Basic Question before Jumping at DVinfo.net

Gonzague Alexandre · June 13th, 2006, 08:18 AM

Hi everybody I am From Tokyo Japan and sorry if my english could be somehow not that perfect (I am neither Japanese nor English native speaker), anyway. I am acutally using a Sony HDR-HC1 with Sony Vegas and a soft called HDV-Split.

I am intersting to make a big jump on a more powerful camera, and actually this is a BIG question which one to buy? Canon or Pana? Well since my budget is well limited, I may jump on the Pana, but I have several questions

1) I like Vegas 6d, and I use it since a long time, but it seems that Vegas do not handle Pana files.

2) IWhen I will buy my Pana I will also need a P2 card, otherwise I cannot use it, is it correct? Or can we stick to it a Firestore (I read here that some people are using it)

3) What will come in the package?

4) I will need a wide lens, Pana sells some, but is there better alternative?

5) Any advise for me? What should I buy or else?

Thanks for your time

Alex Lucas · June 13th, 2006, 10:32 AM

First of all, your English is excellent. No need for apologies.

Second, I have seen the Xl h1, the JVC h100, the Sony z1u, and the Panasonic HVX 200.

In my most serious estimation of what you should do, you should go with the Canon h1. There are, in my opinion, more things going for it. The Panasonic is really made as a 'friend' camera to a crew shooting. It is good to have format choices, but a good lens is everything to a professional such as myself.

The Canon H1 is really what you will need to move up the ladder in production quality. The lens is great, the codec is the strongest HDV has to offer, and realistically, it's cheaper by far to operate and deal with instead of the P2 system.

It's an excellent camera, and after playing with all of them, it is vastly superior. The HVX 200 Panasonic is a very specialized issue. If you're trying a video shoot, or to add opportunity to a larger shoot, then it is the camera for you, if you're going out alone, then the Canon h1 cannot be beat.

However, my suggestion is that you research before you buy. I really don't believe that HDV is that much better than DV, it is only a format issue. If you can avoid any costs in dealing with a format, I would suggest you do it.

Seriously consider the prices of a Canon xl2 before having your mind set upon getting an Canon h1.

Dee Joslin · June 13th, 2006, 01:11 PM

All good points Alex. I have been through the research of H1 vs. HVX and HDV vs. DVCPRO HD. The bottom line, I guess, comes down to a matter of personal taste. Some folks seem to do great things with their particular camera where others seem to stumble and put out poor quality footage.

I chose the HVX because, one, I believe the limitations of DV tape for HD material is a quality hindrance and, two, the many formats. I don't agree, however, that the H1 is the camera needed to move up the ladder in production quality. I've seen some fine work from a HD10u, FX-1, etc.So if you can spend the money for the H1 and SDI output extras, and as long as you are using just that format, it is the better choice. I actually came close to shelling out the extra bling bling myself. (As if the HVX didn't cost enough)

So Gonzague, like Alex said, research first and determine what makes sense for you.

Mike Schrengohst · June 13th, 2006, 03:56 PM

It all depends on what you are delivering. I get to see footage from all the cameras you mentioned. The HVX picture quality is usually the best. I have had to reject more and more HDV footage because of the MPEG artifacting. Shots that would probably have been killer with an HVX just fall apart with HDV.

Dee Joslin · June 13th, 2006, 05:23 PM

Yes. I created some HDDVD's of some FX-1 footage at Disney. From the camera to the TV or M2t through DVHS on the Mac, it looked really good. But the mpeg encoding for HDDVD displayed compression artifacts that were very noticable. I used some footage from the HVX for the same test and it looked amazing. Again, limitations of tape. (As far as the FX-1 is concerned). It's 25 mbps compared to 100. Your bound to see a vast quality difference.

Gonzague Alexandre · June 13th, 2006, 06:04 PM

Thanks guys for your help

The advantage of the Canon is its lens, the HVX is the 100mbps and the fact that it support not only "i" but also "p"...

With 1 Canon I can buy 2 HVX... and well having 2 camera for that I will do it quite a good choice... GOOD If only I could be rich I would take each of them !

I will call the PR of Canon and Pana, since I am Journalist, don't worry Web Journalist Video is just a stuff we had recently, I will ask them to give me some demo and time with both of them...

Will let U know

PS My videos are for the Web, but we publish so far over 60 vids in 720p (WMVHD) and our readers love it so we want to boost things since the quality of the HDR-HC1 is not that perfect for me.

