do not go with the quickstream... your problems should be simple to solve.

you should have probably recorded in the raw dv(.dv) format, because that is what quicktime is supposed to be compatible with... of course the fs-4 won't run without a battery, just plug it at the "computer i/o" port, and it will look just like another hard drive on your mac... copy all of the files over to your local hard drive for editing, it sounds like there were some issues with your firewire bus connection that could have contributed to the dropped frames(?)

FS-4 and PD-170/JVC HD-100
 

I understand that the Firestore is not quite ready for HDV acquisition (and as I haven't purchased the camera yet, neither am I), but we are currently using a PD-170, and going tapeless would be a real timesaver for me. We plan on making the leap to the JVC around the first of the year. My question is - will the update to the FS-4 be a downloaded firmware update, or should I wait until the HDV capable unit is ready?

The upgrade is supposed to be a software update. But it is way overdue, so it may be vaporware.

FS-4 in Manual Mode
 

I have been trying to get my FS-4 to record in manual mode from the firewire connect to a XL2 with a tape backup. What setup and settings are necessary before you press the record button twice. With everything I try, the counter doesn't move from all zeros. Thanks for any help. It works fine from sync with camera.

Jeff,

Make sure that the Firewire cable is in the DV I/O jack and not the Computer I/O.

And you are pushing the Record key on the FS-4 (not the camera) twice to start recording in LOCAL (manual) mode right?

FS-4 in Manual Mode (2)
 

I finally figured out how to get my FS-4 to work correctly in both sync and manual modes. It really is a simple device and I think I was making it too complicated by not using the sync soft key to change from local control to sync control. I was trying to change all of the settings by going through the menus.

My question now is -- is there a way to keep the FS-4 running in manual mode while you change tapes in the XL2 for continuous coverage of an event like a wedding or musical event? When you stop an XL2 to change tapes while the FS-4 in manual mode, the FS-4 will also stop just like in sync mode.

Firestore FS4 questions
 

i am thinking of getting an FS4 to capture video. This will be mostly for now from an XL2 camera

How does the FS4 handle the four audio channels on the XL2 ? Do i need to do something special to get the four channels or will they just be there

Who is in charge of timecode ? Does the FS4 use the cameras timecode or generate its own ? If it generates its own does it have free run time code as the XL2 ?

Can the FS4 be controlled via firewire just like a camera or tape deck ? reason for asking this is that i would like to be able to simply dub directly from the FS4 to DVD using my decks. My DVD recorder deck has automated dubbing via firewire from any firewire deck and it will control the other deck via firewire commands.

SEARCH mode is your friend, the 4-channel audio situation has been covered in detail out here.

the fs-4 is controllable by video cameras that are capable of dv device control, but i don't know about dvd burners... so far i have been unable to get a video signal from the fs-4 into my sony gv-d900 minidv deck via the firewire port :-/ the fs-4 will play all of it's clips back as one unbroken stream, so it would nice to use as a source deck for dubbing directly onto tape... or dvd, in your case.

Dan

yes i did do some reading but havent seen any final answer on the audio subject. A lot of testing (actually i did download that test video off of your site as well) but i guess no real news from focus or did they give any definitive answer ?

i did find about the timecode. Looks like the XL2 timecode can only be used if there is tape in the camera (is this correct ?) and the timecode from the FS4 can only do free run if you get the PRO version.

can you dub from the FS4 to a tape in the camera ? if a camera can control the FS4 then my DVD deck should be able to as well as that is all it does. It works well with other cameras as well as with my MiniDV deck so i would dare to guess it would work with the FS4 too.

sometimes i just need to burn DVD's directly without any post so this would be much nicer. Use the same setup for going to VHS and if i dont have to go via PC it is simply a waste of time.

thanks for the info

the fix to get 4-channel audio into a pc to edit with seems pretty clear to me, although i haven't tested it extensively... you'll need to shoot in raw dv mode, then use software to extract the second pair of audio tracks, and also change the file format while copying.

have you checked out the focus software that we were talking about? it has an option that claims to add premiere timecode when the clip is copied(?)... i have not messed with the timecode yet, but what i've read out here so far agrees with what you said.

focus has not weighed in wrt their file conversion software... afaik, it will not pull the second pair of audio tracks out of anything other than a raw dv file.

if you were wanting to dub 4-channel audio files from the fs-4 directly to a dvd burner via the firewire port, i'm not sure how that would work... fwiw, the fs-4 plays all 4 channels back into an xl1s that's set in vcr mode... but remember that it's a video camera with external dv device control, selectable via the menu of the camera, i have not tried to do that with the dv device control disabled.

