Question about shooting news documentary style in this case.

Ryan Elder · June 19th, 2020, 09:28 AM

Oh okay thanks. What about skipping ahead in someone's speech? I've noticed they used flashes of white to do that. I can just cut ahead, but then that's jump cutting, but maybe jump cutting on the news is okay, even though you never see it?

Paul R Johnson · June 19th, 2020, 10:54 AM

News edits frequently just stuff together clips edited for the audio, and sometimes they'll slap all kinds of transitions on them, often with a whoosh or other SFX. If you watch just one or two hours of a con sinuous news channel, you'll see edits done for speed, and if the cut jolts too much, they simply soften it with something suitable.

Ryan Elder · June 19th, 2020, 11:16 AM

Oh okay thanks.

I also noticed this type of transition at 0:49 into the clip:

The do a fade to white and back to avoid jump cutting. I could do that or just have jump cuts intentionally for style.

Brian Drysdale · June 19th, 2020, 11:48 AM

There are no rules, it really depends on what you're doing and on each news station's requirements. Some insist that you show that speeches have been edited,, others allow cutaways in order to avoid jump cuts.

I'm not sure why you're asking these things. Your editor will be the person creating these news bulletins (even though it's you) and the style may have changed in the meantime. They' used to cut to black, so these the things go in and out of fashion. This one simulates a flash frame, which what happens on film cameras when they're stopped filming and a couple of frames get over exposed before the reflex mirror on the shutter is lined up.

Use the transition effect that best suits your story and the action, you don't need to set it in stone for the moment. .

Ryan Elder · June 19th, 2020, 02:03 PM

Oh okay thanks. It's just that I was planning the shoot with the edit in mind, because I thought that would be better, rather than not shooting for the edit.

Brian Drysdale · June 19th, 2020, 03:57 PM

It doesn't make any difference during the shoot if you plan to use a jump cut, a flash frame, a cut to black or everything spins like one of those old newspaper effects.

Pete Cofrancesco · June 19th, 2020, 05:49 PM

The only thing you need to make sure when you film is that you leave few extra seconds at the start and end for the transitions. The Weinstein clip has bunch of common transitions mainly fade to color either white or black. This is really basic stuff.

Brian Drysdale · June 20th, 2020, 12:02 AM

Yes, remember your overlaps.

Paul R Johnson · June 27th, 2020, 12:45 PM

Ryan has been missing for a while and this news jump cut topic has appeared on the DVX forum, posted by JimS2 - who oddly, starts every post with "Oh, OK, Thanks......" I'd bet Ryans' started anew over there.

Zooming vs. speedramping, which looks better? - Page 3

is a typical Ryan topic. Things might be quieter here if he's jumped ship.

Pete Cofrancesco · June 27th, 2020, 04:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul R Johnson

Ryan has been missing for a while and this news jump cut topic has appeared on the DVX forum, posted by JimS2 - who oddly, starts every post with "Oh, OK, Thanks......" I'd bet Ryans' started anew over there.

Zooming vs. speedramping, which looks better? - Page 3

is a typical Ryan topic. Things might be quieter here if he's jumped ship.

I kinda miss him but maybe if JimS2 spends most of his time on dvx forum might not be such a bad thing. Ryan errr I mean Jim could use a fresh start

Brian Drysdale · June 28th, 2020, 12:55 AM

It would seem that he's getting the same range of answers to the same range of questions.

Paul R Johnson · June 28th, 2020, 08:50 AM

Trouble is, he's not moved forward - he's doing the cheap lens crash zoom thing again, the topic about his script and the policeman and the current news cuts.

I did kind of think we'd been helping and guiding him OK, clearly he still hasn't got the answers he wants.

Brian Drysdale · June 28th, 2020, 09:16 AM

What you want and what you can get can be entirely different things, especially if you don't have or are unwilling to spend the money required. Paraphrasing John Boorman's book title, it's about turning money into light.

Unfortunately, he keeps on painting himself into a corner without noticing the ground floor window beside him.

Paul R Johnson · June 28th, 2020, 03:47 PM

DVXuser.com -- The online community for filmmaking

They spotted that Ryan was previously Ironpony, and they mentioned he'd posted the same things before.

Brian Drysdale · June 28th, 2020, 04:51 PM

I had a quick search and Ironpony seems to have the same issues that Ryan has in hearing things and (apparently) not really understanding. Plus the suggestion (in 2013) that he has done this on a number of other forum boards.

There's a definite pattern that been going on for years and this film (seemingly) hasn't yet gotten to a festival.

June 19th, 2020, 09:28 AM	#16
Ryan Elder also known as Ryan Wray Join Date: Nov 2017 Location: Saskatoon, Canada Posts: 2,880	Re: Question about shooting news documentary style in this case. Oh okay thanks. What about skipping ahead in someone's speech? I've noticed they used flashes of white to do that. I can just cut ahead, but then that's jump cutting, but maybe jump cutting on the news is okay, even though you never see it?

