enclosure at DVinfo.net

George Bean · June 27th, 2004, 08:45 PM

What is the price and availability of the fshdd-1 in a zero gig version as mentioned in the manual? Any information would be appreciated.

Thanks

Matt McEwen · June 28th, 2004, 03:48 PM

Hi George,

The zero GB version of the FSHDD-1 FireWire drive (the removable drive used in DR-DV5000 and FS-3) was never released to the market. We found that there was a great variation in the performance and quality of 2.5" IDE drives - as used in the FSHDD-1. We found that when certain 2.5" drives were used, the performance of DR-DV5000 and FS-3 could be effected. In order to ensure that only the best quality and highest performance IDE drives were used, we only supply factory configured FSHDD-1s in an effort to make sure that the integrity of a recording is always flawless.

The FSHDD-1 manual that mentioned the zero GB drive is being phased out.

Sorry for the inconvenience.

Matt McEwen

George Bean · June 28th, 2004, 07:46 PM

Thanks for the reply, it was late when I made the original post and thought I had posted in the Firestore specific thread.

My current fs-3 uses the ibm travelstar 40gnx 40 gb 07n9482. In addition to video production I do computer repair and have another identical drive.

Is there any chance the zero gig version will be available in the future for drives that are compatible?

Thanks.

Matt McEwen · June 29th, 2004, 09:42 AM

Hi George,

It is doubtful that we will offer the zero GB version. The biggest problem is it could turn into a tech support nightmare. Obviously, someone like yourself with the same TravelStar would not have a problem, but others who may use inferior drives may experience problems. With a zero GB drive, a person could put any drive in the enclosure. The drive we use is very robust and reliable and we have had very little trouble with them. When tech support is troubleshooting a problem, because all drives are the same, we can nearly always know what to expect from them. The drive is a very core part of the FireStore system and adding unknown IDE drives into the equation could become a real headache.

Another aspect, is that DTE Technology was designed for the end user to record directly to disk and then edit from that same disk on an NLE system. Most FireStore customers use the product this way. Recording a single stream on FireStore is one thing, but then trying to edit a complex project from the same drive is another thing altogether. It therefore has to be a very high performance drive.

Having said all that, you could fit your extra IDE TravelStar into an off the shelf 2.5" drive FireWire enclosure and connect it to your FS-3's external HDD I/O port. This port allows any FireWire drive to be mounted and used with FireStore.

Hope that answers your question.

Matt McEwen

George Bean · June 29th, 2004, 10:13 AM

I understand the tech support nightmare and the more variables involved the more difficult to troubleshoot. I will investigate further the external hdd/io port, that is an option I had not considered. I don't have the manual in front of me at the moment. Can I operate the fs-3 with only an external drive connected without an internal drive present?

Also, thanks for your answers on the fs-3. After following your advice in the earlier forum posts the fs-3 has worked flawlessly, with the exception of the occasional operator error.

One thing I wanted to bring to your attention that you may or may not be aware of. I have the anton bauer gold mount for the canon xl1. I have been using the ab battery only for the fs-3 and an onboard battery for the camera. This is for extended battery run time. Recently I used an ab battery to power both the fs-3 and camera. This was at a wedding reception toward the end of the evening. Everything was working properly throughout the day with the two separate batteries and when I switched to using only the ab battery the fs-3 powered on but would not record. It did recognize the disk and the lcd display information was correct, but it would note record in syncro slave or local mode.

After the reception I investigated further and found the 1394 cable was the problem. I was using a zip-linq retractable 1394 cable. It seems that this cable will work fine if I use an onboard camera battery and an ab battery for the fs-3. If I use the ab battery to power both devices the zip-linq cable will not communicate between the firestore and the camera. I do not experience any problems when using a standard firewire cable. Don't know if this is particular to my camera only, just thought I would mention it.

Thanks

Bean

Matt McEwen · July 2nd, 2004, 11:10 AM

Hi George,

To answer your question, it is possible to use an external drive only with FS-3. It is not necessary to have the internal drive inserted.

I am really puzzled as to why you were having the issue with the zip-linq cable. There is absolutely no relationship between power and FireWire cables as far as I know. I am ordering a zip-linq to check this issue out on my XL1s/AB rig. Seems very strange. I'll let you know how it goes.

