Comparisons of GS100K/Optura Xi/TRV950

Bogdan Vaglarov · September 16th, 2003, 08:23 PM

Capturing video recorded in LP on Sony TRV10 wasn't a problem for me even on a low spec notebook.

I was also worried some time ago after I read about compatibility issues on different cams if you shoot in LP. I tried for short such LP tape recorded on Sony and it played back just fine on GS100.

What you lose with LP is you can't record 4 audio channels (or do audio dubbing later), the quality is OK but you might get some pixalization in certain moments.

Cooleye Hu, I know it's difficult for Chinies to learn reading Katakana, you shouldn't have any problems with Kanji though.

You save on MS and battery? FM50 wouldn’t give you much (30 min at most). I think, buying extra Pana battery and SD will still leave you extra 200$ benefit over the TRV950. For your needs GS100 is better buy.

Also what do you mean talking about smear shooting indoors? Are you going to point to the action or up to the lights? The smear is most visible when the contrast between dark and light is high. For example outdoors at night when there is street light - smear is on this bright light.

Cooleye Hu · September 16th, 2003, 09:27 PM

what i mean for smear is that indoor's situation with lights on, if the light is in the screen it is very likely to have smear , right? also I am worrying about the mic of gs100k and trv950 since I will record some local opera which requires good sound inputs...that is why I consider the pdx10 at first...

ok for gs100k, it seems everyone is satisfied with their purchase, and no one is complaining about anything like bad pixels or what ever , however I do worry about what if I have the bad luck? ... it is hard for me to decide, since when I bought the F717 I had returned the camera twice , once a dead pixels in lcd, and once a bright dead pixel in evf...

Cooleye Hu · September 16th, 2003, 09:32 PM

Bogdan Vaglarov,

I looked the japanese-english translation pdf for the lcd menu of gs100k and several pages of the user menu, they are basically Katakana, not so many kanji...very hard for me to read

Allan Rejoso · September 16th, 2003, 10:42 PM

There is a simple solution to your concern on dead pixels or even the possibility of the cam arriving DOA. Ask your seller to perform functional test on the cam prior to shipment!

Alex you're right, that was my impression of the OpturaXi's video quality compared to that of GS100K. Twas very difficult to decide between the 2 in good light 4:3 mode. Both have excellent color saturation. Although that of the GS100K appeared brighter, that of OpturaXi looked cleaner (less jaggedy edges - oversharpening). But in 16:9, the Optura Xi rocks! More to follow once I find the time to write down my findings.

Yik Kuen · September 16th, 2003, 10:45 PM

Cooleye Hu,

The smear problem on 950/PDX-10 is not as bad as you think - normal indoor lighting is ok and won't cause too much smear. I did not encounter smear problem for all my indoor shots. The problem is only noticeable during night outdoor shooting, bright street lamps, car headlights etc, but if the environment is pretty bright e.g. a busy city, then it should be OK.

Bear in mind that, according to the specs, both 950/PDX-10 require more power to operate as compared to PD-150/VX2000 due to their larger LCDs, denser CCDs and more advanced DSP.

The FM50 battery will only last about 30mins or so, totally unusable. I would suggest at least the QM71/90.

GS100K images might be slightly darker than 950/PDX-10, but I guess it'll be as clean (minimum noise). Also, the skin tone, cine-gamma are invaluable features that you should seriously consider.

I still think that you should rather go for the GS100K.

Alex Zabrovsky · September 16th, 2003, 11:56 PM

Well, Allan, in wid screen teh Xi beats the GS100, right ? Frankly, I'm not very familiar with 16x9 mode, have never personally fiddled with one (it is not common in Israel, thuogh many of DVDs we watch here are in wide format, so getting letterbox instead).

I'll have to figure what it is exactly hooking up to a friend's TV that has natural 16x9 mode.

BTW, my cam is already on its way to Israel from CA. The guys in our CA branch has shipped it over by UPS on 15/Sept, expected arrival to the country is tomorrow (and then may or may not take a while for Customs release).

Alex

Nick Huang · September 17th, 2003, 12:08 AM

<<<-- Originally posted by Bogdan Vaglarov : Capturing video recorded in LP on Sony TRV10 wasn't a problem for me even on a low spec notebook.

I was also worried some time ago after I read about compatibility issues on different cams if you shoot in LP. I tried for short such LP tape recorded on Sony and it played back just fine on GS100.

What you lose with LP is you can't record 4 audio channels (or do audio dubbing later), the quality is OK but you might get some pixalization in certain moments.

...
-->>>

I had no problem playing LP on different camcorders. The problem had to do with dropping frames when I tried to capture the content to my PC thru FireWire.

The fact that Canon recommends NOT using LP mode for "important" recordings in their Xi user's manual says a lot about what Canon thinks about recording in this mode. I was wondering if this is a Canon-only problem or not, as the one that gave me this problem was a Canon (Vistura).

