Nothing NEX at CES, but 1080p60 is coming at
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Sony NEX-VG10 / VG20 / VG30 / VG900
Interchangeable lens AVCHD camcorders using E-Mount lenses.

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Old January 6th, 2011, 04:52 AM   #1
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Nothing NEX at CES, but 1080p60 is coming

Now that we know Sony can build a 1/2-inch back-lit CMOS that runs at 60p for 1080p60 AVCHD video in a CyberShot, will there be a much better VG10 in the future -- or when this chip arrives in Super35 size it will be used to provide 1080p60 the the NXCAM at its initial 2011 shipment or in version 2 in 2012?

One thing seems likely, Sony isn't going to give us a $2000 version of its $5000 camcorder.

So if they won't give the VG10 anything too close to the coming NXCAM, is there really any point in a new model when a firmware update would do the job.

Unless, of course, Sony wants a NEW model. One advantage of a new model is it is a way of reducing price without admitting the VG10 was priced too high. A new model is also a way of making a physical change such as adding another button or switching to a back-lit chip.

Another possibility is that Sony will wrap VG10 video functions into the NEX-7. Now a single camera would compete with the GH2.
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Old January 6th, 2011, 07:03 AM   #2
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Well based on Sony's History there was always the pro version of a camcorder and the consumer version of it. FX1/Z1 FX1000/Z5 AX2000/NX5 and now the S35 NXCAM/??? One thing interesting though is that there was no consumer version of the Z7 though the Z5/FX1000 used the same chips. All we can do is wait and see come NAB. One promising thing is that Sony has finally put 24P/60P into the consumer cams. If or when the NEX-VG10 gets a refresh it should have the frame rates in it.
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Old January 6th, 2011, 04:00 PM   #3
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Whatever they do, they better take a look at the new Canon at the $2k price point... lots of compelling features, and while not an "interchangeable lens" camera, for many users with a set budget, the Canon would sell over the VG10, IMO!

Sony definitely has higher rez video capable still sensors coming down the pipeline, but it's interesting that Canon went to a LOWER pixel count optimized for video. There's a definite conflict, both feature and image quality wise when you're trying to get a single sensor to do double duty.

Considering all the "new" consumer cams do both 60p and 24p, Sony REALLY should consider issuing firmware upgrades to their earlier cameras to enable those and other features on the "old" cameras. I'm 99% sure they aren't building new processors/chips, but just "feature creeping" down the road as they feel market demands dictate. That "strategy" really does get frustrating to the end user!
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Old January 7th, 2011, 02:25 AM   #4
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You had it right Dave "feature creeping". Sony are a master of this and they have subjected people with a real need like myself to patronizing them as sometimes there really has been no alternative.
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Old January 7th, 2011, 02:17 PM   #5
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Before heading to CES on Sunday I decided to go look at a bunch of different cameras. My conclusions:

1) even as a still camera most of them feel horrible. Buttons littered on the back and top and menus from hell. Only 6 controls are needed to shoot pictures--ISO, WB, shutter, and aperture plus focus and zoom. I do not need MY color, face detection, smile detection, adult, detection, infant detection. This is the BS Japan used post war when after stealing Euro designs and being unable to actually improve on them they discovered gimmicks. Now that digital cameras got as good as they really need to be several years ago, they are adding useless gimmicks once again.

2) the best feeling camera to me was the Canon G12. But, why make a huge ISO dial since we've lived with ISO changing only when we inserted a new roll of film. Why not a shutter speed dial? In fact, why not a ring around the lens for aperture?

3) when it comes to video, talk about crippled. The G12 is brain dead offering only MF by a horrible dial and only AWB. Each camera I tried was crippled. The Nikon has a much needed ND filter, but only 1 stop. One needs up to 6 stops to keep shutter speed where it MUST be.

4) given the poor feel of the zoom on plastic lenses, can one really live without a power zoom?

Bottom-line, every company has chosen a way to cripple their cameras to be sure they cannot really compete with their camcorders. And, by not putting big chips in their camcorders, they can be sure they cannot compete with their cameras.

The Sony Cyber series with fixed lens seem to come close, but their 16mp chips are tiny and have no real ND filtering.

So while the VG10 is crippled, it is actually less crippled than most others. The problem for me is it's price and choice of a too heavy lens. This is where the GH2 is going to hit it hard from above and the NEX-5 from below. Even with a firmware update, $2000 plus another $500 to get the 1855 lens is simply too expensive. In other words, were Sony to release a more pro model, it could IMHO never justify the price Sony would charge for it.

Moreover, I think most people want to add really old lenses. So not only do we not need the 18200 zoom we don't need Sony's adaptor. In fact, since most lenses will be 28mm or longer, what is missing is a wide lens. Were Sony to bundle the 16mm that would actually be a nice CHEAPER combo. We can do this with the NEX-5, why not the VG-10? (And, since the 16mm has no zoom, that nicely takes care of that issue too.)

So for me, the issue is that there is no role for a $2000 consumer camcorder when it includes a lens I do not want. Body-only has always been possible or like the GH2 a low cost model with a kit lens. Thus, it's not really an engineering problem it is a marketing problem.
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