Image Quality in SD

Nate Weaver · March 31st, 2005, 08:17 AM

I remember thinking before I actually saw and worked with HDV that all the color correction I do in my work would fall apart with HDV, that MPEG2 couldn't possibly hold up, and that I'd never want to work in it.

It's not that bad. Really, in some ways, I prefer it to DV. I haven't made any objective tests, but it seems to have less of the DV characteristic mosquito noise...and the MPEG2 motion business only falls down if you have whole frame movement quick and frequent enough to make people seasick anyway.

Of course these are just my opinions, and other people will think I'm crazy. But please please work with it a little before you denounce it so much, especially here.

Also, if you're scared of the flow so much, just find an NLE that converts on input. Apple is taking that route, and I'm glad for it.

Ken Hodson · March 31st, 2005, 10:02 AM

Aaron - "but I can't get my head around working on a timeline in MPG2."

Well even if one were to work with HDV you are not forced to stay in the .mT2 codec. No professional would. Solutions from Canopus and Cineform and others are what make this new format excell.

Tom Roper · March 31st, 2005, 12:37 PM

If you have the the look you want without color/exposure corrections in post, a $120 program called Womble MPEG Video Wizard will edit (very fast) directly onto the m2t stream, not only just the usual cuts and joins but also transitions, titling, dubbing, voice overs and music tracks.

The output is only re-encoded for a few frames around the edit points for transitions and title frames, and not at all for simple cuts and joins. Your video output remains native and lossless.

Steve Mullen · April 2nd, 2005, 06:19 PM

<<<-- Originally posted by Ken Hodson : Aaron - "but I can't get my head around working on a timeline in MPG2."

Well even if one were to work with HDV you are not forced to stay in the .mT2 codec. No professional would. Solutions from Canopus and Cineform and others are what make this new format excell. -->>>

That's such an important point. Although one can edit 720p24/30 very easily on a 3.2GHz P4 -- the 2X compute requiements of 1080i really make CineForm the PC solution. Looks like AIC and DVCPRO HD are our only "poor" choices from Apple.

It's interesting that those who rail most against MPEG-2 both have no experience with it and no idea of how it's edited.

March 31st, 2005, 10:02 AM	#17
Ken Hodson Trustee Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Vancouver BC Canada Posts: 1,315	Aaron - "but I can't get my head around working on a timeline in MPG2." Well even if one were to work with HDV you are not forced to stay in the .mT2 codec. No professional would. Solutions from Canopus and Cineform and others are what make this new format excell. __________________ Damnit Jim, I'm a film maker not a sysytems tech.

April 2nd, 2005, 06:19 PM	#19
Steve Mullen HDV Cinema Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Las Vegas Posts: 4,007	<<<-- Originally posted by Ken Hodson : Aaron - "but I can't get my head around working on a timeline in MPG2." Well even if one were to work with HDV you are not forced to stay in the .mT2 codec. No professional would. Solutions from Canopus and Cineform and others are what make this new format excell. -->>> That's such an important point. Although one can edit 720p24/30 very easily on a 3.2GHz P4 -- the 2X compute requiements of 1080i really make CineForm the PC solution. Looks like AIC and DVCPRO HD are our only "poor" choices from Apple. It's interesting that those who rail most against MPEG-2 both have no experience with it and no idea of how it's edited. __________________ Switcher's Quick Guide to the Avid Media Composer >>> http://home.mindspring.com/~d-v-c

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March 31st, 2005, 08:17 AM	#16
Nate Weaver Wrangler Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Los Angeles, CA Posts: 2,100	I remember thinking before I actually saw and worked with HDV that all the color correction I do in my work would fall apart with HDV, that MPEG2 couldn't possibly hold up, and that I'd never want to work in it. It's not that bad. Really, in some ways, I prefer it to DV. I haven't made any objective tests, but it seems to have less of the DV characteristic mosquito noise...and the MPEG2 motion business only falls down if you have whole frame movement quick and frequent enough to make people seasick anyway. Of course these are just my opinions, and other people will think I'm crazy. But please please work with it a little before you denounce it so much, especially here. Also, if you're scared of the flow so much, just find an NLE that converts on input. Apple is taking that route, and I'm glad for it.

March 31st, 2005, 12:37 PM	#18
Tom Roper Trustee Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Denver, Colorado Posts: 1,891	If you have the the look you want without color/exposure corrections in post, a $120 program called Womble MPEG Video Wizard will edit (very fast) directly onto the m2t stream, not only just the usual cuts and joins but also transitions, titling, dubbing, voice overs and music tracks. The output is only re-encoded for a few frames around the edit points for transitions and title frames, and not at all for simple cuts and joins. Your video output remains native and lossless.