Matt

George Bean · July 2nd, 2004, 11:30 AM

Hi Matt,

Could be one of those things that just happen to me, but I have two of the ziplinq cables and they won't work properly when using the ab battery. I even tried playing the clips from the fs-3 to the xl1 and the video is not displayed in the viewfinder. Works fine with the ziplinq, lenmar 911 battery on the camera and the ab battery powering only the firestore.

Quick question. I did review the instructions and the fs-3 does support an external drive. It appears only one drive can be bus powered, either internal or external but not both at the same time. Is this correct?

Second quick question. There are many features in place to protect the internal hard drive so it absorbs any reasonable shock or impact while recording. What is the real world experience with an external hard drive connected to the io port? Is it still within an acceptable tolerance for handheld camera work without dropping frames?

Thanks

Bean

Matt McEwen · August 2nd, 2004, 09:14 AM

Hi George,

Just realized I never answered this thread.

Regarding the Ziplinq cable, I did receive one the other day and will try and reproduce the problem with the AB batteries. One thing I did notice about that cable was how thin it was (I guess so it easily retracts). I doubt this is why it is having trouble, but most FireWire cables I have seen are much thicker. I'll let you know how I go with it.

To answer your question, yes, only one drive can be bus powered at a time...either internal or external (the external drive will of course need to be capable of bus powering...some 3.5" HDD based FireWire drives do require their own power...check with the manufacturer for details).

For your second question...we have designed the FSHDD-1 to work in high shock conditions. The sorbathane shock strip and high performance 2.5" IDE really help. The biggest advantage for anti-shock operation is the shock buffer and this will work with both internal and external drives. I would recommend using a decent quality external drive if that is the way you decide to go.

As for shock, I recently heard of two FS-3's that were mounted inside a racing car for a 24 hour endurance race in Europe for long recordings. Apparently, all went well.

Hope that helps.
Matt McEwen

June 27th, 2004, 08:45 PM	#1
George Bean Major Player Join Date: Apr 2004 Posts: 248	enclosure What is the price and availability of the fshdd-1 in a zero gig version as mentioned in the manual? Any information would be appreciated. Thanks

June 28th, 2004, 03:48 PM	#2
Matt McEwen Focus Enhancements Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Campbell, CA. Posts: 508	Hi George, The zero GB version of the FSHDD-1 FireWire drive (the removable drive used in DR-DV5000 and FS-3) was never released to the market. We found that there was a great variation in the performance and quality of 2.5" IDE drives - as used in the FSHDD-1. We found that when certain 2.5" drives were used, the performance of DR-DV5000 and FS-3 could be effected. In order to ensure that only the best quality and highest performance IDE drives were used, we only supply factory configured FSHDD-1s in an effort to make sure that the integrity of a recording is always flawless. The FSHDD-1 manual that mentioned the zero GB drive is being phased out. Sorry for the inconvenience. Matt McEwen

June 28th, 2004, 07:46 PM	#3
George Bean Major Player Join Date: Apr 2004 Posts: 248	Thanks for the reply, it was late when I made the original post and thought I had posted in the Firestore specific thread. My current fs-3 uses the ibm travelstar 40gnx 40 gb 07n9482. In addition to video production I do computer repair and have another identical drive. Is there any chance the zero gig version will be available in the future for drives that are compatible? Thanks.

June 29th, 2004, 09:42 AM	#4
Matt McEwen Focus Enhancements Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Campbell, CA. Posts: 508	Hi George, It is doubtful that we will offer the zero GB version. The biggest problem is it could turn into a tech support nightmare. Obviously, someone like yourself with the same TravelStar would not have a problem, but others who may use inferior drives may experience problems. With a zero GB drive, a person could put any drive in the enclosure. The drive we use is very robust and reliable and we have had very little trouble with them. When tech support is troubleshooting a problem, because all drives are the same, we can nearly always know what to expect from them. The drive is a very core part of the FireStore system and adding unknown IDE drives into the equation could become a real headache. Another aspect, is that DTE Technology was designed for the end user to record directly to disk and then edit from that same disk on an NLE system. Most FireStore customers use the product this way. Recording a single stream on FireStore is one thing, but then trying to edit a complex project from the same drive is another thing altogether. It therefore has to be a very high performance drive. Having said all that, you could fit your extra IDE TravelStar into an off the shelf 2.5" drive FireWire enclosure and connect it to your FS-3's external HDD I/O port. This port allows any FireWire drive to be mounted and used with FireStore. Hope that answers your question. Matt McEwen

