Re: My lens has a spot on it, is there anything I can do?
 

Yep I want to buy a new lens to use on drama films as well, not just this one. I might have to use the current lens on the wildlife one, since I am not sure which one to buy.

That's true, about wanting to set focus marks, I would want a telephoto lens that can do that.

I suppose I could get the Tamron 100-400, and forget about the fixed aperture. I understand it's not fly-by-wire and has a mechanical focus, but is that lens sharp enough to look professional, when zoomed all the way?

Re: My lens has a spot on it, is there anything I can do?
 

Quickly looking at a review the Tamron seems OK, the aperture ramping shouldn't be an issue once you've closed down a stop or so. You may find the focus ring moves continuously, although there's a scale inside the window, there's no infinity stop, so how well it repeats its position on the scale would need to be tested. https://www.kenrockwell.com/tamron/100-400mm.htm

Re: My lens has a spot on it, is there anything I can do?
 

Oh okay, are you saying that it has no 'hard stop' or no infinity marking? Cause I looked at some lenses at the store, and the person at the store said it had a hard stop, unless I'm remembering wrong.

As for ramping, yeah the current lens I have now, the aperture ramps at any aperture setting. Here's a test I did at f8:


But will the Tamron not have aperture ramping at more closed apertures like that, you mean?

Re: My lens has a spot on it, is there anything I can do?
 

A hard stop usually means that focus ring stops at or commonly just after the infinity marking on the scale.

Usually aperture ramping is caused by the outside of the lens being a small a diameter for the longer focal lengths, so it's acting like a stop aperture until it matches the stop being used on the lens' own internal iris, It's like that to keep the lens sizes down, constant aperture lens are larger in order to avoid this happening,

I suspect you wont be able to avoid it with many stills lenses.

Re: My lens has a spot on it, is there anything I can do?
 

Oh ok. Well it was suggested to me before to get a lens like rokinon since they are made for video but does anyone make lenses like that that are telephoto zoom lenses though?

Re: My lens has a spot on it, is there anything I can do?
 

Rokinon only have a mirror lens, which has a fixed aperture, so limited for video. https://www.rokinon.com/lenses/digit...300mm-f63-dslr

Test the Tamron out at your local shop to see if it works as required for the focus. It may overshoot the infinity mark, which.isn't a problem. It looks OK in this video, but you should test yourself to ensure that the focus ring doesn't go round endlessly.


Your options are limited by your budget, but it looks a possibly, Don't expect this to act as a parfocal zoom, but you're less likely to zoom in shot with these longer focal length.

Re: My lens has a spot on it, is there anything I can do?
 

Okay thanks. I was going to do that as well. However, the store said that my current lens was still under warranty, so they may be able to do something about that black spot on it after all.

I'd still want a lens without a fly-by-wire focus system though, if that is what is needed for competent focus pulling though.

Re: My lens has a spot on it, is there anything I can do?
 

What you need for competent focus pulling is an experienced 1st AC.

Re: My lens has a spot on it, is there anything I can do?
 

Yep for sure I want that, and plan to get it. But even an AC will want a mechanical focus though too right?

Re: My lens has a spot on it, is there anything I can do?
 

If they're worth their salt, an AC will be expecting to work with a proper *cinema* lens, such as the Canon Cinema EOS CN-E30-300mm T2.95-3.7 L SP -- which costs $45,000, so you rent it, you don't buy it. But now we're talking in circles again.

Here's the B&H link for the Roki 300mm Reflex (in Canon EF) that was mentioned earlier. $270. You get what you pay for.

Re: My lens has a spot on it, is there anything I can do?
 

Okay thanks. It's just with the rental stores, you have to book in advance weeks or longer and a lot of times shoot dates change, so in the past, I found rental stores to not be the most reliable therefore.

Re: My lens has a spot on it, is there anything I can do?
 

The major rental companies are extremely reliable and are used to production companies wanting kit at extremely short notice. This occurs with commercials and TV productions, when they may only get a couple of days notice in some cases. I've hired kit on the day before a shoot.

If they don't have the kit in their store, they'll often bring it in from either their other branches or contacts in the industry.

They are also used to shoot dates changing.

