Where are the full resolution sensor video test modes? at DVinfo.net

Wayne Morellini · August 21st, 2005, 09:37 AM

I hope this doesn't offend anyone.

I was just thinking, and it occurred to me that the HC1 must have video test modes for testing the full sensor during servicing, but this is likely to be hidden away in servicing functions, or on a hidden digital/analogue port like I've heard about on the JVC GY-500 (though it is likely they would just use the component port).

There might be a video test mode for progressive (as we understand it can capture progressive stills) and interlace, with a resolution upto 1920*1440 resolution of the sensor. The test mode might even supply the data in a raw 4:4:4 form to show every pixel under the single chip colour filter array (IE like the Bayer pattern). This would enable very high quality processing and compact storage of uncompressed footage compared to 4:2:2 or 4:2:0.

I know people have acceded the service items on cameras before, and I've heard of people hacking the HC1, has anybody heard of anything?

A raw per pixel output would probably show up as a monochrome image of every pixel (either one of the component lines, or all of them changing together) or just the component line matching the filtered colour of pixel at each position.

Chris Hurd · August 21st, 2005, 11:19 AM

Well, I'm just curious, what could you do with that information? I guess I can't understand the purpose for this. How would it help you to use the camera?

Wayne Morellini · August 21st, 2005, 12:33 PM

There was significant interest in recording high quality from the component as a quality solution. A full frame test mode is better, and raw is better again for post processing. Even at just normal 1080p this would be a lot cheaper solution than the upcoming JVC/PANA HD component recording solutions for their low end HD cameras.

For people here, a component record to compressed to anything better than hdv would be an improvement if you wanted high quality. For the indie crowd uncompressed is doubly so. For people involved in the Digital Cinema camera projects it is an interesting cheap alternative (if it can be done cheaply).

Worth asking about to see. Currently I am asking some people about cheap component recording solutions on another site too, but I don't hold much hope.

Thanks

Fredrik-Larsson · August 21st, 2005, 04:07 PM

I am quite sure that it's 4:4:4 if you use it directly. No need for testmode. If it's from tape it's of course compressed. I can only remember that I read it somewhere. I can't find it in the manual at the moment.

Edit: I might have been dreaming since I can't verify it somehow. Sorry.

Wayne Morellini · August 22nd, 2005, 07:05 AM

Thanks for that. If 4:4:4 (or single chip filter type) would be great for quality.

These sorts of pieces of information have a tends of slipping by, so you might be right anyway.

Fredrik-Larsson · August 22nd, 2005, 07:12 AM

I now recall that I might read it about the HVX200 and some way mixed them up. Do anyone know how it can be checked out?

Wayne Morellini · August 22nd, 2005, 11:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fredrik-Larsson

I now recall that I might read it about the HVX200 and some way mixed them up. Do anyone know how it can be checked out?

I was hoping somebody might know how to hack a Sony camera, have access to the most low level service manuals. Hook them up to a HD display that gives accurate mode information, and look for the sort of colour information I mentioned above.

I gleaned some information over at avs forums, somebody said Lucas was going to do his next film on the A1 model. I couldn't find any cheap way to record component HD over there, only w-vhs.

Chris Hurd · August 22nd, 2005, 11:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wayne Morellini

somebody said Lucas was going to do his next film on the A1 model.

Actually that's not quite correct; he's doing it with the A1 model and Obin's adapter. We have a rule here, I can't help what you fall for at other message boards but *please* don't drag this kind of nonsense into DV Info. The next thing you know, somebody will be saying that Spielberg's next Hollywood blockbuster will be shot using the movie mode on his digicam. Thanks in advance,

Wayne Morellini · August 23rd, 2005, 07:27 AM

OK, I understand. Thought he was being real though. I even told him that in that case Lucas would be using the A1's component ;). Are you trying to frighten me with the Obin adaptor stuff ;) I already know that Juan of FIlmstream is the only practical place here to get the FPGA that quickly, I was even thinking of approaching Juan myself a while ago. (Oh, and you forgot to mention, I'm the George's chief camera man on the movie ;)

Chris Hurd · August 23rd, 2005, 09:19 AM

Thanks Wayne, how did you know that I really am The George's chief camera man on that movie. Much appreciated,

