Tim can you address the issue of gain. How do these compare as the gain is increased to the point where they are not usable? Can the new CMOS technology use just a little gain to get ahead. From the samples 3db might just do it?
Ron Evans

Tim, thanks for posting those screen grabs. That is pretty amazing.

Here some more grabs with almost no light. The noise is bad in both cams (18 & 21bd of gain, what do you expect) I'll try and check to see when the noise starts to get bad in the FX this weekend.

http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/members/t...cture151-1.jpg

http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/members/t...cture152-2.jpg

http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/members/t...cture153-3.jpg

I think you got me with this examples this is what I was waiting for to make my desicion on wich camera to buy since Ihave the fx1 I will be buying the fx 1000. Do you know if this fx 1000 will use the same type of battery (series L)? yhank you so much for the footage Monday I will be getting my christmas present, (an fx1000)

Juan, the FX1000 does indeed use the "L" Infolithium battery. Thank you Sony.

Juan, you won't be disappointed. I always ran the VX in manual, but so far I'm real inpressed with auto in the FX. You can set the auto gain to -7 so that will keep the gain down. I almost always had to turn the gain down one or two clicks from auto on the VX. You also have a setting to adjust the gain to "slow", so you don't have those abrupt changes in exposure. I really won't no untill I use the FX in real world (wedding) and edit the footage, as to how good this cam really is.

thanks tim, Now I have a question. I was browsing the web trying to find the best deal on this camera (FX1000) and I found it on -------- ----- for $ 2600. I think that this is a pretty good deal. have any of you bougth any thing from this web site? is this place legit I heard of some web sites giving you great deals and turn out to be a pain and fraudulent. please any advice! and thanks again

Run, don't walk, away. A quick Google search will reveal why.

You aren't kidding. Most of those sites are all owned by the same company under different names. The wonderful thing is, I've seen official google and youtube ads promoting them as trusted dealers.

I purchase all my gear at B&H Photo.

Juan, it is common for many of us who are new to purchasing camera gear online to find places similar to the one you mentioned. The lucky ones find out before they have an unpleasant experience.

When shopping for camera gear, I suggest you always check the prices at B and H first, because their prices are usually as low as it gets.

Sometimes you can find some items cheaper, but if a dealer is reputable their prices are not going to be more than a few dollars cheaper, since B&H sells for about as low as is normally possible.

yeah I've seen the price on b&h photo and is $3200.00. and this is the place where I purchased my fx1 and 1000u...... but since I saw this same company advertaising on my videomaker subscription I tough this is probably a trusted place but who knows. I think is better to spend few hundred dlls. more and to have a piece of mind . what I was thinking!!!!

You were thinking you would like to save a few hundred dollars, of course!

Some of the questionable places actually do not rip you off exactly, but will try to upsell you.

This is how I've read that it works:

You place your order, everything will appear fine, then you get a phone call. They will tell you they are sorry but the item you ordered is not stock, but that they will have a "kit" available that includes the item you want plus a bunch of accesories at some supposedly great price.

Lets say you go ahead and buy it...well it turns out the extras you purchased are all junk and not worth nearly what you paid.

So technically they do not rip you off. And there might be consumers who cannot tell the difference.

I've had heard that often you can get your money back, but it can be difficult and time consuming.

Thanks again jeff, I Will buy this camera on b&h photo I just talked to them and actually got a pretty deal!!...... merry christmas to all of you... I know I will be Happy with my new camera fx1000.

Have any of you know if this new compact flash recorder from sony will be compatible with the fx1000.

I think this will be an awesome add on for this camera and the ability to record without tape, Im just thinking if the on camera record button will actually send any kind of signal to the recorder without using the recorder itself

thanks for all the information once again

Not sure if it will mount on directly as it will with the Z5 but it will definitely work through the firewire connection.

thanks, if somebody has tried to use this two things together please post some information I just want to make sure I can record without tape on the camera and using the on camera record buttton to manipulate the compact flash recorder. thanks again

sorry for some of the errors on my writting as this is my second language grettings from the mexican videoguy!

I was reading in the canon a1 blog that this same recorder will be able to sync with the canon, and you are able to record to it using the record button without tape to me that is wonderfull

Since this is possible from a canon camera I think that this sony fx1000 should do it also don't you think?

