The Hitachi drive is a good one, you can easily go there. I typically prefer IDE burners at this time due to slightly better compatability.. but either is okay..

I've planned to buy a new edit (with Adobe bundle). Most of the parts are quite clear for me but I don't know yet will I buy Intel core 2 duo or quad core processor. How much does that quad core help compared to dual core?

And about the video cards.. Is it true that Quadro cards are good with After Effects? Are they so good that I should pay about three times more to get "PNY QUADRO FX 560 PCIE 128M PRO VIDEO EDITION" card?

Samuli,

Unfortunately, I don't have great answers for either of your questions but I'll try..

- Quad Core, provided it is taken advantage of by software, is typically better than Dual Core even at slower clock speeds. The key is to find out if Adobe CS3 is taking advantage of all 4 cores, I have to believe they probably are.

- *IF* After Effects can in fact make good use of a Quadro type of video processor, than I'm sure that's the way to go. But again, I'd make sure that's the case..

Jon

Well I recieved all the parts today from Newegg and I notice I didnt get a Go stepping chip. Don't know much about go stepping just that it runs cooler and you can overclock it more. Wondering is there a diffrence enough that I should return it and get another one?I'm not a big overclocker but I might overclock it a bit if I can learn how to do it. Thank's for any info you all can give.

Chad

I wouldn't worry too much about G0 stepping. It's really a small difference and overclocking performance varies enough per chip that a B3 good chip is better than a G0 poor chip. G0 would have been slightly better, but really, it's small potatoes.

I'm about to take the plunge into the quad core world of an Intel Q6600. I might even have it slightly over-clocked by a qualified builder.

Can someone shed some light on the never-ending controversy about the RAM amount needed (and used) for a 32 bit operating system like XP Pro or Vista 32? Some claim 2 gig is it, others say CS3 programs can access 3 gig (especially with some sort of modification to the ini. file), and others say it's worth it to go with 4 gig. My current older dual xeon has 4 gig of RAM, and AE 7.0 clearly says it's accessing only 2 gig.

The only other option is running XP Pro 64 bit, but I've heard it has compatibility issues with too many drivers and hardware. I'm upgrading to CS3 apps. I also use the Xena LH board along with Prospect HD.

Thanks for any feedback on this.

Stuart

Stuart,

This is a pretty complicated subject... Windows Vista and XP Pro are both 32-bit operating systems share the same memory addressing limitations (sans the 64-bit versions obviously).... Here is a good article that's a little more geared toward the gamer but still usefull..

part 1
http://www.anandtech.com/gadgets/showdoc.aspx?i=3034

part 2
http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets...oc.aspx?i=3044

part 3
http://www.anandtech.com/systems/showdoc.aspx?i=3060

Much of that information might blow over most peoples heads (as it does mine in many cases) but anybody who can discipline themselves to get through it will come away with a much better understanding of what is going on with the whole 2Gb vs 4Gb deal..

Jon

PS: My advice.... If you can afford the extra $125, get the 4Gb and be prepared for the future and give your current NLE anything it can take advantage of...

PC Build
 

Just to let those contemplating doing your own PC build that mine went pretty well. I ordered everything from mwave the Tuesday after Labor day and it was all on my doorstep by Friday! Actually, I didn't realize they are only about 60 miles from me. Here's what I ended up building:

ANTEC P182 Aluminum Mid Tower Case Black
MSI P35 PLATINUM INTEL P35 CHIPSET ATX FORM FACTOR 2xPCI-E(X16)/2xPCI-E(X1)/2xPCI/4xDDR2 W/SATA2 RAID,LAN(Gb),1394,USB 2.0 & AUDIO
ENERMAX EG495AX-VEW SFMA 485W POWER SUPPLY
CORE 2 QUAD Q6600 2.4G (1066Mhz)
KINGSTON 2GB DDR2 667=(1GB x 2)
XFX GEFORCE 8600GTS 256MB PCI EXPRESS XXX 730MHZ DDR3 DUAL DVI
CREATIVE LABS SOUNDBLASTER X-FI XTREME GAMER
WD 150GB WD1500ADFD SATA150 16MB 10,000RPM
HITACHI 1TB 0A34193 / 0A35155 SATA3GB 7200RPM 32MB # HDS721010KLA330
HP DVD1040I 20X LIGHTSCRIBE 1.2 MULTIFORMAT DVD BURNER
SABRENT CRW-UINB 52 IN 1 BLACK USB 2.0 INTERNAL MEMORY CARD READER & WRITER
MICROSOFT WINDOWS XP PROFESSIONAL W/SP2

