Audio sync issue Nikon D800 and FCP 7.

[Jonathan Levin]

Greetings.

I am wondering if any of you could help me.

I've run some audio/video tests with my D800e and I seem to have some sync issue (or do I?)

My workflow: Shooting 1080 30p, recording audio through Shure FP33 to Camera. Video files converted to Pro Res 422 using PavTube converter.

Final Cut sequence settings: 1920x1080 HDTV 1080i (16:9) Aspect ratio: Square Field Dominance Upper (odd) Compressor: Apple Pro Res 422 Audio settings 48khz, Depth 16 bit, Config: Channel Grouped

RT settings: Unlimited RT, Scrub High quality, Playback quality Dynamic,Playback frame rate: Dynamic

MacPro 10.8.3, 8 core, 8GB RAM HDD 7200RPM

So here is my issue:

When I go to play a video clip in FC, the sound is slightly out of sync (Video= -02 Audio= +02). This is confirmed by use of a clapper/slate.

However, if I export the clip as a QuickTime movie and play that, the clip seems to be in sync.

And here is the odd thing: In final cut, if I manually line up the audio to be in sync with the picture and then export that as a Quicktime movie, the clip is STILL in sync!

This makes it difficult to figure out what to edit/cut on, video or audio. This is my first experience working with giant video like this. What am I doing wrong?

Thanks for your help.

Jonathan Levin

[Jonathan Levin]

One other thing I just did:

I played the actual pro Res 422 files in QT, without exporting from FC, just the camera>PavTube>Pro Res 422 files and they play in sync in QT. So something is happening when the clips are in FC somehow.

[Jonathan Levin]

I'm wondering if this might be a question in the Nikon video forum.....

[Patrick Baldwin]

Hi. Have you tried hitting the space bar twice to stop it and start playback again? I have to do this quite frequently and it always solves the issue. I think I'm right in saying it is a known bug in FCP 7. It's not related to your D800. I have a D800 and a D7000 and it happens with clips from both cameras..
Kind regards. Patrick

[Jonathan Levin]

Patrick,

Thanks for your reply. I've searched everywhere on this and have ended empty handed. I know that there has to be someone other than the two of us who is using the D800>convert to pro res>final cut workflow.

Again, the original H.264 camera files are in sync in QT as well as the Pavtube converted pro res files. But placed in FC, I lose sync.

I hope someone else sees this.

Congratulations and welcome to DVInfo!

Jonathan Levin

[Daniel Epstein]

Does the sound drift or is it stable but just an offset. Also how are you monitoring the sound? This can often confuse people as the sync of the picture on the computer screen can be different than what Final Cut outputs through say a Blackmagic card to separate monitors and speakers.

Check out this link for more info

Frame Offset in Final Cut Pro - Final Cut Pro, Avid, and After Effects Training

[Jonathan Levin]

Patrick,

The space bar thing did not work. But thanks for trying.

BUT,

Daniel, Thank you for your suggestion.

I set the Offset in the FC Playback Prefs to "0" and the video appears to be in much better sync than when set to "4". But that is in the Final Cut Canvas.

I am monitoring my video using a Matrox MXO Mini, and that picture is visibly lagging behind what I see in the FC Canvas and out of sync with sound. I looked around the Matrox prefs to see if there is an "Offset" setting that could force things back into sync using the MXO.

Very odd. I may have to get in touch with Matrox on this. Anyone else with suggestions?

Jonathan

[Jonathan Levin]

I spoke with a tech support person at Matrox and he was very patient and could not figure out what was going on.

Wer confirmed that the frame offset preference in FC set to "0" syncs up A/V within FC, the video playback through the MXO Mini is still out of sync. I mentioned that the MXO should have an option for setting this offset as well so everything lines up.

At this point, it seems the only thing for me to do is manually sync moving sound a few frames.

Or try switching to FCP X, which I'm wondering if anyone is editing H.264 converted files to Pro Res works any better.

Jonathan

[Daniel Epstein]

Jonathan,
If I am understanding you correctly you have a monitoring problem which has existed in FCP for a long time. The output from the computer into the Matrox box will not be in sync with the computer screen and must be monitored from the Matrox box separately. Using my set up with a Blackmagic card I have to look at the the video output of the blackmagic card on a monitor if I am listening to the output of the audio from the card. If I am looking at the computer screen and want to see real sync I have to listen to the computer audio output to see the best sync. I don't know if FCP X is any better than this as I assume it is part of the hardware design. Digital does tend to have delays that Analog didn't. Many cameras viewfinders are delayed from live action as the video processing takes time to be displayed.
Instead of going to zero on the FCP offset try going to 8 as the offset. The Matrox might have more delay than you think. ALso you kind of get used to it and know what you are looking at and listening to. Here is a link for a google search which shows you many systems having the problem with the Matrox.

https://www.google.com/search?q=matr...hrome&ie=UTF-8

Good Luck

[Jonathan Levin]

Hi Daniel,

Up until I owned the D800, I was editing mostly HDV video, converted to Pro Res 422 and not only was the A/V in sync, the monitor attached to the Matrox was playing at exactly the same sync as my main non-matrix monitor (where I work with sequences, canvas, effects etc. At least to my decreeing eyeballs.

BTW- my audio in all cases is through the computers line out to my sound monitors.

So this is something new (to me).

So right now the only workaround seems to slip the audio using the offset, and only edit using the canvas OR manually slipping sync by manually un-linking audio from video in sequence and moving either the audio or video a couple of frames and edit that way.

Again, exporting self contained QT files of both methods produces files that are in sync, which in itself I can't explain!

There is no good way to edit video that is out of sync. (Do you edit over sound or picture?)

I'd also be curious if any other DSLR's have this issue, say like the Canons with FCP7/X.

I know that using the 'ol clapper board will now be an absolute necessity at the beginning and end of takes.

Jonathan

[Daniel Epstein]

Jonathan,
Don't shoot the messenger. I will say that my Canon 7D internal audio is about 1/2 frame off when looked at on an FCP timeline when shooting 24P compared to how my Edirol audio likes to line up. Not noticeable on lip flap. But does mean you use one or the other. I think if you look at your HDV footage again you will see the delay. If you are monitoring audio direct from the computer and looking at the computer screen you will be in sync there so editing is reliable that way. If I look at my external screen and listen to the computer audio I can see the delay. If I watch both external screen and computer screen I can see the delay. Cuts don't line up at the same time. First the computer screen then the monitor happens. Maybe different sequence format settings have different delays but it is a well known phenomena. Good luck and stay sane

[Jonathan Levin]

Thanks Daniel for all your input.

Yeah, guess I'll deal with some work around or just use the D800 as a b-roll camera.

Maybe I'll go paint my garage!

Jonathan