HM100 - very hissy pre-amps???

Shaun Walker · May 28th, 2009, 06:58 AM

... Just won a new/sealed/USA HM100 for $3,000 on eBay! Nobody else bid -- not even a last minute swooper. Makes me a little nervous, actually ...
I should have it Friday or Monday; same with extra batteries, 16 GB cards, cheapo HOYA HMC 46mm haze to protect it just in case I can't stand the boring and not long OR wide enough 39mm-390mm lens and possibly inadequate OIS and yearn for a 16x-20x. I might wait for the replacement for the Canon XH A1S or a stock EX-recording Sony Z series if so.
A smooth Libec H38 head and versatile Bogen 535 legs (10"-67"/75mm/5lbs ... a semi-poor man's Miller DV Solo CF) should come next week, and a nice shotgun of some sort :)

Very good info to know about the NTG-1 vs. NTG-3 shotguns, Thanks! -- I wonder how the Rode NTG-3 compares to a Sennheiser ME66 or maaaybe a cheaper/shorter AT875??

Now, time to install FCE 3.5, then 4.0 upgrade, then Calibrated Q XD Decode, Sony XDCAM EX Clip Browser, and MPEG Streamclip on my poor little unsuspecting white 2006 1.87Ghz Core 2 Duo MacBook with 2GB RAM and a 200GB/7200rpm HD. I should get my external FW400 drive reconnected.
I wonder if my MacBook will be able to cope with anything from my new HM100 ... I'm hoping for at least some short, cuts-only practice and HD viewing on my 20" Cinema.
Tough decision on either a Mac Pro, a MacBook Pro, or probably just a quad-core Hackintosh very soon (Snow Leopard compatibility?!?), I'm sure. And the new Final Cut Studio not long after that?

Bob Richardson · May 28th, 2009, 11:10 AM

Shaun -

FYI, I use Final Cut Express 4, and recently upgraded my hardware to one of the current 8-core Mac Pros.

I don't have my HM700 yet (still waiting, better be today or tomorrow, dang-it!), but I've played with some of the available footage online.

You should know that FCE4 does NOT take advantage of all the cores in your machine when rendering. Typically I get CPU usage figures of around 300-400% (of 1600%) when rendering.

Also, FCE4 does NOT offer a 1080p30 sequence preset, so you'll either have to edit in 720p30 if you must have progressive, or edit your 1080 footage in 1080i60 no matter how it was shot.

So I'm planning on upgrading to Final Cut Studio ... hopefully the latest greatest version will be out in the next couple of months and we'll know just how well it uses multiple cores.

Ironically, one function of FCE4 that makes good use of multiple cores is the Log and Transfer panel, where I'll see spikes around 1200% when importing AVCHD. But I'll no longer have to do that as part of my work flow if and when my camera arrives.

Shaun Walker · May 28th, 2009, 11:49 AM

So using FCE with the HM100 35Mbps footage is possible, just slow and limited ... Nice!

And there's no image/sound/CODEC quality difference from using FCE over the Studio/Pro version?

Once you get your HM700, what will a brief breakdown of your workflow be?
(I last edited video on a deck to deck Beta SP, S-VHS, 3/4" set ups in 1992-95!!!)

Thanks!

Could I get your email so we can exchange the occasional tip/solution/enhancement and such?

Shaun Walker
shaunotter ( a t ) ya h oo (do t) co m

Shaun Walker · May 28th, 2009, 11:51 AM

What did you upgrade from to your Mac Pro 8-core?

What difference has it made, during what tasks?

Les Howarth · May 28th, 2009, 12:31 PM

Re the Mics mentioned - The NTG-3 is aimed squarely at the venerable 416 and you may find a link to sample files of the 2 side by side in the audio section here on dvinfo.

The NTG-1 is notably crisper an louder than my old at835b. AT seem to do good budget mics (and of course not so budget mics too) and the at827 seems to be a good fit for both quality and size as recommended by those on here who already got their HM100's. Since I have the Rodes I will probably try the NTG1 on the HM when I get one and try out the NTG-3 for size as well although its quite a lot heavier.