Bogdan Vaglarov · September 17th, 2003, 12:39 AM

Yeah, I guess if you have important shot you should go with SP mode on any DV cam!

Frank Granovski · September 17th, 2003, 01:05 AM

I never even think about using LP on a cam. TV, yes, camcorder, no.

Yik Kuen · September 17th, 2003, 01:52 AM

Most people don't use LP for important recordings but I've got a friend who's always recording in LP mode, even on used tapes!

I do not know about the rests, but newer Sony cams have quite reliable tape transport mechanisms that allow reliable LP mode recording, but not on my JVC.

Frank Granovski · September 17th, 2003, 03:20 AM

If I were to window shop for a Sony cam, I'd have a tough time deciding on a model. At least with Pana and Canon, I already know which ones would be nice: the Pana black mamba and the Canon Optura Xi..., though a GL2 would be just as nice, and maybe then some, in way of lower lux requirements. (But I could be mistaken.)

I've always thought about getting a VX2000. I'm sure it's a great cam. But if someone catches you using one, or, Heaven forbid, owning one, they'll think that you are a pro. Can't have that now, can we?

Alex Zabrovsky · September 17th, 2003, 04:29 AM

I wouldn't mind people considering you're as a pro is that doesn't distarb me shooting (though I can think of many situations when regular small cam wuold be fine whilst once you would be looking as a pro you would be banned from shooting).
I had tough time to decide between VX2000 and GS100 (once begining my GS100 purchase process frmo Alln I was offered VX2000 -used in Mint condiiton for about the same amount as ne GS100 !)
But since my home usage and wife as operator would impact from a size factor (and weight) as well lack of usable stills ability, the GS100 won.

I'm actually in this situation shooting around with my Canon EOS-3 + 28-70/2.8L 70-200/2.8L and 550EX. Once doing a pro-kind work (events, weddings) this plays for you - people respect your work and do not rush between your cam and the subject, but once in non-demanding situation - people are staring at you, bothring with various non-relevant questions and besides I was banned from shooting several times on my traveling abroad, while just nearby tourists were clikcing freely on their P&S cams.

Alex

September 16th, 2003, 08:23 PM	#16
Bogdan Vaglarov Major Player Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Yokohama, Japan Posts: 366	Capturing video recorded in LP on Sony TRV10 wasn't a problem for me even on a low spec notebook. I was also worried some time ago after I read about compatibility issues on different cams if you shoot in LP. I tried for short such LP tape recorded on Sony and it played back just fine on GS100. What you lose with LP is you can't record 4 audio channels (or do audio dubbing later), the quality is OK but you might get some pixalization in certain moments. Cooleye Hu, I know it's difficult for Chinies to learn reading Katakana, you shouldn't have any problems with Kanji though. You save on MS and battery? FM50 wouldn’t give you much (30 min at most). I think, buying extra Pana battery and SD will still leave you extra 200$ benefit over the TRV950. For your needs GS100 is better buy. Also what do you mean talking about smear shooting indoors? Are you going to point to the action or up to the lights? The smear is most visible when the contrast between dark and light is high. For example outdoors at night when there is street light - smear is on this bright light.

September 16th, 2003, 09:27 PM	#17
Cooleye Hu Regular Crew Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: china Posts: 30	what i mean for smear is that indoor's situation with lights on, if the light is in the screen it is very likely to have smear , right? also I am worrying about the mic of gs100k and trv950 since I will record some local opera which requires good sound inputs...that is why I consider the pdx10 at first... ok for gs100k, it seems everyone is satisfied with their purchase, and no one is complaining about anything like bad pixels or what ever , however I do worry about what if I have the bad luck? ... it is hard for me to decide, since when I bought the F717 I had returned the camera twice , once a dead pixels in lcd, and once a bright dead pixel in evf...

September 16th, 2003, 09:32 PM	#18
Cooleye Hu Regular Crew Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: china Posts: 30	Bogdan Vaglarov, I looked the japanese-english translation pdf for the lcd menu of gs100k and several pages of the user menu, they are basically Katakana, not so many kanji...very hard for me to read

September 16th, 2003, 10:42 PM	#19
Allan Rejoso Major Player Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Tokyo, Japan Posts: 569	There is a simple solution to your concern on dead pixels or even the possibility of the cam arriving DOA. Ask your seller to perform functional test on the cam prior to shipment! Alex you're right, that was my impression of the OpturaXi's video quality compared to that of GS100K. Twas very difficult to decide between the 2 in good light 4:3 mode. Both have excellent color saturation. Although that of the GS100K appeared brighter, that of OpturaXi looked cleaner (less jaggedy edges - oversharpening). But in 16:9, the Optura Xi rocks! More to follow once I find the time to write down my findings.