What you don't want is a focus ring that turns continuously, if the focus ring has a set range with focus markings you can work with it, The Tamron appears to have one that can be engaged with the auto focus, but it doesn't seem to turn continuously. Nearly all new stills lenses will have an auto focus system, but you need to select one that doesn't have a continuously turning focus ring.

A cinema lens would be ideal, but they're not in your budget range if you want to purchase one.

This seems to be going over old ground.

I would get your current lens repaired/replaced under the warranty, then decide on a new lens.

Re: My lens has a spot on it, is there anything I can do?
 

All the lenses that have distance markings on the focus ring tend to be the repeatable ones. Lenses that have a ring and either a display or other means are servo operated, and the ring is just optical coupled to the servo drive, and they can be non-linear and unreliable. If I don't see a mechanical scale that can be read, I'm suspicious.

Re: My lens has a spot on it, is there anything I can do?
 

We can only hope and pray one day Ryan will get his cinema crash zoom lens.

Re: My lens has a spot on it, is there anything I can do?
 

I was speaking to a long standing well respected UK cinematographer, with countless credits about this topic. He no longer owns a camera, or lenses - and has some grip kit he hangs onto. Everything else is hired depending on the project. His attitude is that ever project now needs different things so owning a camera doesn't mean you use it!

You phone up your normal supplier. If they can't help, you phone a fairly small list, and there will always be somebody with what you need on the shelf. He tells me the biggest issue is people, NOT equipment. Finding the people you want when you need them is the biggest problem. Getting a camera of almost any kind delivered next day is easy - and in the US, being larger, surely easier still? Few professionals are now content with just one product for everything.

Ryans movie stuff and deer in the woods scream for totally different equipment. If budget really isn't an issue, I'd be sourcing the ideal kit for the shoot and not trying to find solutions to problems that really should not even exist.

Re: My lens has a spot on it, is there anything I can do?
 

Oh okay, I thought I could use the same camera and lenses for every project, as long as I had versatile equipment. I can try the rental stores, again.

So far I've been making the markings myself with a grease pencil or a DP will do it on his camera, but is that a bad way of doing things? Like how do you know what your markings are going to be, on the lens when you buy it, since the focus marks for the actors, are different for different shoots, unless I'm not understanding?

Re: My lens has a spot on it, is there anything I can do?
 

Paul, I tend to agree unless you do a very specific job all the time you’ll constantly need to buy different equipment to do different jobs properly. Although I’m guilty of violating that rule. I just dropped $1k on led panel lights so I could film a proper interview but a month later I need to buy an led fresnel for a wedding because the panel lights aren’t the right tool for that job. I could have rented the lights but I needed time to learn how to use them and interview date couldn’t be confirmed until a couple of days prior. It be a problem if they weren’t available or if I rented them and the interview got pushed back.

Like you said the ability to know what equipment is needed for a specific situation, how to use it is more important than the actual piece of equipment. In addition too much equipment can complicate, hinder or distract you from a more important aspect of the job.

In this instance Paul is saying a cinema lens is only good as your focus puller. Try to use that lens inappropriately live event with the subjects moving around you’ll end up with useless out focus footage.

Re: My lens has a spot on it, is there anything I can do?
 

The 1st AC will usually check the focus markings with a tape measure, if they're not accurate they usually wrap tape around the lens barrel and put on their own markings using a sharpie onto the tape.

High end cine lenses are hand calibrated with focus markings at the factory, still lens markings are more a rough position and the scale is small compared to modern cine lenses.

Re: My lens has a spot on it, is there anything I can do?
 

Yeah things like that, is what we've been doing so far, but is that not good enough, and I could really use one with previous markings?

Re: My lens has a spot on it, is there anything I can do?
 

A 1st AC will usually make their own markings in order to ensure they're correct, they may also check them so on a regular basis.

Re: My lens has a spot on it, is there anything I can do?
 

On documentaries long focal length lens will be eye focused and this can also be the case on dramas, depending on the subject matter. The 1st AC may also get their focus marks by doing this, because it's not practical to use other methods.

Re: My lens has a spot on it, is there anything I can do?
 

There’s a considerable difference between videography and cinematography when it comes to gear and staffing.