>> my mistake the short 7" Audio Technica people mentioned was the AT875(R)

Bob Richardson · May 28th, 2009, 12:36 PM

I upgraded from a 1.66 GHz Core Duo Mac Mini with 2GB ram. (NOT a Core 2 Duo). The new machine is a 2.26GHz 8-core Mac Pro (2 Quad-Core Xeons) with 12GB ram (2GB sticks x 6).

Even though FCE4 is effectively only using 2 cores out of 8 on my Mac Pro, in rendering tests I've done, I see a 3X to 4.5X speed improvement over the old Mac Mini. (And something like a 10X improvement for AVCHD log & transfer.)

But if multiprocessing was used to it's fullest potential, I could be seeing a 16X increase... one can hope.

I haven't been able to do tests with Compressor... something got messed up in the transfer of applications from the Mac Mini and Compressor hangs or aborts when run from its own interface. I may need to do a clean install, but that can wait for the next major release of Final Cut.

All things being equal, if you do NOT plan on upgrading from FCE4 for a long period of time, it may be to your advantage to get a 4-core machine at a higher clock speed, rather than an 8-core machine at a lower clock speed.

I'm planning on keeping this machine for a good long while, so I'm betting/hoping that software will be rewritten to take far better advantage of multi-threading, taking more and more advantage of the extra cores in a reasonable time frame.

Shaun Walker · May 28th, 2009, 12:43 PM

Mostly as a ultra-compact set up super-short-shotgun, the MKE 400
Sennheiser | MKE 400 Compact Video Camera Shotgun | MKE 400

Can't find info on the AT827 ...

Bob Richardson · May 28th, 2009, 12:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shaun Walker

And there's no image/sound/CODEC quality difference from using FCE over the Studio/Pro version?

Not that I'm aware of, except for the aforementioned lack of 1080p30 in FCE.

Quote:

Once you get your HM700, what will a brief breakdown of your workflow be?

It will probably be a simplification of my current workflow.

Right now I use consumer Canon HF-10/HF-100 cameras for acquisition, which use SDHC cards and record in AVCHD format (1920x1080 in the camera's highest-quality bitrate setting).

The directory tree on the SD card is a real maze, you can't just store the stream files (log & transfer is looking for other metadata), so I archive the cards on my video drive in "Raw Footage Archive" folder, with subfolders by project name, and each "shoot" dated in its own folder, then the exact contents of the SD card. Basically, I'm keeping an exact copy of every SD card, so that it could theoretically be replicated and stuck right back in the camera exactly as it was found. I then do log & transfer imports, as needed, from these archived folders.

But the HM700 needs no Log & Transfer stage, you can drag clips directly to the timeline, so I may wind up storing raw footage under the same folder tree where I store my final cut projects, additional media (logos, stills), etc.

Quote:

(I last edited video on a deck to deck Beta SP, S-VHS, 3/4" set ups in 1992-95!!!)

I'm right there with you... I do primarily software development and web design, with a smattering of video production for clients who need it and for local civic affairs. My last "true pro" video full-time work was shot/edited on 3/4", and a few later projects on Beta SP, late 80's into early 90's.

I'm sure I'll spend a good deal of time unlearning the bad habits I've picked up since then. :-)

For example, since most of my current work is for web-publication only, I've started using a little trick where I shoot in 1920x1080, but edit in 1280x720. Any time something is at the periphery of a frame that I want to hide, or any time I want to add a little panning or light zooming effect, I can expand the footage quite a bit (to 150%) without losing any resolution or seeing major artifacts.

But if I intend to do high-quality work for distribution as 1080, none of those cheats will work.

Quote:

Could I get your email so we can exchange the occasional tip/solution/enhancement and such?

bob at peak dot org
or
sales at sqwarellc dot com

Shaun Walker · May 28th, 2009, 01:01 PM

Snow Leopard OS X 10.6 in the next few months could make life happier on the multi-cores, and add GPU utilization.

Gizmodo - Mac OS 10.6 Snow Leopard Revealed: Multi-Core Optimized, GPU Lovin' OS Upgrade Due In One Year - Snow leopard

Final Cut Pro Studio 3 to allow realtime editing of 1080P H.264 video? | 9 to 5 Mac

Matthias Krause · May 28th, 2009, 01:04 PM

...and now back to our regular program...