September 16th, 2003, 10:45 PM	#20
Yik Kuen Regular Crew Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Johor Bahru, Malaysia Posts: 135	Cooleye Hu, The smear problem on 950/PDX-10 is not as bad as you think - normal indoor lighting is ok and won't cause too much smear. I did not encounter smear problem for all my indoor shots. The problem is only noticeable during night outdoor shooting, bright street lamps, car headlights etc, but if the environment is pretty bright e.g. a busy city, then it should be OK. Bear in mind that, according to the specs, both 950/PDX-10 require more power to operate as compared to PD-150/VX2000 due to their larger LCDs, denser CCDs and more advanced DSP. The FM50 battery will only last about 30mins or so, totally unusable. I would suggest at least the QM71/90. GS100K images might be slightly darker than 950/PDX-10, but I guess it'll be as clean (minimum noise). Also, the skin tone, cine-gamma are invaluable features that you should seriously consider. I still think that you should rather go for the GS100K.

September 16th, 2003, 11:56 PM	#21
Alex Zabrovsky Regular Crew Join Date: Aug 2003 Posts: 175	Well, Allan, in wid screen teh Xi beats the GS100, right ? Frankly, I'm not very familiar with 16x9 mode, have never personally fiddled with one (it is not common in Israel, thuogh many of DVDs we watch here are in wide format, so getting letterbox instead). I'll have to figure what it is exactly hooking up to a friend's TV that has natural 16x9 mode. BTW, my cam is already on its way to Israel from CA. The guys in our CA branch has shipped it over by UPS on 15/Sept, expected arrival to the country is tomorrow (and then may or may not take a while for Customs release). Alex

September 17th, 2003, 12:08 AM	#22
Nick Huang New Boot Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Los Altos, CA Posts: 8	<<<-- Originally posted by Bogdan Vaglarov : Capturing video recorded in LP on Sony TRV10 wasn't a problem for me even on a low spec notebook. I was also worried some time ago after I read about compatibility issues on different cams if you shoot in LP. I tried for short such LP tape recorded on Sony and it played back just fine on GS100. What you lose with LP is you can't record 4 audio channels (or do audio dubbing later), the quality is OK but you might get some pixalization in certain moments. ... -->>> I had no problem playing LP on different camcorders. The problem had to do with dropping frames when I tried to capture the content to my PC thru FireWire. The fact that Canon recommends NOT using LP mode for "important" recordings in their Xi user's manual says a lot about what Canon thinks about recording in this mode. I was wondering if this is a Canon-only problem or not, as the one that gave me this problem was a Canon (Vistura).

September 17th, 2003, 12:39 AM	#23
Bogdan Vaglarov Major Player Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Yokohama, Japan Posts: 366	Yeah, I guess if you have important shot you should go with SP mode on any DV cam!

September 17th, 2003, 01:05 AM	#24
Frank Granovski Outer Circle Join Date: May 2002 Location: Hope, BC Posts: 7,524	I never even think about using LP on a cam. TV, yes, camcorder, no.

September 17th, 2003, 01:52 AM	#25
Yik Kuen Regular Crew Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Johor Bahru, Malaysia Posts: 135	Most people don't use LP for important recordings but I've got a friend who's always recording in LP mode, even on used tapes! I do not know about the rests, but newer Sony cams have quite reliable tape transport mechanisms that allow reliable LP mode recording, but not on my JVC.

September 17th, 2003, 03:20 AM	#26
Frank Granovski Outer Circle Join Date: May 2002 Location: Hope, BC Posts: 7,524	If I were to window shop for a Sony cam, I'd have a tough time deciding on a model. At least with Pana and Canon, I already know which ones would be nice: the Pana black mamba and the Canon Optura Xi..., though a GL2 would be just as nice, and maybe then some, in way of lower lux requirements. (But I could be mistaken.) I've always thought about getting a VX2000. I'm sure it's a great cam. But if someone catches you using one, or, Heaven forbid, owning one, they'll think that you are a pro. Can't have that now, can we?

September 17th, 2003, 04:29 AM	#27
Alex Zabrovsky Regular Crew Join Date: Aug 2003 Posts: 175	I wouldn't mind people considering you're as a pro is that doesn't distarb me shooting (though I can think of many situations when regular small cam wuold be fine whilst once you would be looking as a pro you would be banned from shooting). I had tough time to decide between VX2000 and GS100 (once begining my GS100 purchase process frmo Alln I was offered VX2000 -used in Mint condiiton for about the same amount as ne GS100 !) But since my home usage and wife as operator would impact from a size factor (and weight) as well lack of usable stills ability, the GS100 won. I'm actually in this situation shooting around with my Canon EOS-3 + 28-70/2.8L 70-200/2.8L and 550EX. Once doing a pro-kind work (events, weddings) this plays for you - people respect your work and do not rush between your cam and the subject, but once in non-demanding situation - people are staring at you, bothring with various non-relevant questions and besides I was banned from shooting several times on my traveling abroad, while just nearby tourists were clikcing freely on their P&S cams. Alex