FX1000 and filming sport
 

Tim

Mate I am in Australia and just wanted to thank you for posting the still pics. I am really excited about getting my FX1000 that arrives here in Tasmania on Tuesday.

I have held off buying a HD cam having wanted to wait until all the specs were good for me.

I film alot of sport and dance concerts and have been so happy with my Panasonic DC-62 (shoulder version of DC-30. Great in low light, nice pics and 16X zoom plus the zoom control was as quick as many pro cameras.

Can anyone tell me what the zoom speed is like on the FX1000?

Also is the rolling shutter an issue in Standard definition as this is what I will still be recording alot of my footage in.

I have heard that doing quick pan even on a tripod can make the footage look weird. Again is this in HD but not a problem in SD?

Thanks for all the advice.

Regards


Martin Duffy
Duff TV - Hobart Video and DVD Production, Online Video Specialists

Zoom speed is good and the rocker is smooth, very nice. The 20x zoom is fantastic.

You will have issues with quick pans. The rolling shutter is a result of the CMOS, so it will be an issue no matter what.

The auto focus can be troublesome with this cam, but mostly is fine.

If there is a better alternative at this $3200 US, I'd like to know what it is.

"If there is a better alternative at this $3200 US, I'd like to know what it is."

The Panasonic HMC150. A cleaner image. XLR audio. Tapeless on cheap media. Better balance and lighter. Only $100 more (Amazon has it for $3299 at the moment). A far better warranty (3 years!). No rolling shutter. Independent control of the audio channels.

I recently bought both cams. If I had it to do all over again, I would forego the FX1000 and buy 2 HMCs. I may eventually sell the Sony and buy another Panny. For me, the only real advantage for the Sony is its zoom. 20x is great. Keep in mind this is coming from a guy who's shot nothing but Sony since the mid-90's.

Hi Norman, which one has better low light? which one has more vertical smear when shooting into bright light? When you said cleaner picture, is this with no gain? if you put both on 6db gain does the Pany has cleaner picture or brighter picture? Do you mind posting some pict under low light at 0db, 6db and 12 db?
Thanks.

Yes Norman, how is the low light? I'm in dark areas a lot. How does your footage match up with the Sony? I do not see tapeless as an advantage, but would be glad to have the ability to record to both simultaneously would be great.

Never mind Norman, I found your post....Khoi, go here:

http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/archive/i.../t-138345.html

The FX1000 is definitely brighter. At 6db gain, I can't tell much difference in the noise. When you bump it up to 12 db, the Sony is still brighter than the Panny but with slightly more noise. The FX has better detail. Here are a couple of stills from both cameras at 6 db. To make the comparison as fair as possible, the DRS (dynamic range stretch) on the Panny was turned off and black stretch was off on the Sony.

I pointed the Panny directly at 3 light bulbs on my office ceiling fan and couldn't get it to smear.

http://www.gaddisvideo.com/Pan6db.bmp

http://www.gaddisvideo.com/Sony6db.bmp

All things considered, I think the HMC is a better value.

Yeah thanks for the still, I would go with the Pany if it has 20X zoom and as low light but I shoot in alot of big church and 13X will not be enough, and I'm sure AVCHD even at 17Mbps is better than HDV at 25Mbps because it is twice as effecient, can't never get a perfect camera. )-:, We need something like Canon 3CCD 20X, with same low light as Sony FX1000, but shoot with AVCHD on the SD card.

I understand, Khoi. There will be situations where I'll opt for the FX1000 as my main camera as opposed to the HMC, especially when the longer lens is needed.

I think Sony made a huge mistake by not configuring the FX1000 for the CF recorder to mount on the back just like the Z5. I realize they did this to increase sales of the Z5. However, just think about the thousands of CF recorders they could sell if it were dockable to the FX1000 without having to use a firewire cable.

Norman, thank you very much for taking the time to post stills.

Very nice performance from the Panny. I am definitely jealous of the XLR, but not of the tapeless (that is just preference on my part).

The Panasonic is most definitely a ton of camera for the money.

I have a wedding Sunday and have not used my FX1000 hardly at all, and have played with it almost none.

Can you clue me in on usage of the black stretch feature?

When do you have it on and which setting do you use? (I seem to recall there were a couple of settings for it on the menu but I forgot what they are).

Do you turn it on a and just leave it? Or do you use it only in darker environments?

