XL1/XL1s aspect ratio question from a newbie at DVinfo.net

David J. Payne · October 31st, 2005, 01:25 PM

Hey,
First off I'm really sorry to post such an obvious question but i have honestly looked everywhere on these boards and i cant find a definate answer anywhere!
I read (ironically probably on here) that there exists a genuine 16:9 ratio and a sort of electronically created one that takes a 4:3, strips some off of the top and bottom and therefore loses some lines of resolution... Could somebody tell me if this is one of the differences between the XL1 and XL1s? or has the XL1s also got the 'faked' (looking for someone to give me the proper term...) aspect ratio.
I could just about afford the XL1 now ive found out about the 24p on the XL1s and I'm thinking about going for that instead. Its mainly for wedding videos but I also want to continue making short films and music vids so would like something with a bit of diversity... anything else you could recommend would also be greatly appreciated.
Thanks in advance
David Payne

Boyd Ostroff · October 31st, 2005, 02:19 PM

David, I think you may be confusing the XL1s with the XL2. The XL2 has 24p and 30p (progressive scan) and native 16:9 support. The XL1s does not, and was just an upgrade to the original XL1.

All standard definition DV cameras write a 720x480 image to tape, regardless of whether they natively shoot 16:9 or not. 16:9 footage is "squashed" horizontally to fit that size, then on playback it's stretched back out into the proper proportion. The difference between 16:9 modes in the various cameras has to do with the resolution of the CCD's. A camera like the XL1s chops off the top and bottom of a 4:3 image (as you describe) and uses only 720x360 pixels which it then stretches back to 720x480 for recording. This results in a 25% loss of vertical resolution. The XL2's CCD's have enough pixels to capture the full 480 vertical lines however. So it takes a 960x480 image and squashes it to 720x480. This results in higher resolution since you had more information to start. But either way the end result is 720x480.

See Chris' article on the XL2 CCD's for more info:

http://dvinfo.net/canonxl2/articles/article06.php

David J. Payne · October 31st, 2005, 02:46 PM

hmm thats a great help, thanks.
The only thing that confuses me is this article on the XL1s :

http://reviews-zdnet.com.com/Canon_X...6751315-7.html

during the video review on the right I'm sure I can see a 24p 30p 60i etc switch when the video says 14 secs remaining... have i missed something and this is infact a XL2?

And if what you say is correct, what are the important differences between the XL1 and XL1s as I dont think i can afford the XL2!

Also I have looked for examples of XL1 raw footage but cannot find many.. where am i not looking?!

Many thanks again
David

Boyd Ostroff · October 31st, 2005, 03:06 PM

Yep, that's an XL2 and it even says XL2 in the info under the image.

I don't have a Canon camcorder, but Chris has put together just about everything you could possibly want to know about the XL1 and XL1s here:

http://www.dvinfo.net/canon/index.php

David J. Payne · October 31st, 2005, 03:15 PM

this chris man seems to be a genius. many thanks for your help I will look through it now.

October 31st, 2005, 01:25 PM	#1
David J. Payne Major Player Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Southend-On-Sea, England Posts: 368	XL1/XL1s aspect ratio question from a newbie Hey, First off I'm really sorry to post such an obvious question but i have honestly looked everywhere on these boards and i cant find a definate answer anywhere! I read (ironically probably on here) that there exists a genuine 16:9 ratio and a sort of electronically created one that takes a 4:3, strips some off of the top and bottom and therefore loses some lines of resolution... Could somebody tell me if this is one of the differences between the XL1 and XL1s? or has the XL1s also got the 'faked' (looking for someone to give me the proper term...) aspect ratio. I could just about afford the XL1 now ive found out about the 24p on the XL1s and I'm thinking about going for that instead. Its mainly for wedding videos but I also want to continue making short films and music vids so would like something with a bit of diversity... anything else you could recommend would also be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance David Payne

October 31st, 2005, 02:19 PM	#2
Boyd Ostroff Wrangler Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Mays Landing, NJ Posts: 11,787	David, I think you may be confusing the XL1s with the XL2. The XL2 has 24p and 30p (progressive scan) and native 16:9 support. The XL1s does not, and was just an upgrade to the original XL1. All standard definition DV cameras write a 720x480 image to tape, regardless of whether they natively shoot 16:9 or not. 16:9 footage is "squashed" horizontally to fit that size, then on playback it's stretched back out into the proper proportion. The difference between 16:9 modes in the various cameras has to do with the resolution of the CCD's. A camera like the XL1s chops off the top and bottom of a 4:3 image (as you describe) and uses only 720x360 pixels which it then stretches back to 720x480 for recording. This results in a 25% loss of vertical resolution. The XL2's CCD's have enough pixels to capture the full 480 vertical lines however. So it takes a 960x480 image and squashes it to 720x480. This results in higher resolution since you had more information to start. But either way the end result is 720x480. See Chris' article on the XL2 CCD's for more info: http://dvinfo.net/canonxl2/articles/article06.php

October 31st, 2005, 02:46 PM	#3
David J. Payne Major Player Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Southend-On-Sea, England Posts: 368	hmm thats a great help, thanks. The only thing that confuses me is this article on the XL1s : http://reviews-zdnet.com.com/Canon_X...6751315-7.html during the video review on the right I'm sure I can see a 24p 30p 60i etc switch when the video says 14 secs remaining... have i missed something and this is infact a XL2? And if what you say is correct, what are the important differences between the XL1 and XL1s as I dont think i can afford the XL2! Also I have looked for examples of XL1 raw footage but cannot find many.. where am i not looking?! Many thanks again David

October 31st, 2005, 03:06 PM	#4
Boyd Ostroff Wrangler Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Mays Landing, NJ Posts: 11,787	Yep, that's an XL2 and it even says XL2 in the info under the image. I don't have a Canon camcorder, but Chris has put together just about everything you could possibly want to know about the XL1 and XL1s here: http://www.dvinfo.net/canon/index.php

October 31st, 2005, 03:15 PM	#5
David J. Payne Major Player Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Southend-On-Sea, England Posts: 368	this chris man seems to be a genius. many thanks for your help I will look through it now.