Warning leads to limited access of Classifieds forum

[Greg Boston]

<<<-- Originally posted by Sam Forbes : I would have to disagree with setting any limits. The fellow being acused here was registered a long time ago. Even having a high number of posts doesnt really mean anything. Just need to be very cautious. ALWAYS speak on the phone first. One conversation can tell you alot. Alot of common sense and caution can go along way. -->>>

Sam,

True about common sense and using the phone. But Sam, a high post count gives one the ability to read someone's writing style and how they conduct themselves in the other forums which to me speaks volumes about their character. Especially if they are running their own production companies. I know that I will take good care of my stuff to maximize my use of it and to offer someone else the opportunity to get a good deal should I decide to sell.

To Rod Finch: If you have not done so already, please send a private mail to Chris Hurd detailing the facts of this transaction. This might help clear up some confusion and allow for a fact based resolution. I think all of us hope that one of the 'regulars' among us hasn't defrauded a fellow DV-INFO'er.

-gb-

[Jim Sofranko]

I have been following this thread with great interest especially since I have an item currently for sale in the classifieds.

Having bought several nice items of gear in these classifieds while building up an XL package I have found the sellers to be completely professional and honest, the gear in good shape, and the prices fairly reasonable.

Most of the time I do carefully consider the number of posts and length of membership in determining the credibility of the seller. Plus an email dialogue about the gear usually tells me if the person knows what they are selling and has experience with the goods. But the activity of the seller and the time he has spent on this site tells me a lot about his commitment to the profession. The good reputation of an experienced forum member is at stake when they sell gear on the site. So I find the process has worked out well for me.

I have had to turn down goods that seemed a bit to good to be true from newbies selling gear here. So buyer beware!

I wanted to know if anyone has had any bad experinces from buyers when selling gear. I was contacted off-list by a non-member in another country about some gear listed here. Is there a risk involved as a seller that anyone knows of?

Thanks for a great thread.

[Mathieu Ghekiere]

I wanted to buy a used XL1S around August last year, as I didn't really had the budget to buy one new. And I hadn't really bought things via the internet, so I was cautious, but at the time I was at these boards looking somewhat around for maybe a couple of months (I didn't even know the Private Classifieds boards existed). Then I saw an XL1S PAL on Ebay, and I thought I recognised the guys name from these boards. He had lots of posts here and is pretty well known for some, Dennis Hingsberg, so I thought: I trust those guys from DVinfo.

And the whole sell was great, he always reacted very friendly on my mails and questions, wrapped the thing perfectly up, had it quckly,...
So for me that was a great experience, and I'm a little bit sad that some people aren't as good as others, but I have to admit: if I see someone selling something in the Private Classifieds boards, and he has 2 posts... I'm suspicious.

I don't think the moderators and Chris Hurd should always change something about the boards because a couple of the thousand members aren't good.
I think you have to know buying something via internet is ALWAYS a little bit dangerous, or always has a risk, but if you see it's from someone with over 100 or 200 posts, I think you can be pretty sure about it.

Really love these boards.

BTW: Has the person that sold the broken thing, already replied? Maybe he has a reason? I think if someone hasn't got a good reason, maybe you could forbid them to sell anything again here? But actually, I don't like that idea myself, because it's contradictory with my first main idea, that the moderators from these boards shouldn't always do special things for one some that didn't do it right. But maybe, maybe, you could have this rule: if there is a problem, you can ask the seller about explanation. If he doesn't respond... that means something, he isn't really friendly, as almost every other user here on the board. And if he responds but doesn't has a good reason, maybe (maybe!) you could forbid him to sell anything here again.
And If he DOES got a good reason, well, I don't think that would need further explanation. The thing is, it's always hard to prove such stuff.

Hmm, I don't really care now, because I already have many posts so I think some could agree I'm pretty reliable, and on the other hand: I won't sell anything quickly I think, but maybe I want to buy some stuff here ver. All I want to say is: let the people who are very busy with the Private Classifieds boards, and buy and/or sell a lot lot more than me, decide, because it's about them offcourse. In agreement with the moderators/Chris Hurd.