Bob Richardson · May 28th, 2009, 01:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Matthias Krause

...and now back to our regular program...

Sorry to totally from divert the audo pre-amp discussion. I know I get annoyed when it happens to me in other forums. :-)

Shaun Walker · May 28th, 2009, 01:38 PM

Yeah, perhaps 3 more separate discussions could have arisen? This expanded seems to work OK for now, as there is little to read about the new HM100 and 700 and it's nice to bounce around ideas and tips.

The flow can be quite nice, feels more like a human conversation, where you can go from topic to topic and then back ...

SO ANYHOW ... What are some good manual audio control tips for HD sound in news/loud-then-quiet-event/actuality/run-n-gun situations in general? I liked the one about having Ch. 1 set on Auto and Ch. 2 set to Manual 2 just in case the auto goes too loud or the source gets too loud for the auto to handle. What else might save my a s s someday or make life easier?

May 28th, 2009, 06:58 AM	#31
Shaun Walker Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Eureka, Calif. Posts: 98	Looks like I'll soon see for myself! ... Just won a new/sealed/USA HM100 for $3,000 on eBay! Nobody else bid -- not even a last minute swooper. Makes me a little nervous, actually ... I should have it Friday or Monday; same with extra batteries, 16 GB cards, cheapo HOYA HMC 46mm haze to protect it just in case I can't stand the boring and not long OR wide enough 39mm-390mm lens and possibly inadequate OIS and yearn for a 16x-20x. I might wait for the replacement for the Canon XH A1S or a stock EX-recording Sony Z series if so. A smooth Libec H38 head and versatile Bogen 535 legs (10"-67"/75mm/5lbs ... a semi-poor man's Miller DV Solo CF) should come next week, and a nice shotgun of some sort :) Very good info to know about the NTG-1 vs. NTG-3 shotguns, Thanks! -- I wonder how the Rode NTG-3 compares to a Sennheiser ME66 or maaaybe a cheaper/shorter AT875?? Now, time to install FCE 3.5, then 4.0 upgrade, then Calibrated Q XD Decode, Sony XDCAM EX Clip Browser, and MPEG Streamclip on my poor little unsuspecting white 2006 1.87Ghz Core 2 Duo MacBook with 2GB RAM and a 200GB/7200rpm HD. I should get my external FW400 drive reconnected. I wonder if my MacBook will be able to cope with anything from my new HM100 ... I'm hoping for at least some short, cuts-only practice and HD viewing on my 20" Cinema. Tough decision on either a Mac Pro, a MacBook Pro, or probably just a quad-core Hackintosh very soon (Snow Leopard compatibility?!?), I'm sure. And the new Final Cut Studio not long after that?

May 28th, 2009, 11:49 AM	#33
Shaun Walker Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Eureka, Calif. Posts: 98	Good to know ... So using FCE with the HM100 35Mbps footage is possible, just slow and limited ... Nice! And there's no image/sound/CODEC quality difference from using FCE over the Studio/Pro version? Once you get your HM700, what will a brief breakdown of your workflow be? (I last edited video on a deck to deck Beta SP, S-VHS, 3/4" set ups in 1992-95!!!) Thanks! Could I get your email so we can exchange the occasional tip/solution/enhancement and such? Shaun Walker shaunotter ( a t ) ya h oo (do t) co m

May 28th, 2009, 11:51 AM	#34
Shaun Walker Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Eureka, Calif. Posts: 98	From ?? to 8-core? What did you upgrade from to your Mac Pro 8-core? What difference has it made, during what tasks?

May 28th, 2009, 12:31 PM	#35
Les Howarth Regular Crew Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Manchester England Posts: 40	Re the Mics mentioned - The NTG-3 is aimed squarely at the venerable 416 and you may find a link to sample files of the 2 side by side in the audio section here on dvinfo. The NTG-1 is notably crisper an louder than my old at835b. AT seem to do good budget mics (and of course not so budget mics too) and the at827 seems to be a good fit for both quality and size as recommended by those on here who already got their HM100's. Since I have the Rodes I will probably try the NTG1 on the HM when I get one and try out the NTG-3 for size as well although its quite a lot heavier. >> my mistake the short 7" Audio Technica people mentioned was the AT875(R) Last edited by Les Howarth; May 28th, 2009 at 06:02 PM. Reason: error

May 28th, 2009, 12:43 PM	#37
Shaun Walker Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Eureka, Calif. Posts: 98	Any idea about this for without handle/XLRs, as back up ... Mostly as a ultra-compact set up super-short-shotgun, the MKE 400 Sennheiser \| MKE 400 Compact Video Camera Shotgun \| MKE 400 Can't find info on the AT827 ...

