downloaded your video, and here is what I got using my method (I would use the Lagarith to render out of Vdub as well, no sense in losing any data until you have to)

then I dropped in into vegas and rendered out a Mpg2 like I was making a DVD

here is that file

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/8051517/Resized.mpg

I did de-interlace in Vdub, I think it does a good job, or at least better than vegas.

here are the settings I use in Vdub :)

David

Jim, Videoguys has HD Link for $399 right now, it looks tempting!

David, I see what you have done and am downloading your file now. As I wait, I want to tell you I rendered out of Vegas into uncompressed avi last night, was not too good, so I'm thinking my settings were wrong, I'm re-rendering now. I tried 1.333 PAR, but it left bars on the side, so I"m back to square pixels, and it's is processing now.

I'll let you know as soon as I see yours. This will be very interesting, to have side by side comparison of this method vs HD Link as Jim did it. Battle of the codecs!

Guy, I'm absolutely red-faced, I had not seen your post and had not know you had re-encoded my clip, thank you, I JUST saw it.

Thanks a ton, I have wanted to see what Vegas could do directly in the right hands. I'll download your version after David's. This is really shaping up into a codec fest.

Well gentlemen, I have seen all three versions: Guy's, Jim's and David's.

Well, they all looked comparable!

It would seem the artifacts from my original edited video two sources: From resizing AND from the interlacing.

Guy, you didn't resize to fill screen complete, correct? But the bars on the side are negligible. So if I had no need to resize and I needed to do a quick edit, your method would work very well: just render out without interlacing, correct?

I have wedding June 25th that is a same day edit, and that method would seem to work best as time will be at a super premium.

For customer DVDs, I would need to use HD Link or David's method for proper resizing, it would seem.

David, I will finish trying out your workflow with Virtual Dub later this morning and report back!

Actually, if you download the rendered MPEG-2 file you will see that I did resize your HD video down to SD wide-format which displays as 873x480 pixels but is stored in 720x480 format with a pixel aspect of 1.333. If you bring it in to an editor it looks virtually identical to David's and Jim's MPEG-2 file. Same format size, same aspect ratio, same display size.

I find that I can do just about anything with Sony Vegas Pro without having to resort to any intermediary files, you just have to know the editor really well.

You can do a great job in Virtual Dub if done correctly. I used to use it but I switched to HDLink because it is easier and faster. It comes with Cineform which I also use as a near lossless intermediate codec.

Vegas 10 has the cineform codec as well

Earlier versions of Vegas has a basic version of Cineform but Cineform in any 'variety' isn't included with Vegas 10.

Well maybe I’m wrong, wouldn’t be the first time haha

Here is what I was referencing as cineform in vegas 10

oh and I agree with you Jim on it being easier and faster, but I just can't justify the money... sure it takes time but its just render hours, I just leave it to render while I sleep :)

Guy, I only saw your online version, which had tiny bars on the side, and I didn't realize you had resized it....I didn't download it, didn't know I could, I'll go back and download it and check it out.

Thank you!

Jim's right David, I happened to read somewhere on the Cineform website that they stopped shipping Cineform codec with Vegas in 10.

Cineform is a great CODEC. I use it for archiving finished projects and when I need to collaborate with Final Cut Pro editors, as the Cineform CODEC is completely cross-platform between Windows and Mac platforms.

The cheapest way to buy the Cineform CODEC is from the Videoguys.com 800 323-2325 we are the video editing and production experts website which sells Cineform NEO SCENE for Windows or Mac for $100.

Cineform Neoscene only supports these camera formats - HDV, AVCHD, Canon 5DM2/7D/T2i

Cineform NeoHD supports these camera formats - HDV, AVCHD, DVCPRO HD (P2),
XDCam HD/EX, Canon 5D/7D/1DS V-DSLRs, Infinity J2K

You also need NeoHD if you want to be able to resize to SD video

The VideoGuys website sells NeoHD for $400, which is a $100 off the manufacturer's price.

Just to clarify, if you want to be able to resize during the importing process you need NeoHD, otherwise you are free to resize using your video editor and save as SD format using the Cineform CODEC that comes with NEO SCENE.

If I was processing a lot of HD ---> SD, the NeoHD upgrade would be well worth it, as you can batch-import and down-rez at the same time.

I have found that NeoHD does a much better job with HD to SD resizing than Vegas does. That is pretty much the case with any NLE. That has always been a mystery to me, that is why do pro level NLE's do a poor job compared to other methods of resizing. Deinterlacing is another problem with NLE's. Cineform does a vastly better job with deinterlacing.

Hmmm... I would agree with you when I first got Vegas and used the supplied presets, but once I got used to making my own custom Vegas presets, I found that Vegas can do a great job, but there is no room for error, you get one thing wrong and the result is quite bad.

Re: Moire with GH2 after converted
 

Yes, I suspect I'm going to end up with NeoHD. With a wedding a week, if not more during the busy season, time will be at a permium, and the $400 would well be worth it!

Re: Moire with GH2 after converted
 

And to learn Vegas would be better than to spend 400USD for NeoHD (and learn it as well).

