JVC BR-HD50, Blackmagic Decklink HD, and HDMI at DVinfo.net

Doug Krejci · April 27th, 2007, 05:31 PM

I'm trying to connect a JVC BR-HD50 to a Blackmagic Decklink HD card (for FCP 5.1.4) with an HDMI cable. I've read the posts about the v1.08 firmware update for the deck and have done that.

I had written a JVC tech and he told me (with regards to HDMI), "The BRHD50 firmware upgrade is related to HDMI output with HDCP, so that
HDMI can be used as a digital source to convert externally to HDSDI for
certain high end NLE systems. If you are thinking about editing with HDSDI,
then the HDMI would be available as a 1080i cross-convert by selecting the
output in a menu, but if you are thinking of editing via firewire, then the
IEEE1394 will be 720p and does not go through any conversion internally in
the deck or camera."

Having read that, I set the internal settings to upconvert my 480p60 footage (the tape I'm using to test this) to 1080i. My viewing monitor recognizes it as 1080i, but the card keeps saying "no video input".

In FCP, I set up my settings for 1080i59.94. My computer is a Mac Pro 8-core.

I've been on the phone with Blackmagic and they are blaming the deck.

I'm assuming it's something internal on the deck settings I am forgetting or is it more than that? Are there workarounds?

Any help or advice would be appreciated!

Thank you in advance!
Doug

Tim Dashwood · April 27th, 2007, 05:41 PM

I'm confused as to exactly how you are connecting the deck to the card?

Do you have a Decklink HD for HD-SDI input or an Intensity for HDMI input?

If you have a Decklink HD that only has HD-SDI input, then you should get a Convergent-Design HD-Connect MI or nanoconnect. I have a HD-Connect MI sitting here in front of me and it works incredibly well for HDMI to HD-SDI output from the BR-HD50 deck. It even embeds the audio into HD-SDI!

If you have an intensity, then you need to go into the deck menu and turn off HDCP.

Doug Krejci · April 27th, 2007, 09:17 PM

The Blackmagic card I have is a Decklink HD Studio card. The BR-HD50 connects to it through the HDMI cables. It's very similar to the Intensity card with a few more features. There is an HDMI in (from deck in my system), and HDMI out (to master display monitor), and then a pigtail with lots of different cables - component in/out, XLR in/out, aes/beu in/out, ref in, and 422 deck control. I don't believe the card has HD-SDI input.

Where is the menu item in the deck to turn off HDCP? I did upgrade to v1.08 of the firmware and I can't seem to find it.

Thank you for the suggestions! Keep them coming!

Doug

Justin Ferar · April 28th, 2007, 12:51 AM

Doug,

If you can't find the menu item to turn off the HDCP then it may be that the firmware upgrade didn't take. Just a thought.

I'm about to go through the same process but haven't had time to download and install. It SHOULD be in the menu somewhere.

Tim Dashwood · April 28th, 2007, 06:36 PM

Sorry for the confusion. I was mistaken about the name of the menu item.
It's actually called HDMI MODE, and it should be on AUTO. However, this doesn't directly affect HDCP. After further research I now realize that the HDCP on/off is set automatically based the request from the HDMI monitor or digitizer card.

I'd like you to try a few different things to make this work properly:

First, disconnect the HDMI monitor from your Decklink card. You can re-connect it once we confirm that you can digitize properly.

I've just gone into the menus of v1.08 and there are a few things you must do to make your upconversion from 480P60 work properly. You will need to connect a composite or component cable and monitor to see the menus before you get this setup properly.

Go into the VIDEO menu and set the MONITOR SELECT to OUT FORMAT. The other option HDMI[A] may also work, but this setting allows the monitor to determine output format and resolution, and then request it from the source. If you had this set to HDMI[A], then I think your HDMI monitor, and not the Decklink, was probably telling the deck to upconvert to 1080i. This normally wouldn't be a problem, but the monitor was probably also requesting HDCP from the deck, which would be incompatible with the Decklink.
Anyway, try using the OUT FORMAT option so that you can manually set the cross-converter yourself.
Set OUT FORMAT [60] to 1080i.

Set UP CONV MODE to FULL so that the full 16x9 frame is upconverted correctly to 1080i.

Now confirm that you have downloaded and installed the latest Decklink drivers.
Make sure that your input port in the capture preset is set to HDMI.

Do a test capture and if it works reconnect the HDMI monitor.