May 28th, 2009, 11:10 AM	#32
Bob Richardson Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Portland, OR Posts: 178	Shaun - FYI, I use Final Cut Express 4, and recently upgraded my hardware to one of the current 8-core Mac Pros. I don't have my HM700 yet (still waiting, better be today or tomorrow, dang-it!), but I've played with some of the available footage online. You should know that FCE4 does NOT take advantage of all the cores in your machine when rendering. Typically I get CPU usage figures of around 300-400% (of 1600%) when rendering. Also, FCE4 does NOT offer a 1080p30 sequence preset, so you'll either have to edit in 720p30 if you must have progressive, or edit your 1080 footage in 1080i60 no matter how it was shot. So I'm planning on upgrading to Final Cut Studio ... hopefully the latest greatest version will be out in the next couple of months and we'll know just how well it uses multiple cores. Ironically, one function of FCE4 that makes good use of multiple cores is the Log and Transfer panel, where I'll see spikes around 1200% when importing AVCHD. But I'll no longer have to do that as part of my work flow if and when my camera arrives.

May 28th, 2009, 12:36 PM	#36
Bob Richardson Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Portland, OR Posts: 178	I upgraded from a 1.66 GHz Core Duo Mac Mini with 2GB ram. (NOT a Core 2 Duo). The new machine is a 2.26GHz 8-core Mac Pro (2 Quad-Core Xeons) with 12GB ram (2GB sticks x 6). Even though FCE4 is effectively only using 2 cores out of 8 on my Mac Pro, in rendering tests I've done, I see a 3X to 4.5X speed improvement over the old Mac Mini. (And something like a 10X improvement for AVCHD log & transfer.) But if multiprocessing was used to it's fullest potential, I could be seeing a 16X increase... one can hope. I haven't been able to do tests with Compressor... something got messed up in the transfer of applications from the Mac Mini and Compressor hangs or aborts when run from its own interface. I may need to do a clean install, but that can wait for the next major release of Final Cut. All things being equal, if you do NOT plan on upgrading from FCE4 for a long period of time, it may be to your advantage to get a 4-core machine at a higher clock speed, rather than an 8-core machine at a lower clock speed. I'm planning on keeping this machine for a good long while, so I'm betting/hoping that software will be rewritten to take far better advantage of multi-threading, taking more and more advantage of the extra cores in a reasonable time frame.

May 28th, 2009, 01:01 PM	#39
Shaun Walker Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Eureka, Calif. Posts: 98	Forecast calls for SNOW ... Snow Leopard OS X 10.6 in the next few months could make life happier on the multi-cores, and add GPU utilization. Gizmodo - Mac OS 10.6 Snow Leopard Revealed: Multi-Core Optimized, GPU Lovin' OS Upgrade Due In One Year - Snow leopard Final Cut Pro Studio 3 to allow realtime editing of 1080P H.264 video? \| 9 to 5 Mac

May 28th, 2009, 01:04 PM	#40
Matthias Krause Major Player Join Date: May 2007 Location: NYC Posts: 203	...and now back to our regular program...

May 28th, 2009, 01:38 PM	#42
Shaun Walker Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Eureka, Calif. Posts: 98	Yeah, perhaps 3 more separate discussions could have arisen? This expanded seems to work OK for now, as there is little to read about the new HM100 and 700 and it's nice to bounce around ideas and tips. The flow can be quite nice, feels more like a human conversation, where you can go from topic to topic and then back ... SO ANYHOW ... What are some good manual audio control tips for HD sound in news/loud-then-quiet-event/actuality/run-n-gun situations in general? I liked the one about having Ch. 1 set on Auto and Ch. 2 set to Manual 2 just in case the auto goes too loud or the source gets too loud for the auto to handle. What else might save my a s s someday or make life easier?