Re: Moire with GH2 after converted
 

Anyone have a good alternative to $400 HD Link, clunky Virtual Dub and mediocre Vegas down sizing? Nero have a downscaling features?

I am using TMPGEnc express 4.0. I wonder has it stacks up against Cineform HD? Has anyone tried both?

TMPGEnc - Products: TMPGEnc Video Mastering Works 5

Re: Moire with GH2 after converted
 

Does it resize avchd video, or avi?

Re: Moire with GH2 after converted
 

Download the trial and take a look around in it, but yes it does

Re: Moire with GH2 after converted
 

Thanks Jim. If you happen to see any reviews, particlulary with comparisons to Cineform, please post.

I have been looking but see nothing yet. They are not in the same category of tools, but still.

This is a consumerish looking tool that I hesitate to download without knowing more about it. On the surface it looks very interesting. I appreciate the post!

Re: Moire with GH2 after converted
 

Hey Jeff, I have used TMPGEnc and it does a decent job of resizing. I just found Cineform / HDLink to be a better and MUCH faster way to do things. A lot depends on a person's needs. I do a lot of weddings as well as other types of shooting and I find Cineform / HDLink to be much better from my perspective. Other methods take more time and a TON of hard disc space. I do primarily multicam weddings that result in several hours of footage per wedding. I need the fastest and most efficient way to handle this footage. That's why I use Cineform / HDLink.

Jim have you ever used ProCoder 3? I see B&H is still selling it.

ProCoder 3 | Grass Valley

I am editing with Edius 6 which fortunately has many of ProCoder's conversion tools built in but its still not as powerful as ProCoder.

Re: Moire with GH2 after converted
 

Ouch! 400 bones.

Re: Moire with GH2 after converted
 

Looks interesting but do not see windows 7 support.

I am running ProCoder 3 with Windows 7 64bit and it seems to be happy.

Re: Moire with GH2 after converted
 

Jim S, like you I do a ton of weddings, so your perspective is especially valuable. HD Link is where my sights are set, unless something else is clearly superior or as good, and costs less.

I imagine ProCoder is quite good, as Canopus puts out high quality software, at least that's what I've read. But at over $400, it would have to be as good, etc as HD Link and as fast.

Jim F, have you used both?

Re: Moire with GH2 after converted
 

All else being equal, the Cineform solution seems like a lot more value since it can do a lot of other things.

But $400 could buy me a lot of Virtual Dub Love.

Re: Moire with GH2 after converted
 

No I have not. Seems to be Cineform HD link is the favorite and gets great reviews here. I only have ProCoder 3 because I had 2 and got an upgrade.

HDLink Settings
 

Jim S, would you kindly review my settings? I'm unsure here.

In addition, I'm unsure of the workflow. I've been on Cineform site, but it is crawlingly slow today, at least for me.

The attached image shows what my settings are as of now. My purpose is to convert 1080i footage for the end result of an SD 16:9 video. Thanks in advance for any assistance you can offer.

By the way, it is fast, and it looks like a no-brainer purchase for my wedding work!

Re: Moire with GH2 after converted
 

Hi Jeff,

Those setting will do the job. When you load the converted files into Vegas, you may need to set the file properties to the proper aspect ration of 1.2121. Also set your project properties to NTSC DV widescreen 720 x 480, Deinterlace method - None (since your footage was converted to progressive), best rendering quality and you're all set.

Re: Moire with GH2 after converted
 

Thanks Jim, I'm trying it out now. Is is best to deinterlace, or to leave it interlaced?

Re: Moire with GH2 after converted
 

Jim, the files are coming out squished, 4:3 size.

Re: Moire with GH2 after converted
 

As I indicated above, go to Project media and right click on the file(s) and select properties and set the aspect ratio to 1.2121 on each file and that will take care of it.

Re: Moire with GH2 after converted
 

I mean that the avi files produced by HDLink are squished, when played in Windows media player.

Re: Moire with GH2 after converted
 

Some players like VLC allow you to set the aspect ration for playing a file. I just look on these files as intermediate work files and don't bother with playing them.

Re: Moire with GH2 after converted
 

No settings I have changed will produced the correct dimensions for playback in windows media player, which is how I'm testing the files. Since Windows 7 will play most any avi files including AVCHD files correctly, I'm assuming my settings are wrong, or there's a bug. I've not had issues with avis before....hmmmm weird.

I render out to avi for transcoding to flv for my website, and preview with WMP to double check before putting in flash...so I need to fix this. In addition, the avi being produced are noisy as well...I'll play with it more later, I have lots of urgent projects that need my attention.

Thanks for your attention, Jim.

Re: Moire with GH2 after converted
 

There isn't a 'hook' to define the PAR (pixel aspect ration) with the intermediate files. As intermediate files, they really aren't intended as 'player' files. If you set the aspect ration to 1.2121 in the file properties in Vegas under Project Media, you won't have any problem.

Re: Moire with GH2 after converted
 

Jeff,

I would recommend using the free GSpot v2.70a utility to examine the format of your final rendered files, as GSpot provides a fair bit of information about the formatting of a video file.

As for the unsatisfactory results you are seeing, can you publish a step-by-step list of exactly what you are doing to convert your HD files down to SD format, this way we can spot where you might be messing up.