The biggest difference in workflow is that in cinematography you (or someone) is in control of the set. Blow a shot? Do it again. Relight. Discuss blocking and characterization. Emotional context and subtext. Whatever.

In videography you are not in control of the set. There will be no retakes. There will be no AC. You just have to nail every shot, usually working alone.

The OP’s wildlife shoot is different than the indie-style features and shorts projects described in previous posts. The latest greatest AF is really going to help for wildlife - that’s going to be on a fly-by-wire focus controlled lens. Use of super-telephoto lenses is a common need for wildlife - it’s a basic tool for such work.

So, no, although one may find oneself using a common set of tools for a particular kind of work, no one set does equally well at all of it. And, the gap between videography and cinematography is particularly wide, even wider for wildlife work.

Rentals! In the professional world you make your gear purchase decisions primarily on the basis of whether you will make money or lose money on it. And, sound, grip and lighting tends to age better than cameras, where technology is changing so quickly.

Re: My lens has a spot on it, is there anything I can do?
 

Yeah I would rather just do directing since it's what I am use to, with a collaboration of others, rather than nail everything myself.

As for lenses though, I was told by a cinematographer recently that the reason you hardly see any microbudget indie features use telephoto lenses, compared to Hollywood, is that lower priced DSLR telephoto lenses, are just not sharp enough to be acceptable.

Do you think that's true though, and there is no way to get a softer look in telephoto to be acceptable?

Re: My lens has a spot on it, is there anything I can do?
 

Compared to Hollywood? Can you get Hollywood sharpness from budget kit? Of course not, but you can get big improvements with sensible increases in bottom end budget. Good glass, for professionals or amateurs has never been cheap. Look at a sports event. The canon grey sports lenses. Why are they using them? The answer is pretty obvious.

Sharpness isn't just about using a test chart. It changes. Sharpness at the centre, sharpness at the edges, or somewhere in between, and then sharpness at certain focal lengths and then sharpness at different apertures. Cheap lenses might if you are lucky, do a few well.

Years ago, we had people experimenting with x2 adaptors for stills, and some being happy, while others found the sharpness drop off unacceptable. Another choice for you personally, Ryan. Does it pass your test? I suspect most people have a quality standard that is based on a mix of gut reaction alongside what their eyes tell them.

I wonder when you ask opinion from knowledgeable folk, you forget to ask the important supplementary question. WHY? Their answers will be very useful when it starts with 'because'.

Re: My lens has a spot on it, is there anything I can do?
 

If you've got a limited lens budget, you are better spending the money on a used higher quality lens, rather than buying a low priced new lens.

A few years ago I saw my old Zeiss Contax f 4 300mm (fitted with an Aaton film camera mount) being sold online for a lot less than I paid for it new. It was still more than you paid for your current lens, but I gather they go for $300 (Contax mount). Downside it's a big heavy lens, with a 300 degree focus (as loved by 1st ACs, but not photographers) . However, you may need to factor in lens adapters when using lenses with older mounts.


Good glass isn't going to be cheap and unless there's either an obsessive cinematographer with deep pockets or a revenue stream for the gear on paying projects, it's unlikely to be around on freebie projects.

Re: My lens has a spot on it, is there anything I can do?
 

Oh okay. He also said that Nikkor lenses were better and I should check out those, but he has doubts they would be sharp enough at 300.

What about this one:

https://en.nikon.ca/nikon-products/p....3g-ed-vr.html

Or I could invest in an even older, more high quality lens perhaps, just worried they may be damaged since they are used, and there is no warranty on them or anything.

Re: My lens has a spot on it, is there anything I can do?
 

I think the real reason telephoto lenses aren't used much in micro-budget indie features is that most scripts simply don't call for them.

In feature filmmaking, no matter what the budget is, the shots that require a telephoto lens are nowhere near as common as the shots that require a wide or medium focal length. Think about it.

If the shooting script calls for a long focal length, you rent that lens for a day or two. Done.

Re: My lens has a spot on it, is there anything I can do?
 

This is yet another reason why rental is always the best way to go.

Most pro cinema houses require insurance, and therefore they build that cost into the quote so that you have nothing to worry about from the moment you pick it up until you return it.

Some photo houses offer insurance as an add-on, not already built into the cost. You always take it though, especially since it's only a few extra dollars. Well worth it to be completely covered.

