Odyssey Feature Request

[Dave Allen]

Dan if the 7Q can't do the Sony FS700 end trigger buffer thing at 2K Raw, at 240 fps, can it be programmed to do either a 4K RAW to ProRes HD at 240fps end trigger buffer style, or direct ProRes HD end trigger thing? We would hate to lose altogether the end trigger feature which the FS700 can handle internally to an SD card.

[Dan Keaton]

Dear Dave,

Once we upgrade our Apple ProRes 422 feature to support 1080p60, then you will be able to use the FS700, HD (1920 x 1080) high-speed cache recording feature.

The FS700 outputs 4K Raw (continuously) at up to 60 fps.

The FS700 has a 4K Raw at 120 fps feature for a little less than 4 seconds.

We will support this mode in the future via a free firmware update.

Respectfully,

[John Mastrogiacomo]

Dan,

Is ProRes 1080p 60fps video going to require additional Apple approval?

Thanks for any information.

[Dan Keaton]

Dear John,

I am not certain, sorry.

Respectfully,

[Daniel Bramm]

When will I be able to update the firmware in my 7Q through USB?.

I have put several inquires into Amber, unfortunately with no response.

Do I really need to spend $400.00 so I can have audio meters and the other new features.

[Olof Ekbergh]

Maybe you can rent an SSD for a day...

[Chris Medico]

Also check with any other local freelancers and you may find someone that can help with a firmware update. If you were here in NC I would certainly upgrade your firmware for you.

[Dan Keaton]

Originally Posted by Daniel Bramm

When will I be able to update the firmware in my 7Q through USB?.

I have put several inquires into Amber, unfortunately with no response.

Do I really need to spend $400.00 so I can have audio meters and the other new features.

Dear Daniel,

We certainly do not want to force you to purchase an SSD just to perform an firmware update.

We want to add USB support as soon as practical.

I hope we can find a solution for you, or find someone near you with an SSD.

We may find another solution also. Please feel free to send me a Private Message or call me.

My 719 number is best.

Support | Convergent Design

Respectfully,

[Ole Salomonsen]

Hi,

after having used the 7Q with the FS700R for a few months now, I have to say I love it. (Particularly after the v2 fw which adds 4K slomo)

There are however a few things that I think could be improved (easily) in software:

No doubt the 7Q sucks a lot of power. And it annoys me that I have to switch of the unit to prevent the display eating up the battery between shooting, so:

1. There should be an option to completely and easily switch OFF (and ON) the LED display to reduce power consumption. - And even being able to record with the display off would be nice. This LED OFF/ON option could be a selectable option on the F1 lock button. I would also think it should be possible to bypass a video signal from the 7Q to for example my video goggles, so that I could see the recording and display from the 7Q without the 7Q's LED sucking the juice out my battery.

Although the 7Q is a fantastic device for several cameras, I will never use it on the C500 or an Arri. So all the options for selecting mode on the 7Q is just confusing annoying as I sometimes press the wrong option when I am stressed and in a hurry (Switching from ProRes to RAW and vice versa). (I am certain C500 users would love to be without the FS700 and Arri choices as well!)

This could be solved in many ways.

1. Initially in an admin menu you choose your camera to use with the 7Q, so you don't get all the other options when selecting modes, they are just confusing when you are in a hurry. For FS700 only 3 choices, ProRes, RAW, and RAW2ProRes.

2. And/or, your most used modes (for me RAW and ProRes) should be easily accessible through shortcut buttons. I could wish to have my two FS700 recording modes as shortcuts replacing for example the LUT and GUIDE software buttons, either with or without confirmation (for faster switching between modes).

Also I am not sure if this has been discussed before (likely but could not find), will there be an option to record with the FS700 using another gamma than SLOG2, for cleaner low ISO image, like CineGamma 2 or 4 or something allowing you the use of ISO 100 etc.).

For now my biggest concern is having to totally shut down the 7Q (to preserve power) when walking between shoots, or jumping in and out of my car driving around shooting, it is so time consuming.

Thank you for your attention.

Ole

[Dan Keaton]

Originally Posted by Ole Salomonsen

Hi,

after having used the 7Q with the FS700R for a few months now, I have to say I love it. (Particularly after the v2 fw which adds 4K slomo)

Thank you, we love to hear that!

There are however a few things that I think could be improved (easily) in software:

No doubt the 7Q sucks a lot of power. And it annoys me that I have to switch of the unit to prevent the display eating up the battery between shooting, so:

1. There should be an option to completely and easily switch OFF (and ON) the LED display to reduce power consumption. - And even being able to record with the display off would be nice. This LED OFF/ON option could be a selectable option on the F1 lock button. I would also think it should be possible to bypass a video signal from the 7Q to for example my video goggles, so that I could see the recording and display from the 7Q without the 7Q's LED sucking the juice out my battery.

There is a way to turn off the video display, leaving just the menus, and this will help.

You are using our 2.10.141 firmware or higher (which supports this feature).

The press and hold the Hide button on the bottom menu.

Then select Hide: Video

Then press the Hide button to exit the "Hide Menu".

