Class action law suit
 

Victor; I agree that this has to be a known issue at Sony. Too many occurences for it to make it under the radar. I think Sony has planned this to sell more batteries. I had to buy several more batteries to keep from using AC power. I will sign on in a class action, although I don't have any funds to help out. I will support you any way I can.

It IS a known issue. I spoke with someone who has a memo stating such. Now, the problem is getting them to release the memo. The defect appears in the early Z1 models.

Also FX1
 

The issue also showed up in the HDR-FX1 models.

Now that sounds a little like conspiracy theory ;-) There may be a defect, but I haven't seen enough firsthand reports to indicate that it's widespread. I'm no lawyer, but I think you have to show that you've been personally damaged before becoming part of a class action suit.

Hrm.. if I sue Sony I can finally afford all those cool Sony products I've been wanting to add to the temple of Sony that is my house.

I have a document in my possession that indicates a no power problem and a transistor and a fuse needs to be changed due to a response difference in the circuit.

It lists the various Z1 models with the serial numbers that are afflicted with the problem.

Sony should be recalling these cameras instead of waiting for us to discover their mistake.

I'm actually paying to have my camera repaired because I'm out of the country and I've had my Z1 for over a year. Sony should be paying for the repair!

I have not heard of any sort of widespread issues of bad FX1s or Z1s, and I deal with one everyday. Isolated incidents, sure. Talk to Sony tech support (Electronics is better than Consumer, that's Z1 vs. FX1) and see what can be resolved.

I loved Canon's XL1 Club--I always had my camera back in 5 days.

heath

Victor - I think you have a large audience here that would be very interested in seeing this document. Is it possible to share ? thanks- Kurth

Yep....bad power supply unit.

My HVR Z1 stopped working on chane of trade mark of tapes
 

I usually use only Sony DVC tapes but because I was out of tapes in the middle of a production I had to buy some Panasonic Tapes for a shooting
They created havoc in all my systems my HVR Z1 had their heads clogged and stoped functioning and my spooler system a JVC DV BCR DV 600 also stopped working
Just to let you know that to change tapes for your camera or other systems may create a head clogging problem
By the way cleaning tape for both systems didnt work I had to send both systems to service (in a middle of a production :(
I have read this kind of troubles may exist and yes it happened to me

So next time I will be more prepared than sorry (Today I bought 100 tapes just in case)

Regards
Jose Noriega
Director
Mexico
www.video.com.mx

Having looked at sites trying to figure out if there is a hack for fx-1 to convert into a z1, I came across picture from a z1 owner in Europe. He was asking what the connection in the back of the z1 was, as it was locked in with a screw.

When he opened it up, it was the power connection that FX-1 owners used. He tried pluging it in and the system came on and then shut off.

Z1 owners are given the charger with the battery insert cable to use on their systems. FX owners have to directly plug in a power cord.

I was wondering why they would do something like that on basically the same camera minus a few features. Now, it's got me thinking that Sony knew this might happen...

After reading this thread, it's got me worried that my system will die from using the power cord. I've never kept the battery in my camera when I am doing editing work, just using the power cord. Is that bad? I charge my standard battery that came with my FX-1 on the camcorder as I don't trust using my generic battery charger for it, but I don't like to keep it on the camera for editing work. I always feel like it'll short out. I've done this with my other camcorders as well, in the past.

I'm also using a generic f970 battery for my fx-1. I have never had any issues with it, yet. I've been using it for a couple of weeks. Works beautifully.

It appears to me people are talking about two completely separate disconnected problems. One , the problem associated with having the fx1 connected to ac power and blowing some type of internal fuse or transistor. Two , the problem of the z1 loosing viewfinder data on early model z1s'.

Victor , I'll reinterate my request for you to share this purported document that would have to originate with sony or its' associates. I think it unfair to mention this w/o offering the documentation esp. since you were trying to recruite people for a " class action " . If this problem is common , that's one thing. but if it's common knowledge and acknowledged by sony , that's a completely different animal. So does it have teeth or is this another growling mouse ?thanks- Kurth

Just wanted to point out, that document is most likely Sony's intellectual property strongly protected by copyright. I definitely won't host it here. Anybody who puts it on the web somewhere else might be running a pretty strong legal risk. Just a heads-up is all.

