RAM Upgrade = stuttery playback??? at DVinfo.net

Kevin Janisch · June 8th, 2006, 11:30 AM

I'm perplexed by this one. Upgrading my brother's Dell Dimension E510 Ram from 1GB (2x512) to 3GB with a significant drop in performance. I've tried (ordered) 3 different types of RAM to no avail. The machine runs Premiere Pro 2 just fine with 1GB, albeit slow to load the project, but once it's up it runs the way it is suppose to. When I install the additional ram, all seems alright at first until there is a small hesitation when playing clips in the source monitor or program window (slight pause before it plays) and eventually (within minutes) the clips will not play at all and if they do they are jerky and stuttery. After this, sometimes they play, sometimes they don't. And then Premiere gives me a warning message stating "Premiere Pro is running low on memory, save your project". This doesn't make sense to me as 3GB is more than plenty to run the project, as it works perfectly with just the 1GB.

Now compatibility issues with ram is obvious suspect, but I've tried Corsair and Crucial RAM with the same results. Crucial.com allowed me to select the memory based on model and it's guaranteed. The memory the machine came with is "ProMos Technologies". I basically broke down and purchased the Dell Memory last night, $200 for 2x512 as opposed to the $270 for the 2x1GB from Crucial, but if it works than fine, but I have a nagging feeling that something else is going on.

Can anybody offer suggestions as far as is there something else going on that I'm missing? Updated the Bios, all drivers are up to date, Windows update was just performed, I tried swapping the order of the chips, but keeping in pairs. Tried just the 2x1GB chips without the 2x512 that came with the machine, same problems. All is fine with just the 1GB, so I have no idea. Many thanks.

Kevin

Chris Barcellos · June 8th, 2006, 11:43 AM

I'm running Premiere Pro with 2GB on a dual core AMD, and have not stuttering problem.

I assume you entered BIOS and that BIOS has the ram registered by auto detection.

I used to have a machine that didn't seat the memory stick well, and it caused all kinds of memory issues. Have you looked at the bank to make sure there isn't some kind of physical problem.

Next question. Is this machine one that shares memory with the video card ?? That could create an issue.

Kevin Janisch · June 8th, 2006, 12:55 PM

Chris,

Yes, the BIOS shows that the RAM is detected.

I'm pretty certain the RAM is seated well, as I've popped them in and out numerous times, each time resulting in the same problems.

With just the 1GB, my MiniDV clips (XL2, 24p, 16x9) play perfectly fine. I actaully have nested sequences within nested sequences that play perfectly fine. With the additional 2GB, clips in the source window have problems playing.

The RAM is not shared with the Video Card.

Thanks for the reply.

Christopher Lefchik · June 8th, 2006, 12:59 PM

There's a chance the new memory might be defective, although it seems somewhat unlikely since the rest of your programs (and Windows) seem to be running fine. But you could try running the free DocMemory Diagnostic program just to be sure.

Glenn Chan · June 8th, 2006, 01:12 PM

Mixing different kinds of memory can cause memory performance to drop dramtically... although that usually would only make a few % different in overall performance.

With RAM, you get the best performance from pairs of identical memory (same capacity and same model).

2- In windows, you could check how much RAM is actually detected by windows. Hit crtl alt del, and go to the second tab. It should say available RAM somewhere.

Kevin Janisch · June 8th, 2006, 03:22 PM

Thanks guys. I'm getting the same behavior from 3 different sets of RAM modules. Each set is an identicle pair of 1GB memory, so don't think it's a bad chip.

Windows sees all 3GB under System in Control Panel.

The pairs are identicle to each other but all 4 chips are not identicle as far as size and brand.

I'll know for certain in a few days when I get the Dell RAM.

Kevin

Kevin Janisch · June 9th, 2006, 11:12 AM

Well, I may never know what the problem is as we opted to return the machine to Costco in favor of getting an HP. I've had nothing but good experiences with HP in the past, and don't have time to deal with Dell, we're up against a deadline.

Chances are, the memory I already ordered will work in the HP. Costco's 6-month return policy on computer equipment is fantastic. Thanks again for all of the help.

Kevin

Enrique Galvis · June 10th, 2006, 11:17 AM

Hope this gets to you in time Kevin.
Simply having more memory in your computer does not mean better performance. In some cases (I'm not sure about Ppro) when memory is getting filled the OS dumps to virtual memory on the hard disk and performance diminishes because the HDD being a mechanical device is many times slower than the memory. You should check the settings of your virtual memory so you can come to a balanced point and make the correct usage of the added memory.