UPDATE:
Oh No! I just checked Blackmagic's site and found this:
http://www.decklink.com/support/detail.asp?techID=178

You said that you have a Decklink HD Studio. At the bottom of this tech support document is says:

DeckLink HD Studio compatibility with JVC BR-HD50U

DeckLink HD Studio includes built-in RS-422 device control and can be used to capture the component analog video output of the JVC BR-HD50U deck. DeckLink HD Studio cannot currently capture HDMI video from the JVC BR-HD50U deck but we expect a firmware update will provide HDMI compatibilty in the next month or two.

Firmware v1.08 was already available when that tech note was released, so they must mean that another firmware update will be required. This probably has something to do with the HDMI pass through to a monitor that is expecting HDCP.

I'm surprised Blackmagic's tech support didn't mention this to you.

Doug Krejci · April 28th, 2007, 11:10 PM

Thank you so much for the research and the checking. I have most of your settings in my HD50 that way, but certainly that buried post on Blackmagic's site is most suspect! I'm assuming they are talking about themselves when they are talking about the firmware update. They will be hearing from me on Monday . . . I'll let you know what they say.

So, in the meantime - should I just play it safe and stick to an upconverted 720p video out through firewire?

Thank you so much again,
Doug

Doug Krejci · April 30th, 2007, 05:22 PM

I called Blackmagic today and not only do they have no timetable for resolving the HDCP issue in the HD Studio Card, the rep put me on hold for 15 minutes to tell me (news to him) that "we have now discontinued the HD Studio Card and it's psudeo-replacement the Intensity Pro won't be out until the end of May".

I was able to use my HD-50 through the component outs to send 720p 59.97 to the component ins of the now-discontinued card that I bought a week ago.

Any suggestions for replacements? Looking for HDMI in/out, component in/out, reference in, XLR in/out, 422 control - composite in/out and unbalanced RCA in/out would be nice too.

Thanks,
Doug

April 27th, 2007, 05:31 PM	#1
Doug Krejci New Boot Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Cedar Rapids, Iowa Posts: 20	JVC BR-HD50, Blackmagic Decklink HD, and HDMI I'm trying to connect a JVC BR-HD50 to a Blackmagic Decklink HD card (for FCP 5.1.4) with an HDMI cable. I've read the posts about the v1.08 firmware update for the deck and have done that. I had written a JVC tech and he told me (with regards to HDMI), "The BRHD50 firmware upgrade is related to HDMI output with HDCP, so that HDMI can be used as a digital source to convert externally to HDSDI for certain high end NLE systems. If you are thinking about editing with HDSDI, then the HDMI would be available as a 1080i cross-convert by selecting the output in a menu, but if you are thinking of editing via firewire, then the IEEE1394 will be 720p and does not go through any conversion internally in the deck or camera." Having read that, I set the internal settings to upconvert my 480p60 footage (the tape I'm using to test this) to 1080i. My viewing monitor recognizes it as 1080i, but the card keeps saying "no video input". In FCP, I set up my settings for 1080i59.94. My computer is a Mac Pro 8-core. I've been on the phone with Blackmagic and they are blaming the deck. I'm assuming it's something internal on the deck settings I am forgetting or is it more than that? Are there workarounds? Any help or advice would be appreciated! Thank you in advance! Doug

April 27th, 2007, 05:41 PM	#2
Tim Dashwood Wrangler Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Toronto, ON, Canada Posts: 3,637	I'm confused as to exactly how you are connecting the deck to the card? Do you have a Decklink HD for HD-SDI input or an Intensity for HDMI input? If you have a Decklink HD that only has HD-SDI input, then you should get a Convergent-Design HD-Connect MI or nanoconnect. I have a HD-Connect MI sitting here in front of me and it works incredibly well for HDMI to HD-SDI output from the BR-HD50 deck. It even embeds the audio into HD-SDI! If you have an intensity, then you need to go into the deck menu and turn off HDCP. __________________ Tim Dashwood

April 27th, 2007, 09:17 PM	#3
Doug Krejci New Boot Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Cedar Rapids, Iowa Posts: 20	Connection To Card The Blackmagic card I have is a Decklink HD Studio card. The BR-HD50 connects to it through the HDMI cables. It's very similar to the Intensity card with a few more features. There is an HDMI in (from deck in my system), and HDMI out (to master display monitor), and then a pigtail with lots of different cables - component in/out, XLR in/out, aes/beu in/out, ref in, and 422 deck control. I don't believe the card has HD-SDI input. Where is the menu item in the deck to turn off HDCP? I did upgrade to v1.08 of the firmware and I can't seem to find it. Thank you for the suggestions! Keep them coming! Doug

