running at night. I think he likes being an innovator as well. But he still seems to prefer the look of film when shooting in a controlled setting. __________________ Charles Papert www.charlespapert.com

August 5th, 2004, 02:01 PM	#15
Heath McKnight MPS Digital Studios Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Palm Beach County, Florida Posts: 8,531	Yi, Phantom Menace's printed format, other than 35 mm, was digital for DLP-equipped theatres. It wasn't shot digitally at all, other than digital effects. hwm __________________ My Final Cut Pro X blog