1/15,000th sec= 15,000fps? at DVinfo.net

Dr. Chad Zimmerman · June 3rd, 2003, 04:25 PM

I would like to use this camera in some very high speed photography. Can this pick up that many frames, or is it strictly the shutter speed only? IOW, does this film at 30fps with 1/15,000th of a second shutter speed and cannot exceed 30fps?

Help please!

Chad

Alex Knappenberger · June 3rd, 2003, 04:39 PM

Your camera stays at 30FPS no matter what, unless you have a variable framerate HD camera, or a film camera...

Using a shutter speed of over 1/500 will just make each frame extremely sharp, even the motion, instead of it being blurred.

Your still doing 30fps when you use a high shutter speed, it will just make all the frames sharp, like I said. If you want to slow it down below 33%, then you need a faster framerate. At 1/500 or above, you can take video of birds flying and have sharp frames of their wings, when flapping and crap.

Frank Granovski · June 3rd, 2003, 08:01 PM

Yes, as Alex says, it's still 60 fields per second, or 30 frames per second, depending which mode you use.

Don Palomaki · June 4th, 2003, 04:06 AM

NTSC video is always 60 fields/sec AND 30 frames /sec; i.e., always 2 fields/frame. (Well, 59.94 and 29.97 actually.) The difference is in frame mode, both fields of the frame are produced at the same time, so there is no 1/60 sec worth of subject motion between fields as is the case in normal (movie) mode.

Very fast shutter can freeze motion in the field, similar to fast shutter on still camera, and will give a somewhat different look/feel to video of high speed objects.

Hans Henrik Bang · June 4th, 2003, 06:12 AM

If you need something faster, check out "Wind River Systems". They make a camera that takes up to 100.000 fps.

They seem to use it for crash testing cars.

There is a small video about it here:

http://zdnet.com.com/1601-2-1000637.html

Peter Moore · June 4th, 2003, 08:28 AM

Yeah you need a special camera to do high speed photography. That's one area where film is vastly superior to video.

Nigel Moore · June 4th, 2003, 11:11 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Peter Moore : Yeah you need a special camera to do high speed photography. That's one area where film is vastly superior to video.

Errr, but the 100,000fps Wind River camera is digital, not film. Ad the image quality is allegedly better than the film that has been used.

Andre De Clercq · June 4th, 2003, 12:12 PM

Chad, does yr application relate to a (short) single event or a periiodic phenomenon (rotating machines, vibration analysis. ..)? In the latter case you can subsample the picture by using yr (NTSC/PAL)am in highest shutter speed (1/15000)and reconstruct on an NLE (if you don't need real time feedback)

Peter Moore · June 4th, 2003, 04:30 PM

That's amazing.

But you couldn't use digital video for high speed dramatic filming, at least not yet. You couldn't possibly have a digital camera at 4 megapixels take 2400 frames per second (1/100th slow motion), for example, at this point. You really need film for that.

Don Palomaki · June 4th, 2003, 06:28 PM

> 100,000fps Wind River camera is digital, not film

From their web siite:

" Roughly the size of a lunch box, the MotionXtra HG-100K can take physical forces of up to 100G, and is capable of capturing 1,000 frames per second (fps) with a razor-sharp resolution of 1504 x 1128 pixels—the highest resolution at 1000 fps available on the market today. Frame rates of 100,000 frames per second are also available at reduced resolutions."

Assuming a constant bandwidth, the 100K frame rate might be a ~112x150 pixel image.

Nigel Moore · June 5th, 2003, 01:40 AM

> But you couldn't use digital video for high speed dramatic filming, at least not yet

That's quite funny really, because the camera's been developed for crash test analysis in the automobile industry. Hence the high-impact resistance of the camera.

It's difficult to imagine anything much more dramatic or high(ish) speed! ;-)

Charles Papert · June 5th, 2003, 08:54 AM

Photosonics is the first name in motion picture high speed, and I see they have moved into digital high speed as well, although their specs in that area seem to be a bit below the abovementioned company.

Bob Hoskins · June 6th, 2003, 04:48 AM

have a look at this website

http://www.dynapel.com/

they produce some software for smoothing slow video, its quite good and makes a difference to just reducing the speed in your editor afterwards, its not that great either :) but its better than nothing and dont cost a whole lot!

