lens adaptation for XL1s at DVinfo.net

Frank Meek · July 31st, 2004, 12:55 PM

I have recently inventoried the past thirty-five years of film and video equipment (no small task) that I have used, accumulated, forgotten and found. In any case, I have pulled some older Fujinon lenses from some long-stored tube cameras and discovered, to my surprise and delight, that they seem to be in great shape. One of these is a "C-mount" style and looks every bit like a manual lens (to 150mm, with filters, matte box and focus pull) that might be used on my XL1s, providing that I have an adaptor for such a thing. A cursory search of my official Canon "accessories" does not reveal such an item though I suppose if there is a demand (and I understand that this may not be so), that likely there exists an aftermarket adaptor somewhere. Clearly too, there may be a congenital backfocus issue with a transplanted, somewhat archaic lens.
The question for this forum, of course, is multilayered: What, where, how and how much?
Thanks for the assistance,
Frank

Jeff Donald · August 3rd, 2004, 10:43 AM

Frank, I don't understand your questions.

Charles Papert · August 3rd, 2004, 11:06 AM

Think I'm getting it; Frank is looking for a c-mount adaptor for the XL lens port?

Frank Meek · August 4th, 2004, 12:44 AM

Sorry folks, I did not mean to warp the language in my quest for a solution to my using an older manual focus lens from a camera long ago put to rest, albeit gracefully. This lens, as it happens, is replete with accessories which would be well suited to my Xl1s. As Mr. Papert accurately intuited, my questions include, Does such as item exist? Is it available for purchase? If so, at what price? And further, is backfocus (a seemingly mystical realm for the XL1s) an issue with non-Canon lenses generally, or any specifically?
Thanks for your patience and for your very fine and professional forum.
Frank

Jeff Donald · August 4th, 2004, 06:10 AM

I would check with ZGC, OpTex and Century Precesion Optical for the adapter. I think a phone call will be required as their web sites and catalogs don't list all the adapters they may have access to.

John Mercer · August 4th, 2004, 12:21 PM

I asked Optex in the UK some time ago about a c-mount adaptor for the XL1s and they said at the time it was not possible - I'm not sure what the technical reason was.

I was specifically interested in being able to use some of the Angenieux and Schneider lenses designed for the Super 8 Beaulieu 'pro' cameras. I have a beautiful 6-80 mm Angenieux lens on my Beaulieu 4008ZMII, and since Super 8 and 1/3" chips have pretty close focal lengths it seemed to me that this might have been an interesting addition to Canon's ability.

There were quite a few of these lenses and they are still available re-manufactured.

Robert J. Wolff · August 7th, 2004, 05:11 AM

John

There is no adaptor presently available for the old "C" mount lens; or, for that matter, most '60ish lenses.. Canon, like Nikon, changed their interchangeable mount systems, in the early to mid '70's. I have no knowledge about other manufacturers, but, I assume that they also changed.

The reason that they changed was the "new" thru-the-lens metering & electronic control systems. They needed more space back of the lens.

I have an almost mint condition 100mm Canon lens circa '64. Wanna trade?

John Mercer · August 7th, 2004, 05:54 AM

Hi Robert,

Yes I think the reason Optex gave was something to do with rear element spacing - i.e. the rear element of C-mount lenses needs to get closer to the XL1s than an adaptor would allow, therefore a physical modification would have to be made to the lenses themselves.

However, I hope I'm not misunderstanding you, but I wasn't talking about still lenses, I meant a C-mount to XL adaptor, for using Super 8 and 16mm interchangeable cine lenses with the XL1s.

The Super 8 lenses were made mostly to fit the Beaulieu range of cameras and their focal lengths are almost identical to 1/3" chip lenses for the XL1s - 6-80mm Angenieux for instance. This is a beautifully made lense with real T-stops. Pro8 in Hollywood still sell these type of lenses remanufactured and it seemed to me at the time a much better route than adapting Fujinon so-so lenses from 1/2" chip cameras.

Optex seemed to be certain that it was not possible to make a C-mount adaptor for the reasons, I think, outlined above, but I'd love to see someone have a go.

Interestingly you could get adaptors for the Beaulieu C-mount for Nikon, Pentax, Canon etc. still lenses - no problem.

Best regards,
John.

Robert J. Wolff · August 7th, 2004, 01:55 PM

John.

Forgive me for suggesting that you are flogging the dummy, (beating a dead horse).

Here is the deal, as I see it: No matter how hard you want the manufacturers to update your/mine equipment from ancient days of press-ort video imagination in the '60's, to the equipment of today, they are not going to do it.

Why? Other than folks like us who own such equipment, who needs it? The stuff is obsolete!!! By 30 to 40 YEARS!

