Audio volume too low with NeoSCENE

[Eugenia Loli-Queru]

I just tested the latest NeoSCENE, and I converted this HF11 .m2ts file http://xnk.nu/pf24/00028.mts to Cineform AVI, using the default NeoSCENE options. When later I imported both files on Vegas Pro 8.0c to compare them, the audio in the cineform clip had half the volume off of the original file. Screenshot showing the problem here: http://eugenia.gnomefiles.org/images/audio-levels.jpg
Project properties tried both as 5.1 and stereo. I checked with other apps too apart from Vegas, and indeed, the Cineform file has half the volume off of the original file. Is this a bug?

[David Newman]

Not a bug in Neo Scene is it doesn't touch the audio itself, and the AVI stores only uncompressed audio. Neo Scene simply plays the source and using whatever Ac3 Filter is installed to convert the audio to uncompressed for the AVI. Filters like the one from AC3Filter.net do have gain settings so you could check that out.

[Eugenia Loli-Queru]

I do have the AC3 filter installed (it works), but I see no gain settings anywhere. Could you instruct me where to find that preference panel or how to invoke it? I went to the Sound settings in XP's control panel where I can view the audio codecs installed on the system that happen to have GUI settings, but AC3Filter was not listed there.

[David Newman]

Mine shows up under Start->Programs->AC3Filter->AC3Filter Config

[Eugenia Loli-Queru]

Ok, found it, and made a few tests. I had to change its gain to +5.3 to get an almost identical waveform to the original .m2ts file with cineform. I hope I am not losing quality though by cranking up the gain...

[David Newman]

Also it could be that Vegas's M2TS audio decoding is wrong.

[Eugenia Loli-Queru]

No, it's not the case. It's a problem with either the AC3 filter, or the way Cineform works with it. As I said in my first post, I tried decoding both streams with VLC (ffmpeg) and WMP (VfW) too, they had the same problem as Vegas, so the problem is really not with Vegas.

I think Cineform should look at the problem, not because it might be or not be your bug, but because it's important to offer the right output to your users, out of the box.

[David Newman]

It might be worth sending a note to AC3filter.net, but there is nothing CineForm can do if there is a problem in that component, short of recommending another. That all said, I'm not seeing any issue here. Waveform all look the same: native Vegas vs Cyberlink Audio Decoder vs AC3filter.

[Eugenia Loli-Queru]

Aha! I had an older version of the AC3Filter that created the problem! I uninstall it, installed the new one, and it now works perfectly! Thanks! My version was 1.09. Latest is 1.51 as of now.

[David Newman]

Cool! If only we could change thread titles.

[Mike Lewis]

I'd be interested to know why you use AC3filter on the audio. As a result I lose my Panasonic camcorder's 5.1 output. Can't you just allow the stream into the output transparently as an option, like one can with VDUB?

[David Newman]

We decompress the audio, as there are many tools are can't run AC3 or other compressed audio codecs. As for 5.1 there is very little surround information being acquired, and of course Pro applications never use camera audio, plus 5.1 and 7.1 are best created in post, or aquiried with multiple external mic sources. You can always use the audio from the MOV.

[Mike Lewis]

Originally Posted by David Newman

We decompress the audio, as there are many tools are can't run AC3 or other compressed audio codecs. As for 5.1 there is very little surround information being acquired, and of course Pro applications never use camera audio, plus 5.1 and 7.1 are best created in post, or aquiried with multiple external mic sources. You can always use the audio from the MOV.

Thanks for your reply.
But, by the pricing you've set for NeoScene, this product doesn't seem aimed at the 'pro' community. I agree that Canon and others are still stuck in the old stereo era, but others are moving forward. Most 'home' NLEs except for Adobe Premier pass 5.1 through from AVCHD in to their output. And as I've pointed out on another thread, the 5.1 separation on the inbuilt mikes on Panasonics is much better than I anticipated. Still, it's your choice!

[David Newman]

Originally Posted by Mike Lewis

Thanks for your reply.
But, by the pricing you've set for NeoScene, this product doesn't seem aimed at the 'pro' community. I agree that Canon and others are still stuck in the old stereo era, but others are moving forward. Most 'home' NLEs except for Adobe Premier pass 5.1 through from AVCHD in to their output. And as I've pointed out on another thread, the 5.1 separation on the inbuilt mikes on Panasonics is much better than I anticipated. Still, it's your choice!

Agreed that NeoScene is aimed for the non-Pro, but its origins are from pro products, impacting it internal processing path. Also the non-Pro would have more issue will 5.1 compatibility, so uncompressed audio makes the system more compatible reducing tech support. For example, you are the only one to ever mention this, this is not a concern of the market.