I followed some online step by step instructions. Here's links to two that I found to be good "pre-study" material.

http://www.pcmech.com/byopc/
http://computer.howstuffworks.com/build-a-computer.htm

For the specifics I followed the included documentation. I had the CPU and memory installed on the board and tested, as well as the power unit in the case. For about $80.00 more I could have had basically the whole thing done but it actually was fairly easy, a great learning experience and fun!

I took my time and spent the afternoon installing the MOBO, graphics card and primary drives. Installing just the "basics" to start it up was a tip I found on the net which made good sense. Of course, Jon here helped me with a few questions I had as well along the way.

I did have one challenge with the Hitachi drive. After I installed it and booted up it was recognized in the bios, but not windows. I went to Hitachi and found some help guides there. I had to use the device manager to specify the drive and do a "quick format." Windows XP then could "see" the drive. I checked updates on all the drivers and everything was good. XP had about 28 updates to do.

It was pretty rewarding to put it all together and then have it just purring. I did my first video project over the weekend just to see how it would perform. I did a 3:30 length video project with lots of transitions, titles and effects. The quad-core really smokes during the rendering process. I was able render and burn the project in about 5 minutes.

I downloaded Vegas 8 Pro (that just released a few days ago). It is working pretty nicely on the system as well. I like the features and it seems pretty intuitive. Running MS Flight Sim Deluxe as well.

Jon, thanks again for all the help. It really wasn't too bad at all and that Anton case is pretty nice to work with and it looks real good as well. I'm pretty pleased. I've got a quiet, smokin' rig to do projects on now!

Jeff

Fantastic Jeff..

What's also so nice about the system you built is that you spent far less than an off the shelf system plus you have the added benefit of knowing each and every component that went into the system... Good stuff...

Jon

Yes, it came in at just under 2k. I feel a lot more comfortable looking "under the hood" as well. It's a good feeling.

quad core or dual
 

Jon,
I've been following this thread and have priced out the system you spec'd at the beginning.
I'm thinking Quad Core is the way to go to be ready for the future along with 4GB RAM.
Is the Q6600 the latest Quad core from Intel or is there another newer version?

Also, mWave is out of stock on the Antec P182 and I really like the specs on it. Can you recommend a compatible case?

Thanks
Jim

Newb Question: How to connect RAID?
 

Jon,
Excellent thread. I'm afraid that I have to flaunt my ignorance: how does one actually connect HDs in a RAID configuration? (I've done some reading, so at least I tried before I posted.)
1. There is software and hardware RAID, hardware generally being the better choice, correct?
2. There are PCI card controllers, I know, allowing connection of internal HDs. Is this the solution? Drop in a card and connect/configure? If yes to the card, which would you suggest?
3. Do some MoBos, such as the one you suggested on page 1, obviate the need for an additional RAID controller card?

Thanks,
Steve

Hello Jim,

The Quad Core is in fact *not* the most recent or fastest Quad Core processor, it just happens to bring the most value per dollar. This chip runs 4 processing cores at 2.4Ghz on a 1066Mhz FSB 4Mb X2 L2 Cache for roughly $280.00. The next fastest Quad Core runs at 2.66Ghz on a 1066Mhz FSB as well but costs $550.00. Kinda of absurd when you think about it that for literally an extra 10% of processing performance increase (not system speed, just the processor) costs you TWICE as much.

For the record, the $275 Quad Core if you *really* wanted that extra performance is known to overclock pretty well with a good aftermarket cooler. Most people seem to get this processor to run at the 3.1 - 3.3Ghz range, at 2.8Ghz or 3.0Ghz should be easily attainable..

There are other places to pickup the P182, newegg.com is a good one. The P180 is usually cheaper and frankly is about 95% the same, so that's a good option as well.