Then when you press Hide, the video will go black, reducing power.

And then you can press anywhere on the screen to restore the video.

Although the 7Q is a fantastic device for several cameras, I will never use it on the C500 or an Arri. So all the options for selecting mode on the 7Q is just confusing annoying as I sometimes press the wrong option when I am stressed and in a hurry (Switching from ProRes to RAW and vice versa). (I am certain C500 users would love to be without the FS700 and Arri choices as well!)

This could be solved in many ways.

1. Initially in an admin menu you choose your camera to use with the 7Q, so you don't get all the other options when selecting modes, they are just confusing when you are in a hurry. For FS700 only 3 choices, ProRes, RAW, and RAW2ProRes.

2. And/or, your most used modes (for me RAW and ProRes) should be easily accessible through shortcut buttons. I could wish to have my two FS700 recording modes as shortcuts replacing for example the LUT and GUIDE software buttons, either with or without confirmation (for faster switching between modes).

Please allow us time to think about your suggestions:

Here is one possibility:

We would have another menu level, such as:

Monitor -> Record
...............................FS700
..............................................FS700 Raw
..............................................FS700 4K Raw to ProRes HD
...............................C500
..............................................Canon Raw -> Raw
...............................ALEXA
..............................................ARRIRAW -> Raw
...............................Other Cameras and Modes
..............................................4:2:2 HD -> ProRes HD
..............................................4:2:2/4:4:4 -> DPX
..............................................4:2:2 HD -> Multi-Stream

Please note that the above is not perfect, as one might want to use Multi-Stream Monitoring with the FS700, C500 or ALEXA. Another major problem is that this adds another line for each camera type, and we will soon run out of room vertically.

We have some other ideas also.

Also I am not sure if this has been discussed before (likely but could not find), will there be an option to record with the FS700 using another gamma than SLOG2, for cleaner low ISO image, like CineGamma 2 or 4 or something allowing you the use of ISO 100 etc.).

In Raw, yes, we want you to be in S-Log 2, and you can achieve this by selecting Picture Profile 7 , which should be set/reset to Factory Defaults.

But, in our 4K Raw to ProRes HD, you can use other gamma settings.

For now my biggest concern is having to totally shut down the 7Q (to preserve power) when walking between shoots, or jumping in and out of my car driving around shooting, it is so time consuming.

I performed the following test, with an FS700 and Odyssey7Q, with one SSD installed.

From power up, until the FS700 is outputting a Raw (the FS700 was in 4K Raw Mode), the time just over 14 seconds.

From power up, until the Odyssey7Q is showing an image, in FS700 mode is 15 seconds.

And to power up the first SSD took 5 more seconds.

(Sometimes powering up an SSD does take longer).


I am curious as to what battery you are using to power the Odyssey7Q.

Are you shooting a lot of FS700 2K Raw, 12-Bit, at 240 fps?

In this mode, the Odyssey7Q does take between 15 and 16 watts.

But, in idle mode, with two SSD's installed, the power is under 9 watts when your camera is off or
around 10 watts when the Odyssey7Q is receiving a signal and displaying it on the OLED panel.

We may, later, be able to develop a lower-power stand-by mode.

Respectfully,

[Dave Allen]

In Raw, yes, we want you to be in S-Log 2, and you can achieve this by selecting Picture Profile 7 , which should be set/reset to Factory Defaults.

Each day I use the 7Q along with the new firmware, I slowly am getting up to speed. Ok, maybe better to say I suck slightly less each new day, lol.

I have always used PP 4 set to Slog2 when shooting in RAW. So what is this Picture Profile 7 thing all about? Is it just that it defaults to Slog2 so one needn't go to submenu in other picture profiles? Or is something different about PP7?

[Ron Aerts]

Originally Posted by Dan Keaton

Then select Hide: Video

Then press the Hide button to exit the "Hide Menu".

Then when you press Hide, the video will go black, reducing power.

And then you can press anywhere on the screen to restore the video.

I find that the hide function should work a bit different. The video or menu unhides too easily with the slightest touch! Most times when I want to reposition the screen I accidently activate one or more functions... That is really annoying. The hide function should also take out any function. I suggest to reveal with a 2-3 seconds touch&hold or even better only in a small specific area. And to cover the ones that not have read the manual: with a touch, only display shortly a message like "touch&hold lower right corner for buttons"

[Dan Keaton]

Originally Posted by Dave Allen

Each day I use the 7Q along with the new firmware, I slowly am getting up to speed. Ok, maybe better to say I suck slightly less each new day, lol.

I have always used PP 4 set to Slog2 when shooting in RAW. So what is this Picture Profile 7 thing all about? Is it just that it defaults to Slog2 so one needn't go to submenu in other picture profiles? Or is something different about PP7?

Dear Dave,

The Picture Profile 7 is a neutral Picture Profile, with the Gamma set to S Log 2.

We want a neutral Picture Profile.

And for best images, we like the S-Log 2, but we realize that this is not what everyone wants, meaning that they want images that do not need a LUT (Look Up Table) applied in post.

Respectfully,

[Ole Salomonsen]

Dan,

thank you for your reply.