If you use the FS-4 in LOCAL (manual) MODE, it acts like an independent DV recorder. That means it will not be effected by tape changes on the camera - the FS-4 should keep recording as long as the camera is on. Just be careful not to shake the camera while making the tape change.

Dan

i am hoping for focus to do something better than this. It is supposed to be DTE so it would be nice if you wouldnt need to spend time capturing which is one of the reasons to have the firestore in the first place

as far as the dubbing to DVD that was a separate issue and of course in this case i will not need 4 channel audio.

believe me, i understand where you are coming from :-/ it hasn't been easy figuring out how to make this 4-channel audio work, i think that i'm going to send focus a bill for providing tech support of their products, lol... of course i'd probably have to split the revenue with mark whittle, who started this whole thing up!

the fs-4 is fully dte capable... it's just another hard drive on your computer system.

the only hitch to that is if you wanted to use 4-channel audio, which as near as i can tell, requires you to either:
1) copy the files over to another hard drive using the focus file conversion software.
2) or dupe over to tape to re-capture to a hard drive.

wrt choice #2)... today i was able to use the fs-4 as a duplication source deck, playing back to the sony gv-d900 minidv deck via the firewire connector... i turned both units on with no firewire connection, then plugged the firewire cable into the dv i/o port of the fs-4... the sony deck saw it as dv in, so i was able to manually start and stop the videotape recording... no dv device control was used.

FS 4 Pro help
 

I loaded the new firmware onto one of our 2 fa4's and it will not record manualy... Not sure why... Also I reset to factory settings still will not record manually..As to record sinc... that in the past didn't work well for us... good thing for tape. Anyway I have 2 units and as of now not happy with either one... So any help would be great... thanks

Hi Craig,

What does the FS-4 do when you push the record key twice to record in LOCAL mode? Could it be a cable problem?

I'm assuming that you have tried everything "logical" so it is hard to give you any suggestions.

I saw the post about the firmware update so I was about to download it when I checked the firmware version on my FS-4 Pro and saw that my unit has already version 1.0.1. I haven't been having much trouble with this firmware version, so I don't think that your problem is due to the firmware version. However mine was factory installed (delivered about a month ago) so that doesn't rule out a problem with the download.

I hope that you find a solution.

Well
 

I did try all the above, So looks like I'll call Focus Support for the help I need... This sucks... latter

FS-4 Pro and Canon XL2
 

Is it just my XL2 or do you have to do EXACTLY THE OPPOSITE when starting your XL2 and FS-4 up?

If I start the camera up first, the FS-4 Pro ignores the camera.

The manual and tech support BOTH say start the camera first.

Very frustrating.

Ty Ford

I had the same problem, periodically, on a job I just worked on.

I turned the FS-4 off when the camera was on while composing the shot for lighting. When I turned the FS-4 on again 2 out of 3 times I had to put the XL-2 into (deep) standby and then wake it again (with the standby button) in order to rebuild the connection.

It's not just you.

Did Focus Beta Test the FS-4 HDV upgrade?
 

I'm fairly new to HDV, Firestore and this forum, and I'm just curious as to whether anyone here was a beta tester for their HDV upgrade. Their support staff have now provided two "workarounds" for the problem of getting HDV from the FS-4 into Final Cut Pro. The first simply didn't work. Using this second workaround, I calculate it would take 4-5 days to get the 800 m2t files on this FS-4pro into FCP.





Quoting from Focus support:

"
1) On the FS-4, cue up the clip you want to capture (use the skip FWD or REV button to find the clip)

2) Connect via firewire to computer

3) Make sure the capture settings are set to HDV

4) Put the FS-4 into AV/C mode.