I ended up getting a system built by someone with almost the same specs as Jeff. It's costing me about $500 more, but I'm paying to have it professionally over-clocked to about 3.3 GHz. I'm also getting the nVidia 8800 card. Same HD setup for booting etc... I also play MS flight simulator! This should be a rig that will make HD/HDV and Prospect HD editing MUCH easier than my "old" dual Xeon (it's almost 4 years old - ancient by today's standards).

This is a great thread and has been helpful to me as I made this investment.

Thanks Jon.

Stuart

Stuart,

You're going to love that 10k hard drive. It really screams loading up the new software and the OS seems to be cooking as well. MS Flight Sim is running with many of the graphic selections set to high. I'm sure the graphics card is a big help, but all my programs are loading with lightning speed.

I'm going be doing some HD editing pretty soon. We'll see how that goes. It sure is a posiive experience having such a responsive rig doing video editing now!

Jeff

It's hard waiting for the rig! My builder needs about 7-10 days, but that will go by quickly. I'm also having him run some tests to check the software speed if he throws two of the 10k boot drives in, setup as a RAID 0. I know some people are doing that for gaming, but it would be interesting to see how it helps (or not) with editing software. For those few moments I get for Flight Simulator, this machine should be a thrill too!

Awsome that you found somebody to build one and then overclock it for you. Good stuff... The $500 extra you are paying probably isn't too bad considering what they'll be doing to it and the fact you got a video card that is $150+ more. If you're happy with what you end up getting, do tell who this builder is so I may reference him for others here.

Jon

Problem with RAID 0 on the system drive is that we're talking about is a 2X greater failure rate and when you throw in a 10K drive, it's probably a little higher. You also have noise and heat issues to be concerned about. I too would like to see the performance advantages of this, but I suspect it's probably still best to go with one 10K drive as the system drive.

Jon,

Thanks for the concern about the dual 10k drives. I agree it's an issue. Right now he's only testing the idea. If it results in significant performance gains I'll consider it. Either way I always keep a back-up clone of my system drive just in case! All my data is on the second drive and/or my RAID drives (where my raw video files go). I'll keep you posted and will certainly be willing to give out this guy's name if all works out.

Stuart

quad versus duo
 

a great thread, folks, ive learnt lots from it. I too will be soon embarking on a new PC mission and have some choices to make. It sounds to me like the Intel Quad Core is the way to go, especially since I'm a Vegas user, but the price of the newer Duos is very appealing. Here's my CPU options: (prices from microdirect.co.uk)

Core 2 Duo E6750 2.66GHz - £118
Quad Core Q6660 2.4GHz is £168

I believe the quad core will outperform the E6750 (but only in situations where all 4 processers are used such as rendering in Vegas) but is it really worth the extra 40% cost to get the quad?

Another quick question, I currently have two drives which i want to buy clones of to make a RAID 0.

One is a 320GB the other a 500GB (both Seagate Barracuda SATAII). I plan to get another 500GB but is there any disadvantage at raiding such a large drive? am i better getting 1 or 2 more 320GB for speed (it'll obviously cost more)?

thanks,

baldwin

Hey Baldwin,

The Quad core in this case is still the way to go. Yes, it's a 40% increase in the CPU cost, but considering the entire PC purchase, it's really a small price increase. Also throw in the fact that in the NLE speed game, CPU is the chief component (In Video games, it's often the Video Card which plays a huge role). So I think going for the Quad is your best bet for sure.

Jon

System Tray
 

In addition to keeping the system tray empty of unneeded software, another good idea is to disable unnecessary XP services. I used a guide I found online to do this, but that one isn't there anymore :-/ But as an example, who wants to use system resources to enable data to be sent to MS when something crashes? I sure don't! Getting rid of these extra services has made an older system last a bit longer for me. Should help even on a high end system like this, which I am about to put together.

Thanks Jon!

Yep, this is true and there are some good resources on the net regarding this. The key here though is obviously to only disable background sources which you *know* are not needed. I find that most of these resources in actuality use a small amount of memory and processing cycles and with dual core/quad core processors performance barely suffers if at all, so I tend to just leave it alone. Not installed *extra* software into the system though such as virus checkers, firewalls, spyware stuff, etc can make a noticeable difference so I do avoid those.

