Z1 manual, p.71 warning??

[Chris Gorman]

In the manual for the Z1, on pg. 71 it says "if you record in the dv sp mode, a mosaic-like disturbance of picture may appear or sound may be interrupted when you play back the tape on other camcorders or VCRs."

What does that mean? Are they saying that if I shoot in dv sp mode when shooting 2nd camera for someone who requires dv sp, and hand my tape to them, they may not be able to play it without my Z1?

Or does it mean something else because it's in the section for "Using the IN/OUT Rec Menu" Maybe it means this might happen only with tapes you record in VTR mode???

[Leo Pepingco]

I have an FX1, so I dont think it appears in my manual... had a look.

But, from what you posted, I take it to mean that, yes, if you record in dv sp, then give it to someone else, it *might* be a little screwy.

[Hornady Setiawan]

this warning i have seen in many DV camera's manual.

It means:
Every camera, altho using DV format/spec, have slightly different head design. More different if the manufacturer is diff. eg. sony vs jvc.

So, your DV recorded material, may not playback smoothly if played using other maker/model DV player.

i have personnaly encountered this problem, playing a miniDV from a old sony camera, in another type DV player (also sony, newer). I thought the tape was scratch/broken, but when i play again in original camcorder, the picture is fine.

so, different head design may not be compatible for your recorded material.

[Robin Davies-Rollinson]

I don't see the logic in any of this.
I use the Z1 (and FX1) professionally for broadcast work in the UK and so at the end of a shoot I have to give my tapes to the producers to take back to the edit suite. I've never had to give them the camera as well - neither would I expect to...
We always expect our tapes to play out on any machine.

Robin

[Martin Mayer]

BTW: The warning is on p.72 (not p.71) for the Z1E/Z1P ("PAL") version owners looking for it.

[Steven Gotz]

My guess is that it may be a typo. Perhaps they meant LP not SP.

[Hornady Setiawan]

Originally Posted by Robin Davies-Rollinson

I don't see the logic in any of this.
I use the Z1 (and FX1) professionally for broadcast work in the UK and so at the end of a shoot I have to give my tapes to the producers to take back to the edit suite. I've never had to give them the camera as well - neither would I expect to...
We always expect our tapes to play out on any machine.

Robin

Try playing a Z1 HDV tape on the XL-H1. Or vice versa. Then you'll see the logic. Altho both use HDV format, the different head design may not record exactly the same electrical signature on the magnetic tape. The difference is microscopic & minute, but it is there. You may experience block noise/dropouts because of this. DV LP mode is more susceptible for this type of problem since denser recorded signal.

The warning was just a disclaimer if you encountered something like above.

And of course, Z1 tapes will play fine on M1 players, since the head design is the same. Otherwise Sony wouldnt release them as cam & vtr siblings.

I read this kind of warning (disclaimer) in HVR-A1 & HC-3 manual also.

[Robin Davies-Rollinson]

Well, the discussion started about playing back in the DV mode, which is the format I use (even with the Z1), because that's what the broadcaster wants.
I wouldn't know about the incompatibilies of HDV - although a standard is a standard etc. etc.

Robin

[Douglas R. Bruce]

Originally Posted by Steven Gotz

My guess is that it may be a typo. Perhaps they meant LP not SP.

I thought so too, however I looked at the original Japanese manual and it has the same information.
I can't believe they made the same typo in both Japanese and English.....

[Steve House]

I may be wrong and don't have any experience with the cameras but I was under the impression that the Z1 and FX1 record using the DVCAM specs instead of standard miniDV when in SD mode? At least that's what the specifications in the back of the manual state. Perhaps that's the reason for the warning as some miniDV decks and cameras have problems with DVCAM format tapes.

[Colin Pearce]

Originally Posted by Steve House

I was under the impression that the Z1 and FX1 record using the DVCAM specs instead of standard miniDV when in SD mode

No. The Z1 has three recroding choices - HDV, DV SP and DVCAM. The FX1 (and the HC1) have a different 3 choices - HDV, DV SP and DV LP.

[Boyd Ostroff]

My take on this is a little different... I think they may be trying to say you should use DVCAM to record standard definition, because that way you would need to buy a Sony deck or camera to play it back not to mention the fact that you'd use 50% more Sony tape ;-)

[Matt Davis]

Originally Posted by Boyd Ostroff

trying to say you should use DVCAM to record standard definition, because that way you would need to buy a Sony deck or camera to play it back not to mention the fact that you'd use 50% more Sony tape ;-)

Spot on - and just to clarify, DVCAM was 'invented' to tidy up the compatibility issues of DV between camera and deck - especially those decks that get hammered in a professional environment. Faster speed made for wider track spacing, and a little more slack in the acceptable accuracy stakes.

My old PC-7's manual warned that if recorded in Long Play mode, only my PC-7 would reliably play it back.

[Hornady Setiawan]

yes, a standard is a standard...

yet early adopters of a standard, may not 100% compatible with other makers, altho using the same standard.

we rarely see this problem Now in DV standard, but in early days of DV, this problem happens, especially in LP mode...

Now is early days of HDV, so, expect incompatibilities out of different makers. Z1's head design is new, to conform to HDV, yet it is also designed to be compatible with DV, that's why they put the warning, that's why we see this warning in the new HDVs also like HC3 & A1, because their head design is the same, and may not be 100% compatible with other brands.

Not only in HDV, but in other new standards like: HD-DVD format, MPEG4 / WMV desktop players, new standards are prone to incompatibility.

[Heath McKnight]

I looked at the manual, and it seems to talk more about mixing DV and DVCAM (and HDV) on one tape, that can cause problems. If you're shooting in multiple formats on the Z1, use different tapes.

heath