I missed that new feature in latest fw of being able to switch off the video stream and not only hide menus.

I need to test this, but I still suspect we could save more juice by using one of the hardware buttons (F1) to totally switch off the LED. That way I could also immediately have the 7Q ready for action within the press of a button again (or even record without the LED switched on!??).

Since the F1 locks the screen, it might as well switch if completely off ! - This could at least be an option to choose how to use the F1 button. I hope you get time to look into this and test if it is possible.

I am using original genuine Sony 970 and 770 batteries on the 7Q.

When I close the LCD lid on the FS700 it barely use any power, so wish I could have a similar ability on the 7Q.

Yes the menu system you suggest could be one way, though I would also like to have the 1080 HD ProRes option available also under FS700, even if this is a general option available for several cameras.

Also customizable shortcuts to 2 modes would be very convenient.
I could replace the OLED soft button with RAW, and GUIDE or LUT with ProRes.

Yes I shoot a lot of slomo, that seem to be the hype these days! ;) - Both 2K 240, but mostly 4K 120.
BTW! Could the FS700 higher frame rates in 2K/HD ever be possible with the 7Q (480fps/960fps). (Sorry for luring in this extra question)

Thank you for considering my suggestions.

Keep up your hard work!

Ole

[Dan Keaton]

Originally Posted by Ole Salomonsen

Dan,

I need to test this, but I still suspect we could save more juice by using one of the hardware buttons (F1) to totally switch off the LED. That way I could also immediately have the 7Q ready for action within the press of a button again (or even record without the LED switched on!??).

Dear Ole,

Since we are using an OLED panel, having the menu's on draws very little power, and the Menu items are, on purpose, not very bright, also reducing power.

If we were using an LCD, with a backlight, then switching the backlight off would save power.

Since the F1 locks the screen, it might as well switch it completely off ! - This could at least be an option to choose how to use the F1 button. I hope you get time to look into this and test if it is possible.

Note that some, with the screen locked, some will still want to see the image and timecode, and see when it is recording. This mode allows one to hand the unit to someone, but the unit is protected from inadvertent menu changes.

We intend, later, to add some programmable functions to our F1 and F2 mechanical keys (on the side of the unit).

I am using original genuine Sony 970 and 770 batteries on the 7Q.

A genuine Sony NP-F970 battery, in good condition, works fine. Beware of counterfeits, as these are small capacity batteries with extra weights inside to make them heavier.

If you are about to purchase a Sony NP-F970, check the blister pack. If it is sturdy, it is probably a genuine Sony battery, if it is thin, it is not. On many counterfeits, the hologram is in the wrong place.

The Sony NP-F770 battery is underpowered for this application, thus this may be the source of some of the problems. We do not recommend using this battery, especially for anyone shooting in 2K, 240fps.

When I close the LCD lid on the FS700 it barely use any power, so wish I could have a similar ability on the 7Q.

Our engineers are working on two major, very significant firmware releases right now.

As soon as we can find the time, we may be able to engineer an very low power standby mode.

We have the ability to turn off part of the circuits, powering only what we have to have on.

Yes the menu system you suggest could be one way, though I would also like to have the 1080 HD ProRes option available also under FS700, even if this is a general option available for several cameras.

After posting my reply, I spoke with our engineer that is in charge of the menu system.

He is working on a solution, we discussed various options. We may or may not have some changes in our very next release. At the time of my post, the new firmware was in final testing, so it may not get in.

Also customizable shortcuts to 2 modes would be very convenient.
I could replace the OLED soft button with RAW, and GUIDE or LUT with ProRes.

I believe I understand the point of your proposal. You want to be able to, very easily, for a specific camera, to be able to go into, in your case, FS700 Raw, and FS700 4K Raw to Apple ProRes HD modes.

I will discuss this with our team. We do need the OLED and Guide functionality.

Yes I shoot a lot of slomo, that seem to be the hype these days! ;) - Both 2K 240, but mostly 4K 120.
BTW! Could the FS700 higher frame rates in 2K/HD ever be possible with the 7Q (480fps/960fps). (Sorry for luring in this extra question)

If you select, in our Setup|Monitor -> Record menu, our 4:2:2 -> ProRes HD mode, then you can put your Sony FS700 in HD, Super Slow Mode, and the Odyssey7Q can record any of these special, high-speed modes up to 960 fps.

Just be aware that, in these modes, the HD output is not 12-Bit, and that the image quality is not as good as the 2K Raw, 12-Bit modes. In the 2K Raw modes, the image quality remains the same, even at 240 fps (but, of course you need more light when the minimum shutter speed is 1/250th of a second).

In the HD, Super Slow Modes, as you increase the frame rate, the image quality goes down, as the sensor is windowed (less than all of the photosites of the sensor are used when in this mode).

To state this differently, 960 fps is not the same image quality at HD at 60 fps, and none of these HD modes are the quality of the 2K Raw, and 4K Raw is the best quality. That is why we developed the 4K Raw to Apple ProRes 422 (HQ) mode. The later mode has been very well received.

Thank you for considering my suggestions.

Keep up your hard work!

Ole

Respectfully,