XL2 16X9 30P DSR-11 Moire & Stutter at DVinfo.net

Tom Reid · April 4th, 2005, 02:38 PM

Anyone have any problems playing tapes in a DSR-11 from an XL2? Man have I! The tapes stutter and look like drop out. The tapes play from the XL2 but we notice 5-6 scan lines perhaps that are "tearing" on the bottom when played from the camera and looked at in underscan. The lines point like small arrows outside of the vertical frame line. We don't see the "tearing" in the DSR-11 when playing the tape but then the DSR-11 makes the tape stutter and unusable. I've had similar problems with XL1's in the past. We've had two brand new cameras that both did this to us this week while shooting 7 hours of footage. Canon said we should FF the tape and then RW before recording! I've never heard this. It didn't help. Head cleaning hasn't helped. We are seeing moire in the water I've been shooting too! Canon has suggested that it's a tape path being slightly off and we need to send the camera in. Has anyone heard of this with new cameras...Please help!

Rob Lohman · April 5th, 2005, 03:43 AM

That is definitely possible with new camera's. Remember, they
are put together by an automated assembly line!

Winding and rewinding (part of) a tape is to get it tensioned.
The tape may be loose by all the shipping it has gone through etc.

Perhaps the specific type and brand of tape is to blame when
you have this problem across multiple camera's?

You are sure it is not interlacing you are looking at?

Do a search (button in the upper right corner) on "moire" and
pick the XL forum from the drop down below. There have been
numerous threads on how the increased resolution can give
problem with certain types of images (all high resolution, including
professional camera's, have this problem to some degree). Not
something you can easily "fix" if at all.

Tom Reid · April 7th, 2005, 01:37 PM

I've been reviewing the tapes again...

I think we are experiencing two problems....

1. Dirty heads from something on the heads from manufacturing.
2. Moire'-after reading most of the posts, the enhanced resolution is the problems. Changing focal lengths will easily fix my situation.

However, heads and tape paths. We use excellent tape stock and NEVER have had a problem while regurlarly cleaning heads. I find that FF and REW seem very counter productive and know of no one who does this.

The brand new camera I was shooting with still had the film grain function working. So, is this really an older camera. If so how old? Perhaps the heads came to me with more than needing a simple cleaning.

Tom

April 4th, 2005, 02:38 PM	#1
Tom Reid Regular Crew Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Orlando, FL Posts: 30	XL2 16X9 30P DSR-11 Moire & Stutter Anyone have any problems playing tapes in a DSR-11 from an XL2? Man have I! The tapes stutter and look like drop out. The tapes play from the XL2 but we notice 5-6 scan lines perhaps that are "tearing" on the bottom when played from the camera and looked at in underscan. The lines point like small arrows outside of the vertical frame line. We don't see the "tearing" in the DSR-11 when playing the tape but then the DSR-11 makes the tape stutter and unusable. I've had similar problems with XL1's in the past. We've had two brand new cameras that both did this to us this week while shooting 7 hours of footage. Canon said we should FF the tape and then RW before recording! I've never heard this. It didn't help. Head cleaning hasn't helped. We are seeing moire in the water I've been shooting too! Canon has suggested that it's a tape path being slightly off and we need to send the camera in. Has anyone heard of this with new cameras...Please help! __________________ Tom Reid TOM REID Motion & Stills tom@trmotionstills.com

April 5th, 2005, 03:43 AM	#2
Rob Lohman RED Code Chef Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Holland Posts: 12,514	That is definitely possible with new camera's. Remember, they are put together by an automated assembly line! Winding and rewinding (part of) a tape is to get it tensioned. The tape may be loose by all the shipping it has gone through etc. Perhaps the specific type and brand of tape is to blame when you have this problem across multiple camera's? You are sure it is not interlacing you are looking at? Do a search (button in the upper right corner) on "moire" and pick the XL forum from the drop down below. There have been numerous threads on how the increased resolution can give problem with certain types of images (all high resolution, including professional camera's, have this problem to some degree). Not something you can easily "fix" if at all. __________________ Rob Lohman, visuar@iname.com DV Info Wrangler & RED Code Chef Join the DV Challenge \| Lady X Search DVinfo.net for quick answers \| Buy from the best: DVinfo.net sponsors

April 7th, 2005, 01:37 PM	#3
Tom Reid Regular Crew Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Orlando, FL Posts: 30	I've been reviewing the tapes again... I think we are experiencing two problems.... 1. Dirty heads from something on the heads from manufacturing. 2. Moire'-after reading most of the posts, the enhanced resolution is the problems. Changing focal lengths will easily fix my situation. However, heads and tape paths. We use excellent tape stock and NEVER have had a problem while regurlarly cleaning heads. I find that FF and REW seem very counter productive and know of no one who does this. The brand new camera I was shooting with still had the film grain function working. So, is this really an older camera. If so how old? Perhaps the heads came to me with more than needing a simple cleaning. Tom __________________ Tom Reid TOM REID Motion & Stills tom@trmotionstills.com