You can always get your own gear insured, but it's expensive. Your homeowner's policy most likely will not cover you in the event that you were "out shooting a movie with some folks."

Re: My lens has a spot on it, is there anything I can do?
 

The film and TV industry standards are the Canon telephoto lenses. Telephoto lenses tend towards contrast for best results, and the Canon L series primes are designed for full frame 35 mm film resolution, which is pretty similar to what you're using for video. These are the white coloured lenses that Paul mentioned earlier seen at every sporting event.

You buy Nikkor lenses if you want, however, you can't make a general statement about one make being better, because there will be variations across each lens in the range. Also, each brand will have a characteristic "look" that may be desired, so be wary of people saying one manufacturer is better than another without going into details. What matters is the lenses giving you the images you want..

The prime lenses will usually be better image quality than zooms.

The build quality on these lenses is a lot higher than the new low cost lenses you can afford. Test the lens before you buy them, or have a return arrangement if you buy of eBay etc if they goods aren't as described.

You need to test the lenses yourself, or at least look through the in depth reviews that give you a chance to sort things out initially. In the end testing, is the only way to make a final decision, if only by looking at film you know has been shot by a particular lens, Don't take anyone's word at face value.

The standard workhorse zoom lenses are in the 18 to 100mm range, the main prime lenses are also in the same range. You can shoot a feature film mostly using just one focal length, some directors are well known for it. One film I worked on was shot with a 16mm lens on Super 16.

Re: My lens has a spot on it, is there anything I can do?
 

Looks like this lens has very good reviews from still photographers.

Just be sure to do some deeper research regarding its use for video, though:

Source: Kens Rockwell (at https://www.kenrockwell.com/nikon/18-300mm-vr.htm)

The B&H link for this lens is https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1045736-REG/nikon_2216_af_s_dx_18_300mm_f_3_5_5_6g.html//BI/2855/KBID/3801

If you choose to go this route, you'll need to purchase either a Nikkor-to-EF mount adapter, or a Nikon DX series DSLR.

Re: My lens has a spot on it, is there anything I can do?
 

You'd need to check if the focus ring moves continuously, that the Nikkor doesn't seem to have a focus scale doesn't sound positive in this regard. It's probably a varifocal lens, so don't plan to use it for zoom shots.

Re: My lens has a spot on it, is there anything I can do?
 

Okay thanks. Perhaps I can do without the zoom as long as it is good in other quality.

The price it costs to rent a lens and have it shipped, I figure I could just by a lens that zooms up to 300mm and I can have it for any shoot date I want, rather than the rental store's availability schedule I figured.

The feature film I am budgeting is a horror thriller script, so I thought that a lens that zooms up to 300mm would be good for quite a few of the shots, because during the running chase scenes, I can pan with the actors for probably 3 seconds or more before they start to go further away, thereby making the chase more exciting. Kind of like the running scenes in a movie like The Good, The Bad, and The Ugly, or Seven Samurai, or something like that.

Or with a lens that long, I could have shots with lots of compression in such as a character pointing a gun towards the camera, but the pistol is small compared to the face, in a face close up. You don't get that with wider lenses.

Or I could do OTS shots which makes two actors look like they are sitting really close to each other when it calls for such a shot.

Shots like those are what I wanted a telephoto zoom lens for.

Re: My lens has a spot on it, is there anything I can do?
 

In my opinion 300mm is too short for a wildlife lens. Your mileage may vary.

An excellent stills lens for video that covers telephoto shots like you describe is the Canon EF 70-200mm f2.8 IS mk 2.

Please excuse my contrarian opinions. I don't care what people say. I say test-test-test and see what works for you. "A filmmaker I talked to said..." carries no weight with me. Did your 300mm with the spot on it actually get the shot you wanted?

Ryan, with all respect to the many pros on this forum who have contributed their decades of experience in this and other threads, you are now swimming in a sea of opinions and others' experiences. What I call "internet truths". They're not like the truths you can discover through shooting. They're not like the learning you get through experience.

Fly-by-wire lenses all bad? No, in my experience. Will ACs and DPs whine about your lenses? Yes, whether they're fly-by-wire or not.