B Mount! C Mount! D mount! Are NO mount.

Canon is struggeling with the problem of keeping it's long list of lenses from becoming obsolete when HD really takes over, in about another year.

In my collection of cameras, I have 2 of my grand parents folding bellows, circa, 1893, cameras. They have been maticulusly restored by professionals to their original "out of the box" condition. I have had Kodak specially make up film for them,………Fantastic PICS!

WOW!

Now what? Should movies stop production, and return to still photography?

In my opinion, any piece of tech equipment since 2K1, lies dead in the dark room.

I am not jumping on your thoughts, John. I just suggest that you built a shelf, like I have done in my house hold, to hold some of this "treasured junk", to impress the neighbors.

As for the rest: Thats what they make the corner of a garage for.

(I know, I am just a little too blunt. Foregive me.)

John Mercer · August 8th, 2004, 07:06 AM

Robert,

You're not too blunt - no problem! But you have got the wrong end of the stick I fear.

I said this was something I looked into quite a while ago and so I'm not flogging a dead horse any more.

I must point out as well that these C-mount lenses are still available new or re-manufactured as well as second hand. Pro 8 have them in 16:9 too (or 16:9 adaptor) so they can hardly be considered ancient history. As I say too I wasn't interested in still 35mm lenses just these Super 8 cine lenses.

Furthermore these lenses are of very professional high quality (every bit as good as their 16mm counterparts), with full manual control and true T-stop markings. They are in my opinion of better quality even than Canon's 16x manual. But more to the point they are of perfect focal lengths for the Canon XL1s.

The fact of the matter remains that it doesn't look possible to fit them with merely an adaptor to the Canon XL1s, something more drastic and costly would be required and so all this is moot anyway - it's just a pity that's all.

Hope this clears up any confusion.

Best regards,
John.

July 31st, 2004, 12:55 PM	#1
Frank Meek Regular Crew Join Date: May 2004 Location: Jackson, WY/Steamboat CO Posts: 43	lens adaptation for XL1s I have recently inventoried the past thirty-five years of film and video equipment (no small task) that I have used, accumulated, forgotten and found. In any case, I have pulled some older Fujinon lenses from some long-stored tube cameras and discovered, to my surprise and delight, that they seem to be in great shape. One of these is a "C-mount" style and looks every bit like a manual lens (to 150mm, with filters, matte box and focus pull) that might be used on my XL1s, providing that I have an adaptor for such a thing. A cursory search of my official Canon "accessories" does not reveal such an item though I suppose if there is a demand (and I understand that this may not be so), that likely there exists an aftermarket adaptor somewhere. Clearly too, there may be a congenital backfocus issue with a transplanted, somewhat archaic lens. The question for this forum, of course, is multilayered: What, where, how and how much? Thanks for the assistance, Frank

August 3rd, 2004, 10:43 AM	#2
Jeff Donald Warden Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Clearwater, FL Posts: 8,287	Frank, I don't understand your questions. __________________ Jeff Donald Carpe Diem Search DVinfo.net for quick answers \| Where to Buy? From the best in the business: DVinfo.net sponsors

August 3rd, 2004, 11:06 AM	#3
Charles Papert Wrangler Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Los Angeles, CA Posts: 6,810	Think I'm getting it; Frank is looking for a c-mount adaptor for the XL lens port? __________________ Charles Papert www.charlespapert.com

August 4th, 2004, 12:44 AM	#4
Frank Meek Regular Crew Join Date: May 2004 Location: Jackson, WY/Steamboat CO Posts: 43	"C-Mount" lens adator Sorry folks, I did not mean to warp the language in my quest for a solution to my using an older manual focus lens from a camera long ago put to rest, albeit gracefully. This lens, as it happens, is replete with accessories which would be well suited to my Xl1s. As Mr. Papert accurately intuited, my questions include, Does such as item exist? Is it available for purchase? If so, at what price? And further, is backfocus (a seemingly mystical realm for the XL1s) an issue with non-Canon lenses generally, or any specifically? Thanks for your patience and for your very fine and professional forum. Frank

August 4th, 2004, 06:10 AM	#5
Jeff Donald Warden Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Clearwater, FL Posts: 8,287	I would check with ZGC, OpTex and Century Precesion Optical for the adapter. I think a phone call will be required as their web sites and catalogs don't list all the adapters they may have access to. __________________ Jeff Donald Carpe Diem Search DVinfo.net for quick answers \| Where to Buy? From the best in the business: DVinfo.net sponsors

August 4th, 2004, 12:21 PM	#6
John Mercer Regular Crew Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Spain Posts: 73	I asked Optex in the UK some time ago about a c-mount adaptor for the XL1s and they said at the time it was not possible - I'm not sure what the technical reason was. I was specifically interested in being able to use some of the Angenieux and Schneider lenses designed for the Super 8 Beaulieu 'pro' cameras. I have a beautiful 6-80 mm Angenieux lens on my Beaulieu 4008ZMII, and since Super 8 and 1/3" chips have pretty close focal lengths it seemed to me that this might have been an interesting addition to Canon's ability. There were quite a few of these lenses and they are still available re-manufactured.