August 21st, 2005, 09:37 AM	#1
Wayne Morellini Inner Circle Join Date: May 2003 Location: Australia Posts: 2,762	Where are the full resolution sensor video test modes? I hope this doesn't offend anyone. I was just thinking, and it occurred to me that the HC1 must have video test modes for testing the full sensor during servicing, but this is likely to be hidden away in servicing functions, or on a hidden digital/analogue port like I've heard about on the JVC GY-500 (though it is likely they would just use the component port). There might be a video test mode for progressive (as we understand it can capture progressive stills) and interlace, with a resolution upto 1920*1440 resolution of the sensor. The test mode might even supply the data in a raw 4:4:4 form to show every pixel under the single chip colour filter array (IE like the Bayer pattern). This would enable very high quality processing and compact storage of uncompressed footage compared to 4:2:2 or 4:2:0. I know people have acceded the service items on cameras before, and I've heard of people hacking the HC1, has anybody heard of anything? A raw per pixel output would probably show up as a monochrome image of every pixel (either one of the component lines, or all of them changing together) or just the component line matching the filtered colour of pixel at each position.

August 21st, 2005, 11:19 AM	#2
Chris Hurd Obstreperous Rex Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: San Marcos, TX Posts: 27,366 Images: 513	Well, I'm just curious, what could you do with that information? I guess I can't understand the purpose for this. How would it help you to use the camera? __________________ CH Search DV Info Net \| 20 years of DVi \| ...Tuesday is Soylent Green Day!

August 23rd, 2005, 09:19 AM	#10
Chris Hurd Obstreperous Rex Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: San Marcos, TX Posts: 27,366 Images: 513	Thanks Wayne, how did you know that I really am The George's chief camera man on that movie. Much appreciated, __________________ CH Search DV Info Net \| 20 years of DVi \| ...Tuesday is Soylent Green Day!

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August 21st, 2005, 12:33 PM	#3
Wayne Morellini Inner Circle Join Date: May 2003 Location: Australia Posts: 2,762	There was significant interest in recording high quality from the component as a quality solution. A full frame test mode is better, and raw is better again for post processing. Even at just normal 1080p this would be a lot cheaper solution than the upcoming JVC/PANA HD component recording solutions for their low end HD cameras. For people here, a component record to compressed to anything better than hdv would be an improvement if you wanted high quality. For the indie crowd uncompressed is doubly so. For people involved in the Digital Cinema camera projects it is an interesting cheap alternative (if it can be done cheaply). Worth asking about to see. Currently I am asking some people about cheap component recording solutions on another site too, but I don't hold much hope. Thanks

August 21st, 2005, 04:07 PM	#4
Fredrik-Larsson Major Player Join Date: May 2005 Location: Malmö, Sweden Posts: 395	I am quite sure that it's 4:4:4 if you use it directly. No need for testmode. If it's from tape it's of course compressed. I can only remember that I read it somewhere. I can't find it in the manual at the moment. Edit: I might have been dreaming since I can't verify it somehow. Sorry.

August 22nd, 2005, 07:05 AM	#5
Wayne Morellini Inner Circle Join Date: May 2003 Location: Australia Posts: 2,762	Thanks for that. If 4:4:4 (or single chip filter type) would be great for quality. These sorts of pieces of information have a tends of slipping by, so you might be right anyway.

August 22nd, 2005, 07:12 AM	#6
Fredrik-Larsson Major Player Join Date: May 2005 Location: Malmö, Sweden Posts: 395	I now recall that I might read it about the HVX200 and some way mixed them up. Do anyone know how it can be checked out?

August 23rd, 2005, 07:27 AM	#9
Wayne Morellini Inner Circle Join Date: May 2003 Location: Australia Posts: 2,762	OK, I understand. Thought he was being real though. I even told him that in that case Lucas would be using the A1's component ;). Are you trying to frighten me with the Obin adaptor stuff ;) I already know that Juan of FIlmstream is the only practical place here to get the FPGA that quickly, I was even thinking of approaching Juan myself a while ago. (Oh, and you forgot to mention, I'm the George's chief camera man on the movie ;)