HDMI to DVI and the HV20
 

HDMI is basicaly a DVI signal.
Has anybody tried a simple HDMI to DVI adapter cable to plug in an LCD computer monitor?
does the resolution get scaled or is it full 1920x1080? does it work?

It will work. The problem that sometimes occur is a flaw in the design of some HDMI transmitters that causes highlight clipping, and black crush on certain DVI receiver chips. It's a widespread problem on Toshiba HD-DVD players. It's solved by using a monitor with HDMI input. Certain video processors IDVO, Lumagen etc., may have options for converting the PC 0-255 space to video 16-235, but those are expensive workarounds.

I was just about to ask a similar question...

I brought the HV20 back to the office today... all the
monitors are 20" LCDs with VGA and DVI input. (native
resolution 1680x1050) The monitor's manual claims that
it supported HD resolution. (but it's a computer monitor)

Using a HDMI-DVI cable, I plugged one end into the HV20
and the other to the monitor's DVI input. The picture
got scaled to 480i resolution. Not the sharp HD resolution,
but pretty good standard-def picture.

The HV20 and the monitor don't have an option to change
between 480, 720, or 1080...

Oh well... it was better than nothing...

HDMI to DVI - output is VGA only
 

Hey guys,

Just trying to get my hdmi out of the HV20 to my Dell 24" LCD. I'm using a cable that converts HDMI to DVI-D.

It only outputs SD Video 720x480. The monitor resolution in the menu on the Dell says 720x480.

On the camera the menu item says HDMI out DVI. Is there a way to force it to output the full resolution, or is this just the way it is converting to DVI?

Anyone have experience with this. I'm also getting this problem with the intensity card, but it won't display anything out of it, not even 720x480 if I convert to DVI.

Component works out of the camera though.


Chris

I thought I read somewhere that component is analog and can't compete in resolution to what HDMI can provide. Maybe someone can clear this up.

I used the same type of cable to connect my camera up to a 19" Acer we have where I work. I doubt that the Acer had better than a 12xx resolution. I have no idea what resolution it was receiving from the camera. I didn't know you could look at a menu setting on monitor to tell what resolution it was set at. Of course you can on a computer. I would have thought that the camera always outputs at the same resolution depending on whether you are in record or playback of the tape. I always assumed that the device connected to the camcorder downrezed to the highest it could display but that is just conjecture on my part. I wonder if there is a setting in your monitor to force a resolution.

Hi Chris..........
 

Chris,

You didn't say whether your Dell was one of the newer models with HDCP inbuilt. It is possible that the camera HDMI is expecting the monitor to indicate it is HDCP compliant, without which it will O/P only SD.

The difference between HDMI and DVI is only a different connector configuration and the absence of HDCP (tho' quite what a DVI device thinks of the embedded audio is an interesting question).

You might have to give me a bit more info on the Intensity card as I am utterly ignorant as to what it does or how.

CS

Component can have as much resolution as HDMI. Both can have 1920x1080 resolution. The only difference I know of is that HDMI supports Progressive and Component only supports Interlaced video.

As for the Dell monitor, it is a full 1920 x1200 resolution monitor so it can handle anything this camera can throw at it pixel for pixel. That's why I spent the $$ on the monitor.

As it stands the camera will not output full 1920x1080 resolution out the HDMI port to the monitor. (I get it into the computer when hooked up via the Intensity card) The only resolution I can see on my monitor via the HDMI to DVI cable is 720x480.

Now when I hook component up to the monitor from the camera, I see the whole 1920x1080. Funny!

I'm probably going to have to buy a new monitor with native HDMI or just move up to the Intensity Pro.

Chris

Whoops.....
 

Just to clarify that second paragraph - should be "was" not "is". Dell (and possibly others) are starting to incorporate HDCP in their big screens to work with HDMI enabled graphics cards.

CS

Chris,

I have an older version of the Dell monitor without HDCP so I'll try that monitor and see what happens. Your answers sounds like a good explanation to me. The newer Dell has better color, but I'm sure the older one will be fine. I'll let you know.

As for Intensity, it is an HDMI capture card from Decklink. It allows you to capture full bandwidth HD video (8 bit 1080i) pre camcorder compression, so no crappy HDV compression. They supply a motion Jpeg compression as well as uncompressed capture, if your drives can handle it. You can also use third party compression like Cineform. I'm using all of them with great results so far, but working through some of the limitations of "indie" gear ie cheap. Still amazing what it can do. Oh BTW the Intensity also allows HD preview in Premiere Pro and After Effects to a HD monitor so you can do more critical work.