August 7th, 2004, 05:11 AM	#7
Robert J. Wolff Major Player Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Adirondacks of New York Posts: 210	John There is no adaptor presently available for the old "C" mount lens; or, for that matter, most '60ish lenses.. Canon, like Nikon, changed their interchangeable mount systems, in the early to mid '70's. I have no knowledge about other manufacturers, but, I assume that they also changed. The reason that they changed was the "new" thru-the-lens metering & electronic control systems. They needed more space back of the lens. I have an almost mint condition 100mm Canon lens circa '64. Wanna trade? __________________ Himself

August 7th, 2004, 05:54 AM	#8
John Mercer Regular Crew Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Spain Posts: 73	Hi Robert, Yes I think the reason Optex gave was something to do with rear element spacing - i.e. the rear element of C-mount lenses needs to get closer to the XL1s than an adaptor would allow, therefore a physical modification would have to be made to the lenses themselves. However, I hope I'm not misunderstanding you, but I wasn't talking about still lenses, I meant a C-mount to XL adaptor, for using Super 8 and 16mm interchangeable cine lenses with the XL1s. The Super 8 lenses were made mostly to fit the Beaulieu range of cameras and their focal lengths are almost identical to 1/3" chip lenses for the XL1s - 6-80mm Angenieux for instance. This is a beautifully made lense with real T-stops. Pro8 in Hollywood still sell these type of lenses remanufactured and it seemed to me at the time a much better route than adapting Fujinon so-so lenses from 1/2" chip cameras. Optex seemed to be certain that it was not possible to make a C-mount adaptor for the reasons, I think, outlined above, but I'd love to see someone have a go. Interestingly you could get adaptors for the Beaulieu C-mount for Nikon, Pentax, Canon etc. still lenses - no problem. Best regards, John.

August 7th, 2004, 01:55 PM	#9
Robert J. Wolff Major Player Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Adirondacks of New York Posts: 210	John. Forgive me for suggesting that you are flogging the dummy, (beating a dead horse). Here is the deal, as I see it: No matter how hard you want the manufacturers to update your/mine equipment from ancient days of press-ort video imagination in the '60's, to the equipment of today, they are not going to do it. Why? Other than folks like us who own such equipment, who needs it? The stuff is obsolete!!! By 30 to 40 YEARS! B Mount! C Mount! D mount! Are NO mount. Canon is struggeling with the problem of keeping it's long list of lenses from becoming obsolete when HD really takes over, in about another year. In my collection of cameras, I have 2 of my grand parents folding bellows, circa, 1893, cameras. They have been maticulusly restored by professionals to their original "out of the box" condition. I have had Kodak specially make up film for them,………Fantastic PICS! WOW! Now what? Should movies stop production, and return to still photography? In my opinion, any piece of tech equipment since 2K1, lies dead in the dark room. I am not jumping on your thoughts, John. I just suggest that you built a shelf, like I have done in my house hold, to hold some of this "treasured junk", to impress the neighbors. As for the rest: Thats what they make the corner of a garage for. (I know, I am just a little too blunt. Foregive me.) __________________ Himself

August 8th, 2004, 07:06 AM	#10
John Mercer Regular Crew Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Spain Posts: 73	Robert, You're not too blunt - no problem! But you have got the wrong end of the stick I fear. I said this was something I looked into quite a while ago and so I'm not flogging a dead horse any more. I must point out as well that these C-mount lenses are still available new or re-manufactured as well as second hand. Pro 8 have them in 16:9 too (or 16:9 adaptor) so they can hardly be considered ancient history. As I say too I wasn't interested in still 35mm lenses just these Super 8 cine lenses. Furthermore these lenses are of very professional high quality (every bit as good as their 16mm counterparts), with full manual control and true T-stop markings. They are in my opinion of better quality even than Canon's 16x manual. But more to the point they are of perfect focal lengths for the Canon XL1s. The fact of the matter remains that it doesn't look possible to fit them with merely an adaptor to the Canon XL1s, something more drastic and costly would be required and so all this is moot anyway - it's just a pity that's all. Hope this clears up any confusion. Best regards, John.