thoughts on g9's 8bit video-good enough?

[Rob Katz]

is the panasonic g9's 8bit video "good enough" for pro clients (corporate/web delivery) compared to the gh5/gh5s 10bit footage?

thumbs up.

rob
smalltalk productions/nyc

[Gary Huff]

Originally Posted by Rob Katz

is the panasonic g9's 8bit video "good enough" for pro clients (corporate/web delivery) compared to the gh5/gh5s 10bit footage?

Depends on how many of your corporate/web delivery clients are asking for 10-bit or the GH5 in particular.

[Rob Katz]

my clients aren't asking for anything but quality footage, a thoughtful finished product which was delivered on-time and on budget.

i light my interviews.

there is some run n gun but that is often daylight b roll.

i have watched TONS of youtube and vimeo footage and if the footage wasn't labelled, i really could not distinguish the 10bit from the 8bit.

i'm just saying.

thumbs up.

rob
smalltalk productions/nyc

[George Dean]

Hi Rob,

I have no experience comparing the 8 bit G9 and the 10 bit GH5, I have a GH4 and record 10 bit on an Atomos Ninja Flame.

However, I think you may have answered your own question, "i have watched TONS of youtube and vimeo footage and if the footage wasn't labelled, i really could not distinguish the 10bit from the 8bit."

Whatever footage in whatever codec and container you feed to Youtube, Youtube is going to reprocess, which may not make a visual difference or could make a difference you will never overcome.

If you are doing any green screen I think you will be more happy with the 10 bit. If you are going to perform any heavy color correction and grading, I think you will be happier with the 10 bit.

But, you stated you are lighting the interviews, assuming you are lighting well and have full control over the lighting, you may have very little corrections to make.

If your client is happy with what you are now providing, I would compare the specific cameras capability comparison to your current rig. If you have not as yet provided anything to this client, you may want to consider renting the cameras in question for a few hours to shoot a side-by-side test to determine first hand your likes-dislikes.

For me, I prefer the 422 10 bit over the 420 8 bit, knowing my source is going to better handle whatever heavy corrections it may need, if any.

[Steve Burkett]

There is a look and polish that 10 bit 4.2.2 and vLog can provide. Far and above 8 bit. However it depends on your clients. Many will not know or care. It depends on how high you're aiming for. Or how high your clients want. If they wish a particular look to the video you produce for them, then you should invest in the GH5 and use vLog 10 bit and 4.2 2. If there demands are just a nice looking video, you can get away with less. However I have encountered the odd demanding clients and this is where your gear counts. Not all claims have the same needs and expectations.

[Gary Huff]

Originally Posted by Steve Burkett

There is a look and polish that 10 bit 4.2.2 and vLog can provide.

There is not a "look and polish" that 10-bit 4:2:2 can provide. That "look and polish" is continuously seen in content you consume that is presented to you in 8-bit 4:2:0. Most of the "look and polish" that you're thinking of won't be done by most people even in 10-bit 4:2:2.

[David Stoneburner]

I would agree that the majority of what is needed is good lighting, composition, great audio, and storytelling. To include all the editing elements. That should satisfy most clients. In the case that they get particular over bits and color space, you can always rent cameras to accommodate.

[Steve Burkett]

Originally Posted by Gary Huff

There is not a "look and polish" that 10-bit 4:2:2 can provide. That "look and polish" is continuously seen in content you consume that is presented to you in 8-bit 4:2:0. Most of the "look and polish" that you're thinking of won't be done by most people even in 10-bit 4:2:2.

Actually said 10 bit 4.2.2. AND vLog. The vLog is the important bit I mentioned and you damn well left it out and just mentioned the least important bit. :) The 10 bit 4.2.2. just makes editing it easier. Sorry should have been clearer.

I agree, many who use it including me don't get the best out of it. But as a look, the extra DR and colour can pay dividends above a baked in look can give.

Of course it depends on the user, but poor vLog footage is easier to work with than poor baked in footage. Speak from experience alas. More forgiving in high contrast scenes outdoors. Seen too much of that this summer. :(

What can I say. I like working with vLog, so shoot me. :)

[Gary Huff]

The OP didn't mention vLog. Do you have corporate clients asking for log?