Believe me, I have nothing but the greatest admiration and respect for Victor Muh. However, I have some very specific intentions for DV Info Net, and using it to initiate a class action lawsuit is not one of them. I don't want this site to be a springboard to recruit people for such a purpose. For Victor or anyone who is seriously considering making a go at it, I apologize but you'll have to start a separate web site or web log and proceed from there. I wish you guys nothing but the best and I want you to get a satisfactory resolution to this issue, but DV Info Net will not be a part of it. I have no desire to take the site in that direction. There are plenty of other internet sites out there which eat this stuff up, I mean they literally thrive on this sort of thing, so don't worry about attracting attention, you'll get plenty of it.

I'll be more than happy to report your results, but as for carrying the fight, sorry it's just not in my blood. If you can get some other site to pick this up for you, or if you start your own, please post about it here. Thanks,

Chris - I , personally, had no intention of fighting with Sony and I understand your concern. I think most z1 owners would simply be curious if their z model # is mentioned. Victor could possibly send this list via email to any concerned owner, if he so chooses. How's that ? As to the protection of this memo , if it is indeed an inhouse sony document, I believe the US has whistleblower protection laws ? However French law is another question. Victor , if you decide to make available this document in another venue , if it's alright with Chris , could you post that direction .thanks - Kurth

I have no problem at all if he wants to post a link to it.

I will forward the document to Chris once I black out information that could I.D. the source of the document.

Victor - I think I understood Chris as saying , correct me Chris if I'm wrong , that he doesn't want to touch this with a pole. Why can't we circulate it via email ? Kurth

Chris is saying put the document on a host site and put a link here to it. I have a FX1 that works fine, but I have seen two that are DOA. I would really like to see the document, not for some sort of class action, but for insight on any weakness in my camera and prevention of defect occurance. This type of information seems to me to be useful to other DVi users. Can't you just put it on an idisk somewhere and post a link?

Right.

Well, whether this will turn into anything legal remains to be seen. I think we Z1 owners ought to know. That's the first step.

Send me an e-mail. I will e-mail the document.

As an aside thats somehow related to the topic. Its basically clear that if you happen to take your camera out of charge by turning on the AC power, or etc, it can potentially damage the camera.

Now, I know the FX1, and the Z1 Take InfoLithium batteries 'L' Series (I'm assuming because it has a Big L on the side.) And I know it ONLY takes the 750, 770, and the 970 L series batteries.

Now! I have an old hi8 cam that ALSO takes Info Lithium L-series Batteries. And is charged with the power connected to the camera - I've never had problems running on both power and batt at the same time and switch.

So to avoid damaging my FX1, and Using batteries 100%, And while I save up enough to buy a seperate charger, can I charge the FX1's batteries on my Hi8 cam. Will it wreck the battery/camera? Cause since its older, the manual dosent say if its only limited to what battereis it can use.

Any thoughts.?

Actually the Z1 is shipped with an NP-F570. I have also been using an NP-F960 with no problems whatsoever. Where did you get that idea?

I wouldn't think you could damage the FX1 by charging batteries on another camera, but I've never tried it myself.

Well, I got the idea fromt he FX1 Manual, and assumed that since it only takes NP-F*70's (5,7, and 9) I assumed the Z1 did also.

Thanks for the clarrification. Its just that I'm overly paranoid. I'm fresh out of my Bachelors of Theatremaking with credits in Film Theory, Theatre and Film Direction, and Just bought an FX1 (due in Monday) and I just keep hearing horror stories. And all I really want to do is do event work, and make my own films and docos in my own time....

And since the only help I can get is this forum and Local one here is OZ, I'm not taking any chances. I think I should get some old Uni buddies together to join in on my Bussiness. But for now, I'm on my own.

The Z1 owners manual says the following on page 117: "This unit is compatible with the InfoLITHIUM battery pack (L series)". I don't see anything which says you can only use certain models of the L series batteries. Does the FX1 manual really say that?