Kevin Janisch · June 12th, 2006, 10:46 AM

Thanks Enrique,

I've actually been monitoring my virtual memory as well with a memory manager. I've tried a manual config at the max ~4GB and also letting windows managing the paging file. I've also shut down the memory manager tool as well so it's not the culprit.

To playback native unedited, unmodified, source DV footage doesn't take much power at all and for a beefy machine with 3GB of RAM to stutter on playback, there is something wrong, especially if it performs fine with only 1GB.

Kevin

Doug Boze · June 12th, 2006, 02:44 PM

I can't find the original source of the info, but apparently XP has problems with some software on machines with more than 2GB RAM. If the software doesn't utilize the memory reporting functions fully, XP will be unable to free up memory as needed. As a result, swapping occurs until everything collapses.

Chris Barcellos · June 12th, 2006, 03:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Doug Boze

I can't find the original source of the info, but apparently XP has problems with some software on machines with more than 2GB RAM. If the software doesn't utilize the memory reporting functions fully, XP will be unable to free up memory as needed. As a result, swapping occurs until everything collapses.

I had been considering upgrading memory past the 2 Gig I currently run, but I remembered seeing the same thing somewhere, so I didn't bother. But Kevin seems to be having issue with over one Gig, so that is more baffling.

Enrique Galvis · June 13th, 2006, 08:11 AM

Chris and Doug already mentioned the XP issue with memory which should be easy to find at htt[://www.microsoft.com and search the knowledge base for "poor video". I saw there quite a few issues with media center and a few video cards.
One thing that has turned me off by ATI is the fact that they are constantly modifying and updating their drivers. After looking at the specs of the Dell Dimension E510 you are right. Is plenty beefy, unfortunately you are going to have to make sure that the system is fully compatible and configured as per your NLE's specs. Go by the model not the brand for compatibility.
The best is not necessarily the best for your needs. I learned that lesson a long time ago with Matrox products.
Although many will argue this point it is best to keep your NLE computer isolated. No games, no cute utilities, totally separate video HDD (OS and sftwr on C: video on D:), network should be ok just avoid continued access to it while working with the NLE.

June 8th, 2006, 11:30 AM	#1
Kevin Janisch Major Player Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Monterey, CA Posts: 406	RAM Upgrade = stuttery playback??? I'm perplexed by this one. Upgrading my brother's Dell Dimension E510 Ram from 1GB (2x512) to 3GB with a significant drop in performance. I've tried (ordered) 3 different types of RAM to no avail. The machine runs Premiere Pro 2 just fine with 1GB, albeit slow to load the project, but once it's up it runs the way it is suppose to. When I install the additional ram, all seems alright at first until there is a small hesitation when playing clips in the source monitor or program window (slight pause before it plays) and eventually (within minutes) the clips will not play at all and if they do they are jerky and stuttery. After this, sometimes they play, sometimes they don't. And then Premiere gives me a warning message stating "Premiere Pro is running low on memory, save your project". This doesn't make sense to me as 3GB is more than plenty to run the project, as it works perfectly with just the 1GB. Now compatibility issues with ram is obvious suspect, but I've tried Corsair and Crucial RAM with the same results. Crucial.com allowed me to select the memory based on model and it's guaranteed. The memory the machine came with is "ProMos Technologies". I basically broke down and purchased the Dell Memory last night, $200 for 2x512 as opposed to the $270 for the 2x1GB from Crucial, but if it works than fine, but I have a nagging feeling that something else is going on. Can anybody offer suggestions as far as is there something else going on that I'm missing? Updated the Bios, all drivers are up to date, Windows update was just performed, I tried swapping the order of the chips, but keeping in pairs. Tried just the 2x1GB chips without the 2x512 that came with the machine, same problems. All is fine with just the 1GB, so I have no idea. Many thanks. Kevin

June 8th, 2006, 11:43 AM	#2
Chris Barcellos Inner Circle Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Elk Grove CA Posts: 6,838	I'm running Premiere Pro with 2GB on a dual core AMD, and have not stuttering problem. I assume you entered BIOS and that BIOS has the ram registered by auto detection. I used to have a machine that didn't seat the memory stick well, and it caused all kinds of memory issues. Have you looked at the bank to make sure there isn't some kind of physical problem. Next question. Is this machine one that shares memory with the video card ?? That could create an issue. __________________ Chris J. Barcellos

June 10th, 2006, 11:17 AM	#8
Enrique Galvis Regular Crew Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Vernon, NJ Posts: 44	Memory trouble Hope this gets to you in time Kevin. Simply having more memory in your computer does not mean better performance. In some cases (I'm not sure about Ppro) when memory is getting filled the OS dumps to virtual memory on the hard disk and performance diminishes because the HDD being a mechanical device is many times slower than the memory. You should check the settings of your virtual memory so you can come to a balanced point and make the correct usage of the added memory.

