HD1000 vs HXR-MC2000

[Jonathan W. Hickman]

Having owned the HD1000U and the FX1000, I was curious about the new 2000 model. I liked my HD1000, and that 1/2 inch chip performed well, but this new model has a 1/4 chip. What's that all about?

I've still got an HC9 in a box that I can break out for tape transfer and even it has a 1/2 inch chip. And this 50U camera has the 1/2 inch chip, why would they not just include that chip in the new 2000?

Sony could get a few hundred extra with a shoulder mount version of the 50U. But I can't see shelling out $2K for a shoulder mount with a 1/4 inch chip.

Anyone shoot with the 2000? How can Sony make a case that an event guy or a journalist like me should pick up the 2000 model?

[Adam Gold]

Just for clarification, both the HC9 and the HD1000 have a 1/2.9" chip, which is just a hair over 1/3". The MC50U has a 1/2.88" chip, just a hair bigger than either of those, but still basically 1/3". None are close to having a 1/2" chip or the performance thereof.

Can you post a link to what you are reading about an HD2000U from Sony? I'm finding no info on it.

EDIT: Ahhh, got it. You're talking about this: Sony Product Detail Page HXRMC2000U ,

a tapeless successor to the HVR-HD1000U. Explains why I was getting no hits on HD2000U, as there isn't one.

The new chip does appear to be smaller but it is the Exmor "R," which vastly outperforms the earlier generation. Nonetheless, as this cam does not appear to be available yet, I can't give you a real comparison and I doubt anyone can at this point. Reading the specs -- if they can be believed -- the new cam should outperform the HD1000 (which was terrible in low light) by about a stop.

This should probably be in the AVCHD forum.

[Jonathan W. Hickman]

Thanks for your response to my late night post. Could you put this over in the AVCHD section, but can you believe the specs that Sony has on their site for this 2000U?

I'm guessing that the performance in good light is nice, but why stunt the camera in lower light?

And think about this you pick up a Sony camcorder with this chip (I think) for $299! Here's the link: http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/671547-REG/Sony_HDR_CX110_HDR_CX110_HD_Handycam_Camcorder.html

[Jonathan W. Hickman]

And, I totally misread the specs at 1/2 inch, but I'm still right about the chip on this 2000U being smaller than the 50U and probably the same one that can be found in a $299 consumer cam.

[Adam Gold]

No question this is a smaller chip. It does appear to be the same chip as the cx110, so why not go to a store that has one and see if you like it?

Just as the HD1000 was an HC7 in a big box, this appears to have the same relationship to the CX100/300 series. You don't buy this cam for the chip, you buy it for the form factor. And you're assuming the chip in the MC2000 isn't very good, which might or might not be true.

I imagine any reviews out there for the CX series would have a lot of opinions on the chip and how well it performs. I do see your point, though. When the HD1000 came out, it was based on the flagship of their Mini Handycam line, the HC7, and had the same chip. Yet the MC2000 doesn't have the best/biggest chip in the equivalent CX or XR line, which is 1/2.88" rather than 1/4".

[Jonathan W. Hickman]

I do want to get a small tapeless camera that I can use when I'm not shooting with my DSLR. Gotta say I've been a big fan of my HC9, but it is a tape camera.

Anyone who has gone tapeless can attest they don't want to go back again.

My hesitation with the Sony is that it is interlaced only (which I've been cool with in the past). And because I'm using a Canon DSLR, I'm tempted to go Canon with my small cam.

But bottom line I do not understand putting the smaller chip in the MC2000. Seems like a mistake.

[John Wiley]

I agree it's a bit odd to have a 1/4 inch chip in this level of camera. Regardless of whether or not it's a Exmor chip, the point is they've taken the chip from one of the lowest-placed cameras in their line and put it into a pro camera. It would've been a better idea to use the chip/guts from a CX550 - even with a higher price tag, it would be far more attractive to low-end professionals.

[Dave Blackhurst]

If they really put the small chip in this, it's a horrible mistake, I concur that the guts of the CX550/MC50U would have made the better choice.

Frankly the CX550 is a tough camera to beat on most fronts, and with the image stabilization, you almost don't need a shoulder mount form factor, unless it's just for "show".

[Lou Bruno]

Don't underestimate the EXMOR-R chip. It is remarkable! I have NO grain in my EXMOR-R chip camera and it much more senstive than two of my 1/3 inch chips. I have a CX series SONY and a HV series Canon camera. Of course my Pro HD Camera is in a league of its own with three 1/3 inch chips and a HD ENG lens.

[Dave Blackhurst]

Not underestimating the R sensor one bit, the CX550 has a roughly 1/3 sensor and excellent low light performance, love that little guy and the CX500 predecessor!

i've got a couple pocket P&S Sonys with I believe a 1/4" EXMOR R that shoot video... and they aren't so hot when the light gets bad on the video side of the equation - the only thing that saves them is the still processing works wonders for stills... for video, they are about 3-4 generations behind the CX550 in performance. Fine for when you don't want to cart a bigger camera around, but they wouldn't pass muster for anything serious, particularly in those bad light situations where the CX550 shines.