Jon

new system
 

Hi folks,

am about to take the plunge with the following specs - already picked up my Intel Quad Core 2.4Ghz Q6600 so can't change that but the rest is still unbought:

Antec Sonata III Silent Case w 500W Earthwatts PSU
2GB Corsair 6400 DRAM
Primary Drive 250GB Western Digital Caviar SE16 SATA II 300 7200rpm 16MB cache
2 x 500GB Seagate Barracuda SATA II 300 7200rpm 16MB cache Hard Drive set at RAID 0
NEC Optiarc AD-7170A-0S DVD burner
Gigabyte GA-P35-DS3P Intel P35 Express LGA775 1333 FSB Motherboard
Gigabyte 7600GS PCI-E 256MB graphics card silent pipe HDTV/DVI/VGA

I like the Gigabyte motherboard cause it has 6 internal SATA connections (as i always envisage numerous extra HDs) and the fact its firewire is by Texas Intsruments as my Alesis I/O 26 soundcard is a bit touchy when it comes to firewire chipsets. Has anyone had experience with this board?

Re the graphics I'm not so sure - I've read that an extra 256MB isnt really going to make a difference (im not a gamer) but am I going for the right kind of chipset? I run Vegas predominantly but will be using After Effects a little and was toying with the idea of Avid Xpress too. Does Vegas 8.0 (I'm on 7.0 at the moment) still not use any GPU acceleration?

Come in at under £500 which is pretty good though am sticking with these old monitors for now. Any thoughts most welcome.

Cheers,

Baldwin

Looks great to me Baldwin...

My only recomendation is to go with an 8600GT or 8600GTS video card over the 7600 series you are looking at. Vegas does not utilitze GPU acceleration but what the 8600 series of cards give you is a better quality playback of video files in general with less CPU overhead. I'm not saying the 7600 isn't adequate, but the 8600 is really not much more and will be a little bit better with the added benefit of just being a more current product (DirectX 10 vs DirectX 9).

Thanks Jon, looks like a Gigabyte GeForce 8600GT 512MB Silentpipe is the way forward then, about £20 more. A bit of a miscalculation on the last message looks like this beast totals around £700 (not £500!) before any of you ask where I get my bargain components!

baldwin

I'm considering whether to get 4 X 1G Kingston PC 5300 DDR2 667 Cl5 or simply 2 X 1G PC 6400 DDR2 800 Cl5. Does the speed makes a different for Vegas? The former cost 60% lesser than the latter(each piece).
I'm still using Vegas 6.0b (ya, its old I know). But I guess its still okay for editing HDV right? Will be getting Q6600.

A few points here..

#1) Remember that Windows XP Pro or Vista cannot address and take advantage of a full 4Gb of memory. Most people report a best case scenerio of around 3Gb, but there is also some speculation as to whether or not apps will even see greater than the 2Gb. This has been hottly talked about and I've not taken the time to truly understand exactly what's been going on. Needless to say, 4Gb is not going to give you much, if any, of a performance increase. As far as the speed is concerned 800Mhz ram will be faster than 667Mhz ram assuming there is no overclocking going on. But again, we're dealing with a few % points here.

#2) Vegas 6.0 is *NOT* a good version to edit HDV. Of *ALL* the money you are spending, your best dollars will be spent upgrading to Vegas Pro 8.

Hi folks,

almost there with the new PC, just one last decision on the graphics card:

256MB Gigabyte 8600GT Silent Pipe II, PCI-E (x16), GDDR3, 2 x Dual Link DVI-I, HDTV, HDCP

or:

512MB Gigabyte 8600GT Silent, PCI-E (x16), GDDR2, GPU 540 MHz, Dual Link DVI-I, HDCP

basically, is it better to get 256MB less RAM which runs at a higher clock speed or more RAM at a lower speed?
Both are practically the same price.

Cheers,

Baldwin

I personally would choose the lesser ram but higher clock speed when it comes to gaming. However in video editing scenario, I guess both are pretty on par since both are not pure video editing card. Just my personal opinion. :)

Kenny

I agree with Kenny, the extra RAM on the Video Card means nothing. You'll be fine with the 256Mb card.. What NLE do you use anyway?