Now, I own a 330 Info-Lithium [L] Battery due to the one supplied with my Hi8 Camera. Its an L series, but its not allowed so says the manual... I wonder why?

If the Z1 and the FX1 share the same housing, shouldnt the power units be the same? Or have they ALSO found another problem with the camera and fixed it in the Z1 and not tell us?

YET, the Manual in Page 92, and 93 says that You can Use Info-Lithium [L] series batteries. No mention of limitations. *shrugs* Time to write a letter of dissatisfaction.

Another recommendation, keep your cameras, whichever kind, off when changing batteries. When they're on and you put a fresh battery in, over time that can cause damage to the camera.

heath

I'll throw in an idea - never charge your batteries in the camera and if you do , protect it like you do your computer with a sophisticated backups. Electicity at the pump is never constant. Spend the extra on a separate charger and , Leo , yes you can charge your batteries thru your old hi8 and , yes , it's compatible. Sony has just upgraded battery models . I've got a tr3300 that uses the same model and is interchangable. It'll be less painful to loose your old hi8 than a new fx1 ! Kurth

That's interesting. I've never seen those model battieries myself though. But if it specifically says not to use them, then I wouldn't. Batteries and chargers are cheap... or at least a lot cheaper than a $3,000 camera! Look at the specs on the battery itself (should be on a label in fine print). Is there something different about the voltage maybe? Or maybe, since the FX1 charges the battery right on the camera, that has something to do with it?

Leo - I was saying you can charge your new fx1 batteries in you hi8. It's just trickling a small voltage to your battery- I say it's compatible because I use the old model hi8 charging unit to charge my zs' batteries sometimes and it works perfectly. Using the hi8 camera should be the same. Now whether those older model L series batteries are incompatible with the fx/z - I'd recommend further research. I have put new L series batteries in my hi8 and they worked fine although I haven't done the reverse. I'd recommend simply purchasing at least one np-f970 and you can charge it using your old hi8 camera, or at least mine charges fine thru the old-style L series chargers made for hi8 cameras which , logic would say , would be charging them the same -Kurth.

G'day Boyd, Kurth,

Thanks for the input. I've actually decided to use my Hi8 to charge my batteries until I can get my hands on a Charger. It seems to work nicely, and I cant see anything wrong... for now. My Old Hi8 Camera is shot up anyway. It had a good 7 years of work on it, and I suddenly realised (after renting a FX1) that the onboard microphone had been shot for quite some time. (I never knew how good a basic mic could be. I just thought mics at that price were supposed to sound like that, but man!

Anyway, still waiting on my FX1... comes in tomorrow. I bought the 970, which surprisingly enough could not fit on my Hi8 camera because of a metal loop that held onto the shoulder strap. I had to get my plyers and carefully snip off the loop so the huge battery could fit. (You couldnt put it in the back, because the loop was in the way. you had to slid it in through the top and then push it in.)

Sony is crazy sometimes. (Or forces people to go crazy.)

Because a new battery doesn't fit on a 7 year old camera? ;-)

hahahah.... yea, I think I'm a little crazy. But the cam is broken anyway. If I posted my 3 minute video about car accidents, you'll notice just how bad my work was as of late because I just had so much trouble with it.

Its an old DCR-TRV130E PAL. And it does ok video, and sound, but since because I was a stupid young uni student amature, I never cleaned the heads, and never took much care of it. And most of the time, it gathered dust.

I spend so much more time 'saving' my footage rather than editing it. And some of my mates say that the end product look and sounds ok, but thats after I slave over the computer trying to adjust and adjust till I go insane.

Now with my recent purchase, I'm not taking any chances, and not making any shortcuts. And hopefully, the camera is the only thing I'll be throwing money at to solve my problems. (as when I got my 3 grand camcorder, back on the 90's I thought it answerd all my problems I had when I needed to make some docos.... It seems money dont make it work. (as I could have gotten a XM2 (GL1) for a few grand more, and actually learned how to use a pro cam...) I'm crazy man..... Crazy like a sane man stuck in a jazz club.

I'll assume you got it fixed by now. Mine just did the same thing. Did you learn what was wrong?

Thanks,
Wayne