Chris

Good try Chris but no Cigar.

I tried the older version of the Dell 24" LCD and still the same response, only 720x480 out to the monitor. Now I know you are right about the newer monitor having HDCP, and I'm about 99.9% sure that the older one doesn't have it, so I definitely think it has to do with the cable conversion and the camera. The camera needs to see something on the other end (HDMI Spec) or it only defaults to 720x480.

thanks,

Chris

Sorry...........
 

I think we were talking at cross purposes - I was proposing that maybe you were using the older model to start with. If it was one of the new ones WITH HDCP then I'm stumped as to why it won't give you full 1920 X 1080.

Still, if you Google "HDMI connection problem" you'll find page after page of instances where perfectly (supposedly) good HDMI O/P's won't talk to HDMI I/P's.

DVI off my laptop to my Sony Bravia works a treat, the DVI out on my desktop won't even raise a belch! Go figure.

CS

HDMI to DVI - output is VGA only
 

Here's the setup:

HV20 HDMI output to DVI via HDMI-to-DVI cable

Tried this on several Pioneer Plasmas (industrial models WXGA resolution) and Sony XGA LCD projectors... result is always VGA resolution on the DVI input.
Analogue component 1080i works perfectly with abovementioned displays.
Tried every combination and permutation of power-up and connection sequences.

Any suggestions?

It would be nice to utilise the many DVI capable WXGA displays out there... after all, it's *almost* full HD resolution

From page 69 of HV20 operator's manual:... Correct operation cannot be guaranteed when connecting the camcorder to DVI monitors (just merged three separate threads together covering this topic).

I got a Olevia HDTV 27" this past weekend and connecting the HV20 to it via HDMI and checking the display settings on the tv shows that it's receiving 1080i.

Chris Hurd is correct. Using a HDMI to DVI adapter is kind of hit and miss. HDMI sometimes doesn't like to be converted to DVI with some devices.

The HV20 is designed to hook up directly to HDMI devices and anything in between we are on our own. For any display devices that do not have HDMI I would just use component. Chances are a display that does not have HDMI will be older so I doubt you would really notice any better of a picture by using HDMI anyway.

This does however kill off using computer monitors as a HDTV unless that monitor has component inputs.

view over Firewire w/ VLC instead?
 

Here's an alternative:
If you simply want to view the HV20 (or HV10) video output on a computer monitor, but you don't have HDMI or component inputs on the monitor-
but you DO have 1394/firewire on your connected & running PC-

you could connect and view via firewire, using VideoLan's free VLC player. It will display incoming firewire stream (and deinterlace nicely) just fine.

Connect up your cam in HDV firewire, mode,
start VLC & do:
File menu, Open Capture Device... , DirectShow tab, select your HDV device (may have to refresh), click OK, and press play :)

This obviously isn't a help for monitor-only setups (eg in the field), or where the PC is busy or doesn't have firewire, but a lot less hassle than buying a new monitor or hacking about w/ DVI adapters. :)

Wow Colin.....I just did this and it works perfectly. I have a thought....but....what's stoping someone from writing a script to capture this off the VLC player into a decent codec of choice??? If it's after HDV compression ....then....it's not worth it....but if not....then ....wow.

edit: Apparently it can capture....but not necessarily as I thought.

HDMI to DVI works
 

I have done this a number of times, in fact, that is the setup I use to play back edited Windows Media HD shows from my laptop.

I use the DVI to HDMI cables from Sams Club or Comprehensive, an audio cable from computer headphone out to DVI/HDMI audio in on my HDTV, and the Sony 52" LCD.

There are a few tricks to doing this. HDTV s normally cut off a little of the image, which is a problem is working with computer because it clips of the taskbar. You also need an HDTV with an HDMI that can take separate audio if need be. When doing this, I set the TV to eliminate the overscan and show all the pixels.

Connecting the HV20 is even easier. The TV has another convenience HDMI on the side, however this one requires bundled audio with the HDMI so it is not a good one for the computer.

I have run the HV30 through there a few times with success.

Some TVs like the Sharp require a change deep in the menu system when doing the DVI to HDMI thing. On a non-1080p tv, it is not possible on a Sharp to eliminate the overscan.

I'm assuming it's after the HDV compression, since that is the data coming over the firewire :) I hadn't thought/ability to check live monitor/capture, but I doubt my monitor is good enough to notice any difference.

I believe yes it will also capture, just the raw M2T transport stream like HDVsplit would (but not scene split obviously)