June 19th, 2020, 10:54 AM	#17
Paul R Johnson Inner Circle Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Lowestoft - UK Posts: 4,016	Re: Question about shooting news documentary style in this case. News edits frequently just stuff together clips edited for the audio, and sometimes they'll slap all kinds of transitions on them, often with a whoosh or other SFX. If you watch just one or two hours of a con sinuous news channel, you'll see edits done for speed, and if the cut jolts too much, they simply soften it with something suitable.

June 19th, 2020, 11:16 AM	#18
Ryan Elder also known as Ryan Wray Join Date: Nov 2017 Location: Saskatoon, Canada Posts: 2,880	Re: Question about shooting news documentary style in this case. Oh okay thanks. I also noticed this type of transition at 0:49 into the clip: Stunned Harvey Weinstein jailed after guilty verdict \| WNT - YouTube The do a fade to white and back to avoid jump cutting. I could do that or just have jump cuts intentionally for style.

June 19th, 2020, 11:48 AM	#19
Brian Drysdale Inner Circle Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Belfast, UK Posts: 6,143	Re: Question about shooting news documentary style in this case. There are no rules, it really depends on what you're doing and on each news station's requirements. Some insist that you show that speeches have been edited,, others allow cutaways in order to avoid jump cuts. I'm not sure why you're asking these things. Your editor will be the person creating these news bulletins (even though it's you) and the style may have changed in the meantime. They' used to cut to black, so these the things go in and out of fashion. This one simulates a flash frame, which what happens on film cameras when they're stopped filming and a couple of frames get over exposed before the reflex mirror on the shutter is lined up. Use the transition effect that best suits your story and the action, you don't need to set it in stone for the moment. . Last edited by Brian Drysdale; June 19th, 2020 at 01:20 PM.

June 19th, 2020, 02:03 PM	#20
Ryan Elder also known as Ryan Wray Join Date: Nov 2017 Location: Saskatoon, Canada Posts: 2,880	Re: Question about shooting news documentary style in this case. Oh okay thanks. It's just that I was planning the shoot with the edit in mind, because I thought that would be better, rather than not shooting for the edit.

June 19th, 2020, 03:57 PM	#21
Brian Drysdale Inner Circle Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Belfast, UK Posts: 6,143	Re: Question about shooting news documentary style in this case. It doesn't make any difference during the shoot if you plan to use a jump cut, a flash frame, a cut to black or everything spins like one of those old newspaper effects.

June 19th, 2020, 05:49 PM	#22
Pete Cofrancesco Inner Circle Join Date: May 2004 Location: USA Posts: 2,997	Re: Question about shooting news documentary style in this case. The only thing you need to make sure when you film is that you leave few extra seconds at the start and end for the transitions. The Weinstein clip has bunch of common transitions mainly fade to color either white or black. This is really basic stuff.

June 20th, 2020, 12:02 AM	#23
Brian Drysdale Inner Circle Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Belfast, UK Posts: 6,143	Re: Question about shooting news documentary style in this case. Yes, remember your overlaps.

June 27th, 2020, 12:45 PM	#24
Paul R Johnson Inner Circle Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Lowestoft - UK Posts: 4,016	Re: Question about shooting news documentary style in this case. Ryan has been missing for a while and this news jump cut topic has appeared on the DVX forum, posted by JimS2 - who oddly, starts every post with "Oh, OK, Thanks......" I'd bet Ryans' started anew over there. Zooming vs. speedramping, which looks better? - Page 3 is a typical Ryan topic. Things might be quieter here if he's jumped ship.

June 28th, 2020, 12:55 AM	#26
Brian Drysdale Inner Circle Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Belfast, UK Posts: 6,143	Re: Question about shooting news documentary style in this case. It would seem that he's getting the same range of answers to the same range of questions.

June 28th, 2020, 08:50 AM	#27
Paul R Johnson Inner Circle Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Lowestoft - UK Posts: 4,016	Re: Question about shooting news documentary style in this case. Trouble is, he's not moved forward - he's doing the cheap lens crash zoom thing again, the topic about his script and the policeman and the current news cuts. I did kind of think we'd been helping and guiding him OK, clearly he still hasn't got the answers he wants.

June 28th, 2020, 09:16 AM	#28
Brian Drysdale Inner Circle Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Belfast, UK Posts: 6,143	Re: Question about shooting news documentary style in this case. What you want and what you can get can be entirely different things, especially if you don't have or are unwilling to spend the money required. Paraphrasing John Boorman's book title, it's about turning money into light. Unfortunately, he keeps on painting himself into a corner without noticing the ground floor window beside him.

June 28th, 2020, 03:47 PM	#29
Paul R Johnson Inner Circle Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Lowestoft - UK Posts: 4,016	Re: Question about shooting news documentary style in this case. DVXuser.com -- The online community for filmmaking They spotted that Ryan was previously Ironpony, and they mentioned he'd posted the same things before.

June 28th, 2020, 04:51 PM	#30
Brian Drysdale Inner Circle Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Belfast, UK Posts: 6,143	Re: Question about shooting news documentary style in this case. I had a quick search and Ironpony seems to have the same issues that Ryan has in hearing things and (apparently) not really understanding. Plus the suggestion (in 2013) that he has done this on a number of other forum boards. There's a definite pattern that been going on for years and this film (seemingly) hasn't yet gotten to a festival.