June 12th, 2006, 02:44 PM	#10
Doug Boze Major Player Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Auburn, Washington Posts: 218	Memory leakage I can't find the original source of the info, but apparently XP has problems with some software on machines with more than 2GB RAM. If the software doesn't utilize the memory reporting functions fully, XP will be unable to free up memory as needed. As a result, swapping occurs until everything collapses. __________________ "They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." -- Benjamin Franklin, 1759

June 8th, 2006, 12:55 PM	#3
Kevin Janisch Major Player Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Monterey, CA Posts: 406	Chris, Yes, the BIOS shows that the RAM is detected. I'm pretty certain the RAM is seated well, as I've popped them in and out numerous times, each time resulting in the same problems. With just the 1GB, my MiniDV clips (XL2, 24p, 16x9) play perfectly fine. I actaully have nested sequences within nested sequences that play perfectly fine. With the additional 2GB, clips in the source window have problems playing. The RAM is not shared with the Video Card. Thanks for the reply.

June 8th, 2006, 12:59 PM	#4
Christopher Lefchik Trustee Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: US Posts: 1,152	There's a chance the new memory might be defective, although it seems somewhat unlikely since the rest of your programs (and Windows) seem to be running fine. But you could try running the free DocMemory Diagnostic program just to be sure.

June 8th, 2006, 01:12 PM	#5
Glenn Chan Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Toronto, Canada Posts: 4,750	Mixing different kinds of memory can cause memory performance to drop dramtically... although that usually would only make a few % different in overall performance. With RAM, you get the best performance from pairs of identical memory (same capacity and same model). 2- In windows, you could check how much RAM is actually detected by windows. Hit crtl alt del, and go to the second tab. It should say available RAM somewhere.

June 8th, 2006, 03:22 PM	#6
Kevin Janisch Major Player Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Monterey, CA Posts: 406	Thanks guys. I'm getting the same behavior from 3 different sets of RAM modules. Each set is an identicle pair of 1GB memory, so don't think it's a bad chip. Windows sees all 3GB under System in Control Panel. The pairs are identicle to each other but all 4 chips are not identicle as far as size and brand. I'll know for certain in a few days when I get the Dell RAM. Kevin

June 9th, 2006, 11:12 AM	#7
Kevin Janisch Major Player Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Monterey, CA Posts: 406	Well, I may never know what the problem is as we opted to return the machine to Costco in favor of getting an HP. I've had nothing but good experiences with HP in the past, and don't have time to deal with Dell, we're up against a deadline. Chances are, the memory I already ordered will work in the HP. Costco's 6-month return policy on computer equipment is fantastic. Thanks again for all of the help. Kevin

June 12th, 2006, 10:46 AM	#9
Kevin Janisch Major Player Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Monterey, CA Posts: 406	Thanks Enrique, I've actually been monitoring my virtual memory as well with a memory manager. I've tried a manual config at the max ~4GB and also letting windows managing the paging file. I've also shut down the memory manager tool as well so it's not the culprit. To playback native unedited, unmodified, source DV footage doesn't take much power at all and for a beefy machine with 3GB of RAM to stutter on playback, there is something wrong, especially if it performs fine with only 1GB. Kevin

June 13th, 2006, 08:11 AM	#12
Enrique Galvis Regular Crew Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Vernon, NJ Posts: 44	Chris and Doug already mentioned the XP issue with memory which should be easy to find at htt[://www.microsoft.com and search the knowledge base for "poor video". I saw there quite a few issues with media center and a few video cards. One thing that has turned me off by ATI is the fact that they are constantly modifying and updating their drivers. After looking at the specs of the Dell Dimension E510 you are right. Is plenty beefy, unfortunately you are going to have to make sure that the system is fully compatible and configured as per your NLE's specs. Go by the model not the brand for compatibility. The best is not necessarily the best for your needs. I learned that lesson a long time ago with Matrox products. Although many will argue this point it is best to keep your NLE computer isolated. No games, no cute utilities, totally separate video HDD (OS and sftwr on C: video on D:), network should be ok just avoid continued access to it while working with the NLE.