Well, I think I spoke to much, need sleep now;-).

[Greg Boston]

<<<-- Originally posted by Mathieu Ghekiere :

BTW: Has the person that sold the broken thing, already replied? Maybe he has a reason? I think if someone hasn't got a good reason, maybe you could forbid them to sell anything again here? But actually, I don't like that idea myself, because it's contradictory with my first main idea, that the moderators from these boards shouldn't always do special things for one some that didn't do it right. But maybe, maybe, you could have this rule: if there is a problem, you can ask the seller about explanation. If he doesn't respond... that means something, he isn't really friendly, as almost every other user here on the board. And if he responds but doesn't has a good reason, maybe (maybe!) you could forbid him to sell anything here again.
And If he DOES got a good reason, well, I don't think that would need further explanation. The thing is, it's always hard to prove such stuff.

. -->>>

That's why I suggested to Rod that he private mail Chris H. since Chris is listed as the wrangler for this forum. I would hope the seller would do the same. I initially felt we should have limits, but others responded and I changed my thoughts to just leave it as is. This is not, and should not, ever become a major problem on this site. There are far too many good people here as you pointed out. However, if we find that someone has committed a serious breach of membership trust in their selling/buying activity, I would vote for immediate ban of that member.

-gb-

[John Sandel]

"Ostracism" may be hard to spell, but everybody knows how it feels.

[Greg Boston]

Well John,

Here in Texas, when someone does this they usually just utter those three little words....."get a rope". :-)

No flames please, the above comment was made in reference to the ways of the 'old west'. They were called lynch mobs. Since this board is based in Texas and we are 'wranglers' and not 'moderators', I felt inclined to make a historical connection. Must be the lack of sleep.

-gb-

[Martin Archer-Shee]

I felt compelled to add my comments.
I have found this forum to be invaluable and have been involved with several sales and purchases, with good results. I had one item that failed when I got it and had no problem with the seller and would purchase from him again. My message count is not high and indeed when some transactions took place was actually quite low. If we had a minimun count before being allowed to trade, none of these transactions would have gone through, to the detriment of all concerned. My vote is not to put a limit by means of"message counts". Having said that, I agree that 'counts" are a consideration in looking at a sale/purchase. The content is also a factor. In short you use all the available tools to make a decision.

I am involved in several other forums and they too have had some problems with"undesirables". There are rotten apples anywhere. The freer this forum the better, but feedback is the clue to safety.

One forum, Luminous Landscape, does not have a buy/sell but suffered from some excessive comments. The owner/moderator clamped down by making it only open to registered members. You could not enter without a password, which meant you had to submit your name, e-mail address etc.

Another forum, Fredmiranda (digital photography) , has an informal feedback thread where people can comment on the quality of their transaction.

Hopefully we do not need to have a more controlled system but if it is so deemed the following are my suggestions:

1 no e-bay etc. listings. I know this the current policy but it is not always followed.
2 Close the forum except to registered members.
3 Modification of above (if possible). Close certain aspects of the forum, say "Buy/Sell" to registered people only, and make the rest "read only"
4 All registerants to submit a brief resume with complete address etc.
5 All registered users to use there real name and not a "pen name".


Yes, still people will be able to "cheat" the system but maybe not as easily.

Mostly we all need to be aware of how we deal and treat each other with respect, which on this forum is certainly the majority cases.

Martin

[Mick Isdes]

All of this is very subjective. I think all of us should be old enough to understand what we are getting into. I have very few posts, and the person from whom I just bought an awesome camera package deal also has very few posts and it worked out better than expected!!!
It's all about contact and interacting then doing your homework. If their were restrictions then I would not of met another great film maker and have had a positive experience.
You also have to take into mind that this stuff happens anywhere even right before your eyes on the street.
Like the old adage if it's to good to be true.

[Rob Lohman]

Martin: we already do not allow eBay listings for classifieds in this forum.

As you know this forum also features real names, so that takes
care of the last point on your list as well.

Other options for this forum are being discussed behind the
scenes as well. At this point in time no decisions have been
set in stone on any changes to this classifieds forum.