April 28th, 2007, 12:51 AM	#4
Justin Ferar Major Player Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Larkspur, CA Posts: 378	Doug, If you can't find the menu item to turn off the HDCP then it may be that the firmware upgrade didn't take. Just a thought. I'm about to go through the same process but haven't had time to download and install. It SHOULD be in the menu somewhere. __________________ www.justinferar.com www.weddingsonfilm.com

April 28th, 2007, 06:36 PM	#5
Tim Dashwood Wrangler Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Toronto, ON, Canada Posts: 3,637	Sorry for the confusion. I was mistaken about the name of the menu item. It's actually called HDMI MODE, and it should be on AUTO. However, this doesn't directly affect HDCP. After further research I now realize that the HDCP on/off is set automatically based the request from the HDMI monitor or digitizer card. I'd like you to try a few different things to make this work properly: First, disconnect the HDMI monitor from your Decklink card. You can re-connect it once we confirm that you can digitize properly. I've just gone into the menus of v1.08 and there are a few things you must do to make your upconversion from 480P60 work properly. You will need to connect a composite or component cable and monitor to see the menus before you get this setup properly. Go into the VIDEO menu and set the MONITOR SELECT to OUT FORMAT. The other option HDMI[A] may also work, but this setting allows the monitor to determine output format and resolution, and then request it from the source. If you had this set to HDMI[A], then I think your HDMI monitor, and not the Decklink, was probably telling the deck to upconvert to 1080i. This normally wouldn't be a problem, but the monitor was probably also requesting HDCP from the deck, which would be incompatible with the Decklink. Anyway, try using the OUT FORMAT option so that you can manually set the cross-converter yourself. Set OUT FORMAT [60] to 1080i. Set UP CONV MODE to FULL so that the full 16x9 frame is upconverted correctly to 1080i. Now confirm that you have downloaded and installed the latest Decklink drivers. Make sure that your input port in the capture preset is set to HDMI. Do a test capture and if it works reconnect the HDMI monitor. UPDATE: Oh No! I just checked Blackmagic's site and found this: http://www.decklink.com/support/detail.asp?techID=178 You said that you have a Decklink HD Studio. At the bottom of this tech support document is says: DeckLink HD Studio compatibility with JVC BR-HD50U DeckLink HD Studio includes built-in RS-422 device control and can be used to capture the component analog video output of the JVC BR-HD50U deck. DeckLink HD Studio cannot currently capture HDMI video from the JVC BR-HD50U deck but we expect a firmware update will provide HDMI compatibilty in the next month or two. Firmware v1.08 was already available when that tech note was released, so they must mean that another firmware update will be required. This probably has something to do with the HDMI pass through to a monitor that is expecting HDCP. I'm surprised Blackmagic's tech support didn't mention this to you. __________________ Tim Dashwood

April 28th, 2007, 11:10 PM	#6
Doug Krejci New Boot Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Cedar Rapids, Iowa Posts: 20	Wow Tim! Thanks! Thank you so much for the research and the checking. I have most of your settings in my HD50 that way, but certainly that buried post on Blackmagic's site is most suspect! I'm assuming they are talking about themselves when they are talking about the firmware update. They will be hearing from me on Monday . . . I'll let you know what they say. So, in the meantime - should I just play it safe and stick to an upconverted 720p video out through firewire? Thank you so much again, Doug

April 30th, 2007, 05:22 PM	#7
Doug Krejci New Boot Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Cedar Rapids, Iowa Posts: 20	It Gets Worse I called Blackmagic today and not only do they have no timetable for resolving the HDCP issue in the HD Studio Card, the rep put me on hold for 15 minutes to tell me (news to him) that "we have now discontinued the HD Studio Card and it's psudeo-replacement the Intensity Pro won't be out until the end of May". I was able to use my HD-50 through the component outs to send 720p 59.97 to the component ins of the now-discontinued card that I bought a week ago. Any suggestions for replacements? Looking for HDMI in/out, component in/out, reference in, XLR in/out, 422 control - composite in/out and unbalanced RCA in/out would be nice too. Thanks, Doug