Movement Trail in Final File at DVinfo.net

Bob Jerome · October 19th, 2008, 07:07 PM

Whether it's Cineform avi or any other media-encoded file format, the movement of the subjects leave a strobe-like trail. The trail is there even when the subject doesn't move as long as there's camera movement.

I capture through HDLink, with all the recommended settings on the Cineform forum for the HV20 camera. I edit on Adobe Premiere CS3 (Aspect HD). The only thing I didn't choose specifically is the FRAME FORMAT which I left on "Automatic" rather than "progressive". I figure Cineform will be right detecting if the format is interlaced on progressive with that option. Other than that, I check REMOVE 3-2 PULL DOWN (HV20) and DE-INTERLACE 1080i.

When I add slower/faster time remapping speeds, the strobe trail in movement is even worse. That's the biggest headache I have with Cineform to date. Everything else seems to work fine. I do have XHA1 cameras which I'm going to test later, but right now, I'm testing the HV20. Here's an illustration of what I'm talking about:

We Were Kids on Vimeo

PLEASE HELP and feel free to ADVISE! I'm a newbie by ALL counts.

David Newman · October 20th, 2008, 09:06 AM

User error. :)

You have a progressive source, yes it is 24p with 60i, and that is solved with the pulldown removal. You have added deinterlace, yet is redundant for a 24p source. If you combine pulldown removal and deinterlace, HDLink assumes you have standard 60i stream. Turn de-interlace off and everything will look fine.

Bob Jerome · October 20th, 2008, 01:31 PM

Thanks. I'll try it.

Bob Jerome · October 24th, 2008, 03:00 PM

Hi David. I was so excited to make the change you requested. But unfortunately, the movement trail is still there. I looked at the clips in the camera to make sure there was no trail in the original clips. And there was none. Those trails got added from the capture through HDLink.

When I export the movie out, whether it's in Cineform AVI form with the defaulted 23.976 fps or through the media encoder (23.976, 24, 25, or 30 fps), the "trail" result is the same.

I really don't know what's going on! Through vimeo, I see tons of HV20 materials with smooth movement (no trail) even for fast moving camera shots and fast subject movements when they use capture or Edit tools other than HDLink or Aspect HD. PLEASE HELP!

Desmond Sukotjo · October 24th, 2008, 05:11 PM

Bob. I think you're experiencing the same problem as mine. I use HDLink to convert my EX1 (mp4) files to Cineform AVI. And I think it is an interlace issue. Whether I use deInterlace option or not in HDLink, the result still the same. Checkout my post.

My source clip is MP4 from EX1, 50i, 1920x1080. In HDLink, I used No Speed Change, No deinterlace, and Interlace option next to Quality was set to Automatic (changed to Interlace, Progressive, but this didn't seem to matter anyway).

http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/cineform-...e-problem.html

I just want to go from MP4 EX1 to Cineform AVI, 50i, 1920x1080, but I got trail like yours.

Bob Jerome · October 28th, 2008, 02:36 PM

Dave ... Can you help on this one?

October 19th, 2008, 07:07 PM	#1
Bob Jerome Regular Crew Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Bridgeport, CT (USA) Posts: 32	Movement Trail in Final File Whether it's Cineform avi or any other media-encoded file format, the movement of the subjects leave a strobe-like trail. The trail is there even when the subject doesn't move as long as there's camera movement. I capture through HDLink, with all the recommended settings on the Cineform forum for the HV20 camera. I edit on Adobe Premiere CS3 (Aspect HD). The only thing I didn't choose specifically is the FRAME FORMAT which I left on "Automatic" rather than "progressive". I figure Cineform will be right detecting if the format is interlaced on progressive with that option. Other than that, I check REMOVE 3-2 PULL DOWN (HV20) and DE-INTERLACE 1080i. When I add slower/faster time remapping speeds, the strobe trail in movement is even worse. That's the biggest headache I have with Cineform to date. Everything else seems to work fine. I do have XHA1 cameras which I'm going to test later, but right now, I'm testing the HV20. Here's an illustration of what I'm talking about: We Were Kids on Vimeo PLEASE HELP and feel free to ADVISE! I'm a newbie by ALL counts.

October 20th, 2008, 09:06 AM	#2
David Newman CTO, CineForm Inc. Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Cardiff-by-the-Sea, California Posts: 8,095	User error. :) You have a progressive source, yes it is 24p with 60i, and that is solved with the pulldown removal. You have added deinterlace, yet is redundant for a 24p source. If you combine pulldown removal and deinterlace, HDLink assumes you have standard 60i stream. Turn de-interlace off and everything will look fine. __________________ David Newman -- web: www.gopro.com blog: cineform.blogspot.com -- twitter: twitter.com/David_Newman

October 20th, 2008, 01:31 PM	#3
Bob Jerome Regular Crew Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Bridgeport, CT (USA) Posts: 32	Thanks. I'll try it.

October 24th, 2008, 03:00 PM	#4
Bob Jerome Regular Crew Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Bridgeport, CT (USA) Posts: 32	Hi David. I was so excited to make the change you requested. But unfortunately, the movement trail is still there. I looked at the clips in the camera to make sure there was no trail in the original clips. And there was none. Those trails got added from the capture through HDLink. When I export the movie out, whether it's in Cineform AVI form with the defaulted 23.976 fps or through the media encoder (23.976, 24, 25, or 30 fps), the "trail" result is the same. I really don't know what's going on! Through vimeo, I see tons of HV20 materials with smooth movement (no trail) even for fast moving camera shots and fast subject movements when they use capture or Edit tools other than HDLink or Aspect HD. PLEASE HELP!

October 24th, 2008, 05:11 PM	#5
Desmond Sukotjo Regular Crew Join Date: May 2004 Location: San Francisco, CA Posts: 88	Bob. I think you're experiencing the same problem as mine. I use HDLink to convert my EX1 (mp4) files to Cineform AVI. And I think it is an interlace issue. Whether I use deInterlace option or not in HDLink, the result still the same. Checkout my post. My source clip is MP4 from EX1, 50i, 1920x1080. In HDLink, I used No Speed Change, No deinterlace, and Interlace option next to Quality was set to Automatic (changed to Interlace, Progressive, but this didn't seem to matter anyway). http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/cineform-...e-problem.html I just want to go from MP4 EX1 to Cineform AVI, 50i, 1920x1080, but I got trail like yours.

October 28th, 2008, 02:36 PM	#6
Bob Jerome Regular Crew Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Bridgeport, CT (USA) Posts: 32	Dave ... Can you help on this one?