Thanks guys, I've just got home from a spending spree and got the 256MB card as you recommended. I use Sony Vegas, so I guess it won't make much difference anyway, though I'll be using After Effects a bit in the future. Anyhow, the PC still ought to be a bit of a beast. Unfortauntely got a call today from the other supplier who i was going to pick up the antec case from saying they wont have it til monday. darn, i'll have to wait. will report back on the PC's performance once it's up.

cheers,

baldwin

Yes please give us a review. I am going to setup a PC myself, roughly the same specs as yours. Just that I'm still using Vegas 6.0b. Will try to edit with it 1st before committing on Vegas 8 Pro. Just wish to know how necessary is it to upgrade to 8 when editing HDV.

Ga-p35-ds4
 

Hey Jon... any thoughts on this rev. 2 board, the GA-P35-DS4? Things change so fast :-/

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16813128064

GIGABYTE GA-P35-DS4 Rev. 2.0 LGA 775 Intel P35 ATX
Ultra Durable 2, ultra cooling

Edit: This link is deactivated... not sure why... but nevermind

HDTV as single monitor?
 

One more question as I get ready to place orders:

Am I insane to think that I can use my 50" Plasma Panasonic HD monitor (720p) as my (only) editing monitor?

It will be connected from the video card via HDMI. I'm trying to use the editing system to also view other content on the big screen. Not live TV, but web content, music, etc.

50", it will be great if it is full HD. I don't think it is insane. However I think it will pose a small prob if you are playing game with it. The resolution is too low. For video editing I think it is good.

It's a good board, certainly worthy of a look.

50" at 720p is going to be a problem if you sit close to the monitor. You're going to have to be about 5 - 6' away at a minimum. Frankly, I'd feel better about it if it were a 42" monitor at 1080p.

Trying to put together a HD editing PC
 

Looking to purchase a new computer for HD editing, and need opinions on the below specs. Anything I should add or remove or change?


Case: ADK - ADK Tower: 7 3.5" bay, 5 x 5.25 Bays up to 13 HDD's with hot swap bay.

Power Supply: Thermaltake - 550W EPS12V 16DB 8 sata

Motherboard: Daw Core/Penryn P35 chipset DDR2 1066, 3 PCI, 3PCIe. TI Firewire, 6 Sata DD

Processor: Intel - Intel Q6600 Quad Core, Boxed processor, 2.40 GHz, 1066MHz FSB, 8 MB Cache,

Memory: SuperTalent - DDR2-800 1G/128x64 CL4 Memory PC 6400.
Memory 2: SuperTalent - DDR2-800 1G/128x64 CL4 Memory PC 6400.

Hard Drive 1: SEAGATE - Seagate 80G ATA100/7200Rpm 2 meg ST 380215A
Hard Drive 2: SEAGATE - 500G 16Meg Sata II Perpendicular ST3500630AS
Hard Drive 3: SEAGATE - 500G 16Meg Sata II Perpendicular ST3500630AS

Video: XFX - XFX nVidia GeForce 8600GT 256MB 540MHz 2DVI/HDTV PCI-Express Video Card

CD/CD-RW/DVD Panasonic - Panasonic Blu-ray SW-5582

Sound Card Onboard

NIC LinkSys - WIRELESS -G PCI CARD 54

Operating System Microsoft - WINDOWS XP Professional OEM full version w/manual and keycode.

Hello Chris,

That looks pretty good to me... I'll make some specific comments..

ADK Tower - Never heard of it. If you've seen it and you like it, great..

Motherboard: Daw Core? If Daw is a brand, I've never heard of it and would stay away. If it's not a brand and you meant dual, then stick with a good brand such as Gigabyte, ASUS, Intel, etc.

NIC: Just be carefull to set your wireless system with lots of security in mind.

Memory looks fine, though I've never run SuperTalent memory, should be okay.

Hard Drives, I would not use that 80G drive as a system drive. It's an older slower unit. Purchase a new, larger faster hard drive as your system drive. RAID up the two 500G hard drives into a RAID 0 for fastest performance.

Is that panasonic Blu-Ray drive a burner or just a reader?

Video Card is perfect..

Jon