5) a) With 720/30p clips – the Log and Capture controls will control the FS-4 – BUT you can also control the FS-4 by hand to select the clip to capture.

b) With 1080/60i clips – put the FS-4 into REC/PAUSE mode –

6) Open Log and Capture

7) With 1080/60i clips – now take the FS-4 out of REC/PAUSE mode – all the controls will NOT be usable in Log and Capture – but you can still skip from clip to clip on

the FS-4 to find what you want to capture – then just hit CAPTURE NOW.


--The “trick” is only in 1080/60i mode only – we just have to fool FCP into reading the 1080/60i firewire feed – we do this by being in REC/PAUSE.


8) If none of the above work – then reset the computer and try again.

------------------------------------

If these steps don't work, let us know and we can get one of testers to step through this with you over the phone.

end quote



Bizarre.

It just goes to show you - they're humans... just like us. It sounds like they set one of they're trainees in front of FCP and told him (or her) they couldn't go to lunch until they found a work-round.

All I can say is that you would have just about as much work getting the video into your Apple from tape as you will doing it like Focus suggest, only, I would suggest setting the FS-4 to playback all clips instead of capturing one clip at a time.

... From my experience after beta testing the FS-4 (not Pro and no HDV), beta testing doesn't mean anything when they disregard the beta tester's reports. I'm asking myself if they did any Alfa testing with the FS-4HDV - if so, then they have done their customers a disservice by not warning about it's limitations.

where is the upgrade to Firestore FS-4 Pro HD????
 

I just purchased a Firestore FS-4 Pro HD 80Gig drive, and I found no .m2t file format in the hard drive. So the HDV upgrade did not come in the box. Even though it was offered free to me from Videoguys with my purchase.

Does anyone know where the HDV upgrade is? Does it come on a CD, and if so how come I didn't get it?

Are you supposed to download it? Went to Videoguys web site and to Focus Enchancements' web site, but there is no HDV update to download.

Does any one know what's going on or how you upgrade to HD?

Straight from Videoguys website:

http://www.videoguys.com/videonics.html

"*Free HDV Upgrade provided direct from Focus. Purchase the FS-4 Pro today and register with Focus here after you receive your FS-4 Pro and your FREE HDV upgrade will be processed immediately."

Click on the "register with Focus here" link that Videoguy's provides.

camera movement
 

What about the camera movement when you change the tape? like when you are shooting a conference for a hour.

JVC use FS-4 without correcting design flaws
 

JVC-badged versions of the FS-4 and FS-4Pro are being offered for use with the HD100 and HD101 HDV cameras - www.jvcproeurope.com/prohd .

However, it looks as if the various design flaws identified in this forum have not been corrected - except that users will get a right-angle connector on their firewire lead.

Ray Liffen

it's a 6-pin to 6-pin right-angled firewire cable, so it won't help for most other applications.

i like the way that they have the unit mounted behind the camera.

Pro HD Upgrade
 

You will have to fax your bill of sale to Focus and they will then send you a CD that upgrades the Firestore to acquire M2T files. It takes a while, but they are pretty reliable in sending the upgrade out in a timely manner. If yo udon't receive it within about two weeks, I sugegst that you call them directly and give them a little nudge.

fs-4HD ?
 

i just purchased an FS-4 but when i got it i noticed that the box said FS-4HD and it also says that on the welcome screen - did the store screw up or is that the norm now for this product that they all are at least HD?

need help w/setup FD-4HD
 

i guess i just may be dumb - but i am having a hard time getting this recording right - the only way i can get hdd to record is to put it in syncro slave - but once i stop taping it goes back to local [default] then i have to go back in change it record and wham back to local - pls tell me what am i missing - i have the FS-4 HD and using it on an XL-2


thanks

Ron,

Try hitting the upper left button "SYNC" and it should go right back to syncro slave. That is what mine does.

Let me know if this helps. Good Luck.

Mike

oh well ---- thanks ---- got some shooting to do ..............

thanks that did do the trick - but tell me is this typical? or am i missing something?

As I said, mine works the same way. I found the trick while pulling my hair out and leafing through the manual. Page 42, something about SYNC toggels between SYNCRO and NORMAL. Does seem unusual that it always reverts to normal, but consider this, it does save you from going into the menu again to go back to normal. You just have to hit the SYNC button to continue in sync. Not sure which way is better, but this is the way it is setup.