If you have a prime the DP will want a zoom. If you have a zoom the DP will want a prime. That's part of working with people.

Would you do better with Nikon still lenses? Older nikons can be great, but so are a lot of the classic lenses. Contax. Pentax. Rokkor. Get some, polish them up, get them cleaned-lubricated-adjusted and declick the apertures while you're at it. Then the next DP you work with will say "Nikon, huh? Well, those aren't bad, but, I just worked on a project with these amazing vintage Contax lenses, you should get those! Want me to call and see if we can get them?"

You've dismissed rentals as difficult to schedule and expensive to ship. There are many working pros who differ, but if you want to own more lenses you should buy them!

What do you like? What shots speak to you? Ask that question of the contributors here and you'll get hundreds of answers, including: Vintage Nikon primes, primes not zooms, zooms not primes, must be PL mount, can't work without a mattebox, never use one, it goes on and on. And we haven't even gotten to cameras and lighting yet!

Re: My lens has a spot on it, is there anything I can do?
 

Yeah for wildlife it's too short, but this wildlife project is just a one time thing I think I still want a lens for future projects, and thought at least 300mm would be good.

I wanted one for a feature film project as well, and it's a horror thriller, where I wanted to do some chase scenes on foot, and use it for that. What focal length is this lens in this clip:


It looks to me to be at least a 300mm and I want shots like that for the chase scenes, if my current lens is not up to snuff for that.

Re: My lens has a spot on it, is there anything I can do?
 

Ryan, you are going over old ground again that shot was covered in another thread, this was probably shot at 250mm using a 25mm to 250mm zoom lens, a pretty standard piece of kit on a feature film of the period.

If you're concerned about warranty, specialist dealers often sell older lenses with a short warranty e,g. 3 months. I checked such one site and there are quite a few very good and excellent 300mm lenses in your price range. There are also 400mm, plus 600mm but these are more expensive. With some dealers you can go and test the lens before purchasing it.

Buying a cheap lens instead of renting a high quality. professional grade lens is a false economy, which can effect the quality of your film.

With these long focal length lenses you also need a good head and tripod. However, that's something worth having regardless of this.

Re: My lens has a spot on it, is there anything I can do?
 

Sorry, yes you're right, we did.

As for the possibility of zooming during the shot, I was advised before that if the lens is varifocal, to pull focus during the zoom. What if I got a lens that also has an aperture ring. Then I could have someone pull focus, but also have another person turn the aperture ring while zooming, so the aperture remains constant. Would that work?

Re: My lens has a spot on it, is there anything I can do?
 

No, the lens will probably go out of focus because it's a varifocal lens.

Stopping the lens down will avoid avoid aperture ramping, it usually occurs when the lens is wide open and usually disappears when stopped down one or two stops.

If you're tallying about the 18 to 300 mm Nikkor, it's a still lens, personally I wouldn't even consider it as a video lens unless I was really stuck for a lens and there wasn't any other options availble on the day. I wouldn't zoom with it, but regard it as a variable prime lens, so no zooms in shot.

Re: My lens has a spot on it, is there anything I can do?
 

Good heavens. No. That would *not* work. Think about it for a minute. Can you see how that isn't possible?

Instead, as Brian mentions above, the way you handle a variable aperture lens is to simply adjust it for constant aperture.

Do this by setting the camera's aperture to match the maximum aperture value at the telephoto end. As a result, your variable aperture zoom is now constant aperture.

For example, let's say your zoom lens is f/3.5-5.6 -- set your camera aperture to f/5.6 and now the lens will not ramp aperture during the zoom.

Re: My lens has a spot on it, is there anything I can do?
 

Okay thanks, but I already tried that, where the aperture is on the same setting from the beginning of the zoom till the end of the zoom, but you can still see it changing. Here is a test I did at f8, and it was on f8 the entire time:


As you can see the aperture changes during the zoom, even if it's on the same setting. Something about the zooming is still changing the exposure, isn't?

Re: My lens has a spot on it, is there anything I can do?
 

Sure it's the lens and not your camera in some auto exposure mode that is messing it up? If it is the lens, then you're stuck. The test on this would be a simple one. set the focal length and move in closer, not zooming and see if the highlights changing in the background trigger the same response.