June 13th, 2006, 08:18 AM	#1
Gonzague Alexandre Regular Crew Join Date: May 2006 Location: Tokyo - JAPAN Posts: 43	Basic Question before Jumping Hi everybody I am From Tokyo Japan and sorry if my english could be somehow not that perfect (I am neither Japanese nor English native speaker), anyway. I am acutally using a Sony HDR-HC1 with Sony Vegas and a soft called HDV-Split. I am intersting to make a big jump on a more powerful camera, and actually this is a BIG question which one to buy? Canon or Pana? Well since my budget is well limited, I may jump on the Pana, but I have several questions 1) I like Vegas 6d, and I use it since a long time, but it seems that Vegas do not handle Pana files. 2) IWhen I will buy my Pana I will also need a P2 card, otherwise I cannot use it, is it correct? Or can we stick to it a Firestore (I read here that some people are using it) 3) What will come in the package? 4) I will need a wide lens, Pana sells some, but is there better alternative? 5) Any advise for me? What should I buy or else? Thanks for your time

June 13th, 2006, 10:32 AM	#2
Alex Lucas Regular Crew Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 50	I would say go with the Canon. First of all, your English is excellent. No need for apologies. Second, I have seen the Xl h1, the JVC h100, the Sony z1u, and the Panasonic HVX 200. In my most serious estimation of what you should do, you should go with the Canon h1. There are, in my opinion, more things going for it. The Panasonic is really made as a 'friend' camera to a crew shooting. It is good to have format choices, but a good lens is everything to a professional such as myself. The Canon H1 is really what you will need to move up the ladder in production quality. The lens is great, the codec is the strongest HDV has to offer, and realistically, it's cheaper by far to operate and deal with instead of the P2 system. It's an excellent camera, and after playing with all of them, it is vastly superior. The HVX 200 Panasonic is a very specialized issue. If you're trying a video shoot, or to add opportunity to a larger shoot, then it is the camera for you, if you're going out alone, then the Canon h1 cannot be beat. However, my suggestion is that you research before you buy. I really don't believe that HDV is that much better than DV, it is only a format issue. If you can avoid any costs in dealing with a format, I would suggest you do it. Seriously consider the prices of a Canon xl2 before having your mind set upon getting an Canon h1.

June 13th, 2006, 03:56 PM	#4
Mike Schrengohst Major Player Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Dallas, TX Posts: 355	It all depends on what you are delivering. I get to see footage from all the cameras you mentioned. The HVX picture quality is usually the best. I have had to reject more and more HDV footage because of the MPEG artifacting. Shots that would probably have been killer with an HVX just fall apart with HDV. __________________ Mike Schrengohst dvd.pro@verizon.net

June 13th, 2006, 01:11 PM	#3
Dee Joslin Regular Crew Join Date: May 2006 Location: Scranton, PA. Posts: 91	All good points Alex. I have been through the research of H1 vs. HVX and HDV vs. DVCPRO HD. The bottom line, I guess, comes down to a matter of personal taste. Some folks seem to do great things with their particular camera where others seem to stumble and put out poor quality footage. I chose the HVX because, one, I believe the limitations of DV tape for HD material is a quality hindrance and, two, the many formats. I don't agree, however, that the H1 is the camera needed to move up the ladder in production quality. I've seen some fine work from a HD10u, FX-1, etc.So if you can spend the money for the H1 and SDI output extras, and as long as you are using just that format, it is the better choice. I actually came close to shelling out the extra bling bling myself. (As if the HVX didn't cost enough) So Gonzague, like Alex said, research first and determine what makes sense for you.

June 13th, 2006, 05:23 PM	#5
Dee Joslin Regular Crew Join Date: May 2006 Location: Scranton, PA. Posts: 91	Yes. I created some HDDVD's of some FX-1 footage at Disney. From the camera to the TV or M2t through DVHS on the Mac, it looked really good. But the mpeg encoding for HDDVD displayed compression artifacts that were very noticable. I used some footage from the HVX for the same test and it looked amazing. Again, limitations of tape. (As far as the FX-1 is concerned). It's 25 mbps compared to 100. Your bound to see a vast quality difference.

June 13th, 2006, 06:04 PM	#6
Gonzague Alexandre Regular Crew Join Date: May 2006 Location: Tokyo - JAPAN Posts: 43	Thanks guys for your help The advantage of the Canon is its lens, the HVX is the 100mbps and the fact that it support not only "i" but also "p"... With 1 Canon I can buy 2 HVX... and well having 2 camera for that I will do it quite a good choice... GOOD If only I could be rich I would take each of them ! I will call the PR of Canon and Pana, since I am Journalist, don't worry Web Journalist Video is just a stuff we had recently, I will ask them to give me some demo and time with both of them... Will let U know PS My videos are for the Web, but we publish so far over 60 vids in 720p (WMVHD) and our readers love it so we want to boost things since the quality of the HDR-HC1 is not that perfect for me.