high speed betacam deck at DVinfo.net

Zach Gold · August 13th, 2010, 09:23 AM

Hi,

I know this is DV Info, but I couldn't find a more appropriate forum to pose this question. I'm new to Betacam and and am wondering if there are decks capable of high speed recording. Basically, I own several vintage tube cameras and heard that the later models were capable of much faster capture than CCD or CMOS. Since it's an analog output, it seems all that would be necessary is a tape deck that can run at much faster than regular speed while recording and then back down to normal for playback. Does anyone know if such a thing exists? If so, can you recommend some models I'm likely to find for cheap on eBay?

Thanks,
Zach

Daniel Epstein · August 14th, 2010, 09:27 AM

Zach,
I don't think there is a Betacam recorder like the one you describe. There was a super slo mo system which Sony developed which had a camera and deck which recorded at a higher frame rate and then played back at normal but I don't think you could get any results from just any camera. The Sony BVW-9000 Deck comes up but you should do some research if it will actually help you

Brian Drysdale · August 14th, 2010, 02:02 PM

Any slow motion with Betacam I've some across has been the images played back slower in post rather than recorded at a higher frame rate.

Zach Gold · August 15th, 2010, 05:39 PM

Daniel, thanks for the tip. I'll be on the lookout for the BVW-9000 on eBay, although they seem pretty rare. Do you know if it generates a faster sync signal or relies on the camera for that? As these tube cameras were not designed for slow motion, they would supply a regular sync and I'm not sure if this would scramble the video once played back at a regular speed with regular sync. Most of the cameras do have an external sync input, so this is an option as well.

Brian, I'm wondering how slow motion was accomplished in analog. If the tape was played back slower with a slower sync signal, is there a choppiness as with film? Do you know of a deck that has this feature?

I'm also interested in reel-to-reel videotape machines for delays. Do you guys know of any reel-to-reel videotape machines? It doesn't have to be Betacam- I would use 3/4" or 1" even.

Thanks,
Zach

Brian Drysdale · August 16th, 2010, 10:40 AM

Any time I actually saw the slow motion being done, it was through a Quantel or Grass Valley digital unit, these used hard drive disks for effects work.

Zach Gold · August 16th, 2010, 11:30 AM

Any idea about the choppiness compared to film slow motion done in post? Also, do you remember what those digital slow motion units are called or are they just part of multi effects rigs? I see a lot of Sony DME-450s for sale; do you know if they can do slow motion?

Brian Drysdale · August 16th, 2010, 01:15 PM

It basically looks the same as step printing film, it doesn't have the extra information that a true high frame rate at the time of shooting would provide.

They were part of the digital effects console. I expect you could also do it by controlling the playback speed of the tape machine using a varispeed control.

Zach Gold · August 16th, 2010, 03:07 PM

So, it would seem I need a varispeed tape deck meant for recording at high speed. I would love more recommendations for common units (of any format) with this feature.

I found this from a Google search, which leads me to believe there should be a good amount of models out there:

Video editing: a postproduction primer - Google Books

I also think the Ampex HS-100 & HS-200 can record slo-mo, but aside from being a certifiable antique, it would be pretty rough using that format. For starters, I think they're limited to 30 seconds record time...

Brian Drysdale · August 16th, 2010, 05:23 PM

The Ampex HS-100 & HS-200 were intended for sport replays and were specialised kit used on sporting events.

Short record times has always been a part of slow motion.

BTW Modern CMOS video cameras can shoot HD at 2000 fps and much higher frame rates at lower resolution.

August 13th, 2010, 09:23 AM	#1
Zach Gold New Boot Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: New York, NY Posts: 17	high speed betacam deck Hi, I know this is DV Info, but I couldn't find a more appropriate forum to pose this question. I'm new to Betacam and and am wondering if there are decks capable of high speed recording. Basically, I own several vintage tube cameras and heard that the later models were capable of much faster capture than CCD or CMOS. Since it's an analog output, it seems all that would be necessary is a tape deck that can run at much faster than regular speed while recording and then back down to normal for playback. Does anyone know if such a thing exists? If so, can you recommend some models I'm likely to find for cheap on eBay? Thanks, Zach

August 14th, 2010, 09:27 AM	#2
Daniel Epstein Trustee Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: New York, NY Posts: 1,267	Zach, I don't think there is a Betacam recorder like the one you describe. There was a super slo mo system which Sony developed which had a camera and deck which recorded at a higher frame rate and then played back at normal but I don't think you could get any results from just any camera. The Sony BVW-9000 Deck comes up but you should do some research if it will actually help you

August 14th, 2010, 02:02 PM	#3
Brian Drysdale Inner Circle Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Belfast, UK Posts: 6,143	Any slow motion with Betacam I've some across has been the images played back slower in post rather than recorded at a higher frame rate.

August 15th, 2010, 05:39 PM	#4
Zach Gold New Boot Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: New York, NY Posts: 17	Daniel, thanks for the tip. I'll be on the lookout for the BVW-9000 on eBay, although they seem pretty rare. Do you know if it generates a faster sync signal or relies on the camera for that? As these tube cameras were not designed for slow motion, they would supply a regular sync and I'm not sure if this would scramble the video once played back at a regular speed with regular sync. Most of the cameras do have an external sync input, so this is an option as well. Brian, I'm wondering how slow motion was accomplished in analog. If the tape was played back slower with a slower sync signal, is there a choppiness as with film? Do you know of a deck that has this feature? I'm also interested in reel-to-reel videotape machines for delays. Do you guys know of any reel-to-reel videotape machines? It doesn't have to be Betacam- I would use 3/4" or 1" even. Thanks, Zach

August 16th, 2010, 10:40 AM	#5
Brian Drysdale Inner Circle Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Belfast, UK Posts: 6,143	Any time I actually saw the slow motion being done, it was through a Quantel or Grass Valley digital unit, these used hard drive disks for effects work.

August 16th, 2010, 11:30 AM	#6
Zach Gold New Boot Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: New York, NY Posts: 17	Any idea about the choppiness compared to film slow motion done in post? Also, do you remember what those digital slow motion units are called or are they just part of multi effects rigs? I see a lot of Sony DME-450s for sale; do you know if they can do slow motion?

August 16th, 2010, 01:15 PM	#7
Brian Drysdale Inner Circle Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Belfast, UK Posts: 6,143	It basically looks the same as step printing film, it doesn't have the extra information that a true high frame rate at the time of shooting would provide. They were part of the digital effects console. I expect you could also do it by controlling the playback speed of the tape machine using a varispeed control.

August 16th, 2010, 03:07 PM	#8
Zach Gold New Boot Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: New York, NY Posts: 17	So, it would seem I need a varispeed tape deck meant for recording at high speed. I would love more recommendations for common units (of any format) with this feature. I found this from a Google search, which leads me to believe there should be a good amount of models out there: Video editing: a postproduction primer - Google Books I also think the Ampex HS-100 & HS-200 can record slo-mo, but aside from being a certifiable antique, it would be pretty rough using that format. For starters, I think they're limited to 30 seconds record time...

August 16th, 2010, 05:23 PM	#9
Brian Drysdale Inner Circle Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Belfast, UK Posts: 6,143	The Ampex HS-100 & HS-200 were intended for sport replays and were specialised kit used on sporting events. Short record times has always been a part of slow motion. BTW Modern CMOS video cameras can shoot HD at 2000 fps and much higher frame rates at lower resolution.