[Jonathan W. Hickman]

Okay, Lou, you know me, I had to try out the Sony 50U. So, after monitoring them online, I picked one up used for around $1K.

I have done a few tests on the camera. By "tests" I mean that I set the camera up in my editing suite and my little TV studio (that doubles as the corner of my living room) and compared the camera's performance vs. our two T2is. The low light is okay, however, there is noise on the image it is just smoother than I remember with my Sony 1000U. Neat video cleans it up rather well by the way (while making the image a little softer). There's more noise present than the DSLR.

Here's the troubling thing about the camera: unlike my old HC9, you can't really fake out the Auto Gain as effectively. With the HC9, you could tweak the shutter and exposure independently. You can't do that with this camera. So, if you reduce the exposure to beat the auto gain, my limited experience is that the shutter stays on auto, which seems to lock it in 60. I like to have the shutter at 30 and then reduce the exposure to get the cleanest image out of these little cameras. Can someone tell me if I'm doing something wrong? My solution is just to us the Intelligent Auto, which creates an image as good as I could probably do manually (given the limitations).

The colors are not a vibrant as the DSLR, which we can all understand. I just can't get over the quality that the Canon's deliver.

My other main focus has been sound. My little TV audience (I'm on a couple cable stations with the low end and fun Film Fix show) really will cut me slack on the image, but the sound has to be clear. I shoot the show in HD and edit it in HD in FCP, but it is compressed and converted to SD and displayed in letterbox. I know that I could just shoot it all in SD but I actually like the letterbox and I like being able to offer an HD version on YouTube.

The audio is fine, but I'm not sure if it is good enough for even my little show (sound on my show has been a nightmare at times). The audio I've captured from the shotgun on the camera would need to be heavily tweaked in Soundtrack pro to use (this is in the normal setting, in the low setting, the audio is cleaner but with a lower floor). I've not plugged in my Sen G2 wireless into the camera and tried it yet. I may do that over the next week. We'll have a Christmas show up by then--I'm reviewing TRUE GRIT and others if anyone cares.

Finally, I'm itching to try the camera out on a run and gun and then even put it into operation on one of my little 30 second commercials I do for the local television folks. The workflow is really great which is a major plus.

[Bryan Daugherty]

Johnathan - Just to clarify. This is the 50U you are talking about and not the MC2000U, correct?

Has anyone had any hands-on with the 2000U yet? I just discovered it existed today while visiting B&H (online) and am seriously considering ditching one of my 1000Us to upgrade...

...if it is an upgrade...

[Jonathan W. Hickman]

Right the Sony HXR-MC50U that has the same specs as the 550. I honestly don't think that the 2000U would be much of an upgrade except as to workflow, which is tapeless. The chip is smaller, but the new backlit one.

I'm digging the 50U as far as workflow. Just shot one of my little shows with it as an experiment. I used the shotgun mic and everything. We'll see how it turns out. I'll post clips soon to Vimeo.

It baffles me that Sony wouldn't just take the chip from the 50U and put it in the 2000.

[Jonathan W. Hickman]

Okay, below are the links to the latest episode of my little TV show. The show was shot entirely with the Sony HXR-MC50U, including audio. Perhaps this should be posted somewhere else, but there is not a separate section for the 550 and 50U.

The longer segment below I shot in a room (the corner of my living room) and the audio had less echo. The second segment was shot in my office and the hard surfaces produced an echo. I tried some things in Soundtrack pro and it made it a bit worse, but I left it. The longer segment is the raw audio from the camera with a 7 db amp adjustment. In the future, I'm going to use my photo background to help deaden sound in the room. Please make other suggestions.

Color correction was employed because the intelligent auto was a little too hot for my taste. I desaturated a little bit. The longer segment had the room light and I popped up a 150 a few feet or so above me behind the camera. Only room lighting on the shorter segment.

Given the workflow and the audio that I can get out of the camera shotgun with some selective room arrangements, I'm very pleased with this camera. I will probably use it over my Canon DSLR on my show going forward. Hit me with any questions about the camera.

Note that I shoot and edit two segments of my show and on TV there is an ad between them. I only do a new show every two weeks for TV, but typically, I post something each week online.

Longer show segment: 12-19-10 December Review Show - The Daily Film Fix - blip.tv

Shorter show segment: The Film Fix: Holiday Review Show - The Daily Film Fix - blip.tv

[Rod Pike]

Hi all. I have a HD1000 and want the HXR 2000. My enquiries to Sony and their NZ agents confirm that it isn't coming to the southern hemisphere for some time if at all. However, I am just about to get one from England- I will not be spurned! The UK one is designated HXR-MC2000E. The E stands for Europe.

Sony rep confirms that it is exactly the same as the N which was to be coming south but now isn't for some reason. The only difference is the power plug-a quick job to change. The down side is that it is only covered by a UK warranty, so would need to be shipped back in the unlikely event of a problem in the first 12 months. Worth the risk I reckon! Cheers!