[Steve Burkett]

No you're right, he didn't. But I sort of thinking you're going to use 10 bit, why use it for a baked in look. Seems a bit silly. Still, it takes all sorts. :)

And clients don't ask me for vLog. They ask me for a Professional Video. The details of how I achieve that are up to me. If my Clients were experts in Video practise, they'd hardly need call on me. :)

[Gary Huff]

Do you grade by putting a LUT on your vLog footage?

[Steve Burkett]

No I sprinkle fairy dust on my PC and let magic simply take its course. :)

You do like your arguments Gary, but we've played that game before you and I and I know it too well to let you have your fun now. :)

Seriously, you're very knowledgeable I know (much more than I) but you're also good at using that knowledge to beat people over the head with. Often to the bitter end. Annoyed a few here doing so as well. Not me, but some. ;)

How and what I do with my footage and I favour a variety of techniques is down to me. If I like the look, how I get there is irrelevant. Maybe not to you, but no one's perfect eh. All I know is I'm happier with the colour and look in my footage now since using vLog than in the many years previous using Panasonic cameras. Maybe down to me, sloppy colour grading skills you can call it, probably is. But vLog has helped me find a look I'm happy with, that I didn't find before. Whatever I choose to grade it.

Now I gave my thoughts, for what it is worth. Let's not derail the thread with it.

[Gary Huff]

Originally Posted by Steve Burkett

you're also good at using that knowledge to beat people over the head with.

You were the one who posted that vLog and 10-bit 4:2:2 is what the OP should be using, implying that it was for so-called "professional video". So who is the one "beating people over the head"? My contention is that Rob doesn't need to be filming for his corporate clients in any Log whatsoever if they are not asking for it, and that, in addition, he can provide a polish look without needing to do what you are doing.

[Steve Burkett]

Originally Posted by Gary Huff

You were the one who posted that vLog and 10-bit 4:2:2 is what the OP should be using, implying that it was for so-called "professional video". So who is the one "beating people over the head"? My contention is that Rob doesn't need to be filming for his corporate clients in any Log whatsoever if they are not asking for it, and that, in addition, he can provide a polish look without needing to do what you are doing.

No I didn't. I said 10 bit and vLog had a polish to it. An opinion and not a recommendation. Yes if the client wants a certain look it's easier to work with vLog, that's all I said. Again an opinion. Not a recommendation. Was hardly forcing the OP to do anything. I'm not that good. :)

It's not just vLog and 10 bit, it's also the difference between the G9 and the GH5 I was talking about. And I said, if their demands are just a nice looking video, then the OP can get away with their current setup, it's if they want more where a better camera and codec can count. Unless you feel all clients would settle for 8 bit footage from a G9 camera. How's your C300 doing by the way? Gathering dust. ;)

Now I'm prepared to admit I didn't explained myself well. Didn't know the Internet Police were watching. But gosh you're feeling merciless today. You skipped breakfast or what? :D Let it go. My opinion is not worth this much debate surely.

[Gary Huff]

Originally Posted by Steve Burkett

I said 10 bit and vLog had a polish to it. An opinion and not a recommendation.

Considering it was an opinion that had barely anything to do with the OP's question, why did you post it?

Yes if the client wants a certain look it's easier to work with vLog, that's all I said.

And that's not really true. What "certain look" do you mean specifically? A film look? The only look that you absolutely need vLog in order to deliver is HDR. Period.

It's not just vLog and 10 bit, it's also the difference between the G9 and the GH5 I was talking about.

You didn't even bring that up other than the fact you think he needs a GH5 with vLog L in order to achieve professional video. That has nothing to do with the G9 other than the fact it doesn't sport vLog L.

it's if they want more where a better camera and codec can count.

More? What more? 12-stops of DR? You throw that in the garbage when you render your video.

How's your C300 doing by the way? Gathering dust. ;)

95% of the time for my clients, my C300 Mark II is filming in WideDR mode. The other 5% is for commercial spots and my personal documentaries.