My HDV Workflow with the XHA1

[Marty Hudzik]

Originally Posted by Peter J Alessandria

Marty - what are the specs on your machine? Does anyone know the minimum specs one could use with the Cineform codec and still get realtime performance?
Steven - how long are your Cineform HD avi downrez 24p mpeg for DVD's renders in Vegas? And what type of machine do you use? I've got a dual core Athlon 3800+ X2 system with 2GB of RAM and a couple of 300GB SATA drives and my 24p mpg renders in Vegas (DVX100) run between 1X and 2X realtime (usually closer to 2X) depending on how many layers/effects. So I'm wondering if downrezzing HD for standard DVD is more process intensive than a normal 24p .avi to mpeg render.

Well, I currently have a Intel Core2 Duo E6400 2.13ghz processor, 2 gigs of Ram and a couple of $75 250GB WD Sata drives in a Raid 0.

However I captured on my old P4 2.8GHZ with 1GB Ram and it would still import and convert in realtime. I think one time4 after captruing for an hour, it took an extra 2 minutes to finish converting after the capture stopped. No biggy.

[Steven Dempsey]

I've got roughly the same setup (except for a 3.4ghz processor) and I'm getting comparable results.

[Peter Ferling]

On a boxx 7400 quad it's real-time. On an old Dell precision 650, a dual xeon 3ghz (min spec for Cineform), it's about a 1:2 ratio (capture an hour, wait an hour for encode to finish). This is only because the 650 has a 7505 chipset, and it's only 400FSB. A single P4 3.2GHz with 800FSB would be faster.

However in edit, Dell 650, I can cut two layers HD, a title and maybe a graphic and get decent speed. For more complex stuff, CC, etc. I reserve for the Boxx.

[Marty Hudzik]

Originally Posted by Peter Ferling

On an old Dell precision 650, a dual xeon 3ghz (min spec for Cineform), it's about a 1:2 ratio (capture an hour, wait an hour for encode to finish). This is only because the 650 has a 7505 chipset, and it's only 400FSB. A single P4 3.2GHz with 800FSB would be faster.

I just captured 10 minutes of HDV to Cineform on my work computer yesterday. It is a dual Xeon 3ghz with 2GB ram and 266FSB. The tape stopped and I stopped the capture. There was a 10-15second buffer area as it finished encoding. This is the norm for me.

Your numbers on a similar machine are way out of whack with what I am seeing. You are talking double realtime. An hour to record and an hour to convert. That may be accurate but on my system it captures and converts at the same time....thus no need to wait after it is done.

Isn't this how it is supposed to work?

[Eric Weiss]

I understand. I wouldn't keep the m2ts, the tape serves as the back up
and I would indeed archive the cineform avi.

I would be sending small 1920/60i segments via ftp. 30-120 seconds for inclusion in programming. I sort of understand the 1440/1920 ratio..I am still worried that going from a 1440 avi to a 1920 mpeg will degrade the quality.

Has anyone tried this? Does Vegas understand and compensate for this encoding?

Thanks again for everyones help and patience.

Originally Posted by Marty Hudzik

Well first of all you don't have to keep the m2t files. So there is no absolute reason to keep 2 versions of the same clip. Still, the Cineform avis are going to be larger than the original .m2t files. But good HD footage is going to take up more space than SD DV footage. That is a given.

Second, you will need the client that wants 1920x1080 60i to let know what format to supply it them in. If it is a higher end format than Cineform then you will see no apparent loss in quality. If it is more compressed than Cineform then you may see a loss. That is really up to what format they require.

Simply uploading the files will have no affect on the quality whatsoever...although I can only imagine how long it would take to upload big HD files!

[Marty Hudzik]

Regarding the question about going to 1920.....I see no real difference. I have encoded a few of my final projects to HD MPG files. I have dones it 2 ways. 1920x1080 and 1440x1080 with a 1.33 PAR. When watching them on a 1080P 45 LCD I cannot tell which is which. However I would always want to supply a 1920x1080 to a client just to make it simple.

Originally Posted by Eric Weiss

I understand. I wouldn't keep the m2ts, the tape serves as the back up
and I would indeed archive the cineform avi.

I would be sending small 1920/60i segments via ftp. 30-120 seconds for inclusion in programming. I sort of understand the 1440/1920 ratio..I am still worried that going from a 1440 avi to a 1920 mpeg will degrade the quality.

Has anyone tried this? Does Vegas understand and compensate for this encoding?

Thanks again for everyones help and patience.

[William Boehm]

i need help understanding the basics of the best way to edit both 6 years of high quality SD family, nature and wildlife footage from a GL1 and HD canon xha1 that i want to begin editing. i own adobe PP1 that i purchased for $75 from a friend...and wanted to know should i upgrade to PP2 and stick with that program. I have never attempted to edit...so this is a first.

I read all the stuff out there..vegas 7, cineform, and quite frankly it overwhelms me as to the first step to take. i would rather not pay for the PP2 upgrade if there is a better system that could edit both my SD stuff and new HD. Want to reproduce and edit these tapes with the highest degree of accuracy and no loss of detail, yet have it work simply. i am just a biologist, not inclined to be a computer tech, although i am computer savy. thanks ahead for helping a newbie. bill

[Eric Weiss]

go with vegas. it's exactly what you need.

i went from editing on 3/4 and Beta machines with avid to vegas with no trouble. it was so easy, i cried.

[William Boehm]

again i am a novice. i understand the problems with compressed mp2 files and finding codex that will give good results. Is Vegas a editing software like pp2 and cinemode placed together? is the quality of any difference? i need some reasons why to dump the pp1.5 and upgrade to vegas. thanks again for all the expertise and help on this forum. bill

[Eric Weiss]

well, i found the learning curve on PP and Avid DV ( going from LE) to be quite steep. Vegas is just very user friendly.

I'm learning HDV too and have imported many m2t's from other sources -as I do not own an HDV cam. My system is pretty powerful and I really havent seen much difference editing raw m2t's or the cineform codec. However, I can clearly see, in Vegas 7, that you can import from an HDV source to
Cineform on the fly.

For your GL1 content, I can tell you without any doubt that Vegas is the best option for a beginner to import, edit, and deliver SD.

Grab the trial version from Sony and try it.

Originally Posted by William Boehm

again i am a novice. i understand the problems with compressed mp2 files and finding codex that will give good results. Is Vegas a editing software like pp2 and cinemode placed together? is the quality of any difference? i need some reasons why to dump the pp1.5 and upgrade to vegas. thanks again for all the expertise and help on this forum. bill

[Jonathan Gentry]

Steven

What is your file handling workflow. How do you manage your files so as not to get overrun with data?

-Jonathan