Mike

Fs-4 Pro 24p?
 

I just got the fs-4 pro to use with my XL2. I was wondering if the quick time 24p recording setting is recorded at 24p, 24pa, or just 24 frames a second? I mostly work with Final Cut pro, and was just wondering about which settings will be the best for importing my clips into a project. When recording to tape I use 16x9 24p (2:3 pulldown).

When I was fooling around with the Fs-4 I had it set to raw dv, I assume that if my camera is set to 24p then it'll get to the fs-4 as 24p but as 60i.

So bascially what is the fs4 quick time 24p recorded like, would it be better to use that over the raw dv capture?

FS-4 Tapeless Problems
 

very new to the DTE style and for giggles have been trying to record tapeless using cannon XL2 and will not record unless i put a tape in - i have read manual couple of times and still nothing - i am asking you experts here what the heck am i missing?


ron

Hi Ron,

I had not tried to record without a tape before so I did it to see how it works.

Turn the menu on and go to SYSTEM, DV Control and turn DV Control ON, then exit the menu.

You will not see the timecode on the camera change or the record indicator come on while you are using this feature, but in the bottom right hand of the display you will see DV(and a little bent arrow) and a red ball or a square green box. The green box will be there when you are pausing and the red ball will show when you are recording to the FS-4 drive.

There will still be a "no tape warning" in the camera display, but just ignore it.

Additionally, you must put the firestore into the tapeless mode.

Try it and let me know if it workes for you.

Mike

there are a couple of places in the fs-4 menu where you choose "tapeless"... i do both of 'em... you also have to have the "e" show up in the top left corner of the fs-4 display, use the menu button on the left to select it, there is some menu info for that near the end of the fs-4 manual.

many operations of the fs-4 are not documented... for instance, once you have it set up to record in tapeless mode, you never have to change the menu settings again... when you plug it into the pc via the computer i/o port, just hit the dd/dv button once, and it'll show up as a hard drive.

i've probably recorded well over 1,000 tapeless video clips with the fs-4, it's been very reliable, with one very intermittent bug exception, which may or may not be peculiar to my particular setup with the hacked up firewire cable... sometimes it will fire up in this mode where it isn't recording to the hard drive, despite what the camera viewfinder display sez... when you hit the "rec" button, the fs-4 receives the signal and starts to record, but immediately stops, and it does that on every clip, until you turn off the camera or reboot it(?)

in order to make sure that you are actually recording, hit the middle button of the fs-4 to set it up to display "dv ntsc", which gives you the total amount of record time for the session you are in... you'll be able to see if it's not recording... you could alternatively play back the clip in the viewfinder, off of the hard drive, but that wears out the big rotary switch every time that you go in and out of vcr mode... once you are booted up in a tapeless recording session that works, it will always record, without failing.

once you have it plugged in to the pc, you can look at the log file in one of the subdirectories, and there will be entries that show details of every clip that was recorded.

overall, i am very happy with the fs-4 in tapeless mode, it's allowed me to do things that i really couldn't do before, because it saves the head and tape transport wear... it also extends the life of the camera battery quite a bit, because you aren't using energy to run the tape drive, and when you hit the "rec" button, it starts recording immediately, you don't get that tape delay.

Help! Something went south with FS-4
 

For some reason, my NLE (Vegas) is reporting corrupt files with footage shot in AVI 1...won't open. Repair disk/clip doesn't fix. The files themselves will play in real player. Can I transfer (record to another FS-4)? How do I setup the two firestore to do that...?

transferring to another firestore would not be any different than transferring to your pc... i would copy everything that you shot over to the pc asap, then make a dv tape backup right off of the firestore, as it's playing into the dv camera/deck via firewire... that would also give you another way to capture the clips back to the pc, to see if they are good.

The firewire cable turned out bad...as I noticed the firestore was acting very sluggish with it connected. Putting a different cable between the camera and the FS... it works fine. What is strange is that only Vegas won't recongize the AVIs...but real player...media player...will play the files fine. I just captured the tape copy and ordered and new firewire cable...:-)

Make sure you are capturing as AVI-2 (Type 2) if you capture them as type 1, vegas will not be able to use them.