June 3rd, 2003, 04:25 PM	#1
Dr. Chad Zimmerman Tourist Join Date: Jun 2003 Posts: 1	1/15,000th sec= 15,000fps? I would like to use this camera in some very high speed photography. Can this pick up that many frames, or is it strictly the shutter speed only? IOW, does this film at 30fps with 1/15,000th of a second shutter speed and cannot exceed 30fps? Help please! Chad

June 4th, 2003, 04:06 AM	#4
Don Palomaki Wrangler Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Northern VA Posts: 4,487	NTSC video is always 60 fields/sec AND 30 frames /sec; i.e., always 2 fields/frame. (Well, 59.94 and 29.97 actually.) The difference is in frame mode, both fields of the frame are produced at the same time, so there is no 1/60 sec worth of subject motion between fields as is the case in normal (movie) mode. Very fast shutter can freeze motion in the field, similar to fast shutter on still camera, and will give a somewhat different look/feel to video of high speed objects. __________________ dpalomaki@dspalomaki.com

June 4th, 2003, 06:28 PM	#10
Don Palomaki Wrangler Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Northern VA Posts: 4,487	> 100,000fps Wind River camera is digital, not film From their web siite: " Roughly the size of a lunch box, the MotionXtra HG-100K can take physical forces of up to 100G, and is capable of capturing 1,000 frames per second (fps) with a razor-sharp resolution of 1504 x 1128 pixels—the highest resolution at 1000 fps available on the market today. Frame rates of 100,000 frames per second are also available at reduced resolutions." Assuming a constant bandwidth, the 100K frame rate might be a ~112x150 pixel image. __________________ dpalomaki@dspalomaki.com

June 5th, 2003, 08:54 AM	#12
Charles Papert Wrangler Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Los Angeles, CA Posts: 6,810	Photosonics is the first name in motion picture high speed, and I see they have moved into digital high speed as well, although their specs in that area seem to be a bit below the abovementioned company. __________________ Charles Papert www.charlespapert.com

June 3rd, 2003, 04:39 PM	#2
Alex Knappenberger High School Student Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Canton, Ohio, USA Posts: 609	Your camera stays at 30FPS no matter what, unless you have a variable framerate HD camera, or a film camera... Using a shutter speed of over 1/500 will just make each frame extremely sharp, even the motion, instead of it being blurred. Your still doing 30fps when you use a high shutter speed, it will just make all the frames sharp, like I said. If you want to slow it down below 33%, then you need a faster framerate. At 1/500 or above, you can take video of birds flying and have sharp frames of their wings, when flapping and crap.

June 3rd, 2003, 08:01 PM	#3
Frank Granovski Outer Circle Join Date: May 2002 Location: Hope, BC Posts: 7,524	Yes, as Alex says, it's still 60 fields per second, or 30 frames per second, depending which mode you use.

June 4th, 2003, 06:12 AM	#5
Hans Henrik Bang Regular Crew Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Frederiksberg, Denmark Posts: 133	If you need something faster, check out "Wind River Systems". They make a camera that takes up to 100.000 fps. They seem to use it for crash testing cars. There is a small video about it here: http://zdnet.com.com/1601-2-1000637.html

June 4th, 2003, 08:28 AM	#6
Peter Moore Trustee Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Arlington VA Posts: 1,034	Yeah you need a special camera to do high speed photography. That's one area where film is vastly superior to video.

June 4th, 2003, 12:12 PM	#8
Andre De Clercq Major Player Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Belgium Posts: 804	Chad, does yr application relate to a (short) single event or a periiodic phenomenon (rotating machines, vibration analysis. ..)? In the latter case you can subsample the picture by using yr (NTSC/PAL)am in highest shutter speed (1/15000)and reconstruct on an NLE (if you don't need real time feedback)

June 4th, 2003, 04:30 PM	#9
Peter Moore Trustee Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Arlington VA Posts: 1,034	That's amazing. But you couldn't use digital video for high speed dramatic filming, at least not yet. You couldn't possibly have a digital camera at 4 megapixels take 2400 frames per second (1/100th slow motion), for example, at this point. You really need film for that.

June 5th, 2003, 01:40 AM	#11
Nigel Moore Major Player Join Date: May 2003 Location: Switzerland Posts: 358	> But you couldn't use digital video for high speed dramatic filming, at least not yet That's quite funny really, because the camera's been developed for crash test analysis in the automobile industry. Hence the high-impact resistance of the camera. It's difficult to imagine anything much more dramatic or high(ish) speed! ;-)

June 6th, 2003, 04:48 AM	#13
Bob Hoskins Tourist Join Date: May 2003 Location: bolta, england Posts: 1	have a look at this website http://www.dynapel.com/ they produce some software for smoothing slow video, its quite good and makes a difference to just reducing the speed in your editor afterwards, its not that great either :) but its better than nothing and dont cost a whole lot!