June 29th, 2004, 10:13 AM	#5
George Bean Major Player Join Date: Apr 2004 Posts: 248	I understand the tech support nightmare and the more variables involved the more difficult to troubleshoot. I will investigate further the external hdd/io port, that is an option I had not considered. I don't have the manual in front of me at the moment. Can I operate the fs-3 with only an external drive connected without an internal drive present? Also, thanks for your answers on the fs-3. After following your advice in the earlier forum posts the fs-3 has worked flawlessly, with the exception of the occasional operator error. One thing I wanted to bring to your attention that you may or may not be aware of. I have the anton bauer gold mount for the canon xl1. I have been using the ab battery only for the fs-3 and an onboard battery for the camera. This is for extended battery run time. Recently I used an ab battery to power both the fs-3 and camera. This was at a wedding reception toward the end of the evening. Everything was working properly throughout the day with the two separate batteries and when I switched to using only the ab battery the fs-3 powered on but would not record. It did recognize the disk and the lcd display information was correct, but it would note record in syncro slave or local mode. After the reception I investigated further and found the 1394 cable was the problem. I was using a zip-linq retractable 1394 cable. It seems that this cable will work fine if I use an onboard camera battery and an ab battery for the fs-3. If I use the ab battery to power both devices the zip-linq cable will not communicate between the firestore and the camera. I do not experience any problems when using a standard firewire cable. Don't know if this is particular to my camera only, just thought I would mention it. Thanks Bean

July 2nd, 2004, 11:10 AM	#6
Matt McEwen Focus Enhancements Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Campbell, CA. Posts: 508	Hi George, To answer your question, it is possible to use an external drive only with FS-3. It is not necessary to have the internal drive inserted. I am really puzzled as to why you were having the issue with the zip-linq cable. There is absolutely no relationship between power and FireWire cables as far as I know. I am ordering a zip-linq to check this issue out on my XL1s/AB rig. Seems very strange. I'll let you know how it goes. Matt

July 2nd, 2004, 11:30 AM	#7
George Bean Major Player Join Date: Apr 2004 Posts: 248	Hi Matt, Could be one of those things that just happen to me, but I have two of the ziplinq cables and they won't work properly when using the ab battery. I even tried playing the clips from the fs-3 to the xl1 and the video is not displayed in the viewfinder. Works fine with the ziplinq, lenmar 911 battery on the camera and the ab battery powering only the firestore. Quick question. I did review the instructions and the fs-3 does support an external drive. It appears only one drive can be bus powered, either internal or external but not both at the same time. Is this correct? Second quick question. There are many features in place to protect the internal hard drive so it absorbs any reasonable shock or impact while recording. What is the real world experience with an external hard drive connected to the io port? Is it still within an acceptable tolerance for handheld camera work without dropping frames? Thanks Bean

August 2nd, 2004, 09:14 AM	#8
Matt McEwen Focus Enhancements Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Campbell, CA. Posts: 508	Hi George, Just realized I never answered this thread. Regarding the Ziplinq cable, I did receive one the other day and will try and reproduce the problem with the AB batteries. One thing I did notice about that cable was how thin it was (I guess so it easily retracts). I doubt this is why it is having trouble, but most FireWire cables I have seen are much thicker. I'll let you know how I go with it. To answer your question, yes, only one drive can be bus powered at a time...either internal or external (the external drive will of course need to be capable of bus powering...some 3.5" HDD based FireWire drives do require their own power...check with the manufacturer for details). For your second question...we have designed the FSHDD-1 to work in high shock conditions. The sorbathane shock strip and high performance 2.5" IDE really help. The biggest advantage for anti-shock operation is the shock buffer and this will work with both internal and external drives. I would recommend using a decent quality external drive if that is the way you decide to go. As for shock, I recently heard of two FS-3's that were mounted inside a racing car for a 24 hour endurance race in Europe for long recordings. Apparently, all went well. Hope that helps. Matt McEwen