Thanks in advance for any input.

Bear in mind that I got my camera a week after you got your's, so I'm by no means an expert. I haven't shot any events with it yet, just played with it. The black stretch feature brightens dark areas of the image (reduces contrast). I'll only use it when shooting in low light. You'll find it in the "picture profile" menu. It also has a "compress" setting that crushes black (darkens black areas, increases contrast).

I plan to set up at least 3 picture profiles on both of my cameras:

1) for shooting in low light

2) shooting indoors with good light

3) for shooting outdoors in daylight

Norman, the brightness of the two images is closer than I would have expected. The FX1000 is slightly better with lower light, it seems, but I expected to see more difference.

But I noticed one other thing and it might not be that way on your video. It seemed like there was some sort of noise on the HMC150 frame grab where there is black lettering on a white back ground. I zoomed into the small Antacid printing on the Rolaids bottle and it looks like there is something abnormal there. Maybe it is a result of the codec. Or just the screen grab. I don't know. Is it my feeble eyeballs or is there really something there? It looks like what used to be called "black clip" back in the old NTSC 4 x 3 days where the equipment was reluctant to switch rapidly from black to white and back again and you would wind up with a funny pattern on the edges.

I believe the chips on the FX1000 would lead to a higher resolution image than the Panasonic. Blowing up the image might just reveal this difference. I agree that the FX1000 image seems to be higher resolution with less edge artifacts. The Panasonic is great value though since it really has to be compared to the Z5 so may be $1000 cheaper!!
I just wish Sony had an AVCHD version of the Z5/FX1000 with hard drive and flash memory recording.
Ron Evans

It could be the conversion to the Canopus HQ codec. I edit with Edius and my PC doesn't have the horsepower to edit AVCHD natively, so I converted the Panny's original .mts file to the Canopus HQ codec, then created the still from the Edius timeline.

Tomorrow, I will import the native .mts clip into Edius and make a still from that to see if there's any difference.

Bear in mind that even after spending a grand more for the Z5, it's still not tapeless. You have to pony up $850 more for the CF recorder.

I thought that it was included in the package.

Stelios

It's included with the Z7 but not the Z5.

Shallow depth of field
 

after watching the demo vids here

Sony | Micro Site - HDV

Am I correct in saying, it looks as though you don't need an 35mm adapter to acheive shallow depth of field?
After watching this it makes me want to switch from my XH-A1 to the Z5.... Incredible.

With the 20X lens, you can get shallow shallow depth of field if you are far enough to zoom in, but they said something about round shutter leaf in the camera that is doing it, don't know.

20X v 13X zoom.
 

[QUOTE=Khoi Pham;976471]Yeah thanks for the still, I would go with the Pany if it has 20X zoom



Hey I am in the same boat. (THis is a post I posted on the Pansonic 150 discussion board)

I wonder if there is a 1.4 lens or similar for the new 150 Pana Camera. I am considering buying the Sony FX1000 mainly due to its 20X zoom which is great for me as I film a lot of sport. That camera also has a wonderful very fast zoom speed critical for "getting in" very fast".

I was appalled at the last Panasonic HD cam (whatever it was) as it had the slowest zoom on earth!

Obviously the new Panasonic is not tape based which sounds appealing but the 13X lens to me is very off putting.

My past experience with tele lens' is that anything past a 1.4 tele gives you the black ring when on a wide shot.

On my Panasonic DVC-62 (52mm i think) and Sony TRV900 (43mm) I have used a Sony 1.4 lens and don not get the black ring. The 1.4 just gets you in there and makes a big big difference to the impact of how gootage looks.

If I thought there was a 1.4 or 1.5 lens that did the job on the new Pana 150 then I might go for it as I can see its a great cam, very light and no TAPE!

What is the mm of the lens?

There seems to be a bit of paranoia about using the card system. Surely any professional video guy would be transferring to hard drive and then transferring to another drive as a further back up.

Hard Drives are cheap these days.

Khoi....I am with you on this matter. I can just hope for a Canon 3-Chip with the light sensitivity of the EX-1 and 3 Sony models. LOU

The best situation would be for Canon to use the best attributes of their current video-capable D-SLR chip and build a true video camera around it. Its my suspicion that that is what Canon is working on and why the XHA1 got a relatively mild makeover recently - the next camera in that price range will be drastically different and substantially better.