Re: Sony NEX-FS100 Camera Test
 

Doug,

I really appreciate your information about the FS100. I have an EX1 and and EX3, but I'm very interested in the FS100 because of the modularity. I think it'll be something I can disassemble and carry onboard aircraft without worrying about having to gate check the carryon case. (I started worrying about that a lot more when I looked out the window on one flight and saw a Delta baggage agent drop a gate-checked carryon 20 feet to the concrete ramp.) And, I have a client who is particularly drawn to DSLRs. I have a 7D and have shot a couple of things with it, but I find the frustrations of making it work like a normal video camera more than I care to deal with after 30 years of using mostly broadcast cameras actually configured to use to shoot video. So thus far I've managed to keep him happy with the EX cameras, but the shallow focus on a FS100 would help tremendously.

I started out shooting with film, then the first Sony single tube (yes, tube) portable camera when they introduced 3/4 inch decks, graduated to Ikky HL33 and 35 (camera heads larger than almost anything extant today, cabled to a massive backpack that contained the REST of the camera, and then to a separate recorder) through to 40 pound betacams and so on. (And a bonus to anyone who knows what the HL on those Ikky cameras stands for...)

My point is that today there's a plethora of cameras that are smaller, lighter, far more functional and capable of making gorgeous images than at any time, ever. I'm not interested in how many pixels can dance on the grave of Zippy the Pinhead; I'm interested In how the image looks to my client, how the camera handles in the real world, and does it fit my needs. Wish I had been at NAB to see it in person, but I certainly will check it out in person as soon as Sony releases it. And thanks for the info.

Re: Sony NEX-FS100 Camera Test
 

Hi Steve, I have to ask you why do you keep commenting on this camcorder? Why not just wait for the VG20 as you said and leave this camcorder be and those who are interested and will buy it purchase it. I get you feel Sony is not being truthful with the sensor etc. your point is made. Just move on and allow those of us interested in the camcorder to enjoy talking about it. Thanks Steve

Re: Sony NEX-FS100 Camera Test
 

Are you kidding me? NAB is right there in your own backyard for four whole days and you can't bother yourself to go over and have a first-hand look at the camera you are constantly ranting about? You would have spent about 1/10th as much time actually looking at the camera as you do speculating about it. I think that speaks volumes. If you don't like the camera, fine. If you don't want to invest in the camera, fine. But please, the rest of us would appreciate if if you'd dial down the rhetoric a bit. You certainly had the chance to go and evaluate the camera first-hand and you chose not to.

As John says, we don't really care about the technical details of the camcordder or whether or not this camera is really a $100 consumer camera masquerading as a professional camcorder. We care about what we can do with it, and whether it will earn money for our businesses better than other camcorders out there. That's the bottom line that counts. I don't care if the camera has a billion pixels or a a thousand. What difference does it make? The camera's images speak for themselves, but some people apparently can't be bothered to go take a look.

And nobody I know in the business gives a hoot about E-mount or Alpha lenses. We don't care. Every professional I know has Nikon, Canon, or PL lenses. Anything else is non-standard, so I fail to see any reason to go on and on ranting about E and Alpha lenses. Nobody I know is investing in those lenses. We don't want those lenses and most of us don't care one bit about auto-focus or auto-iris. We never use them. The FS100 is a professional level camcorder and should be evaluated as such, and on that level, it is a killer camera. I know because I've actually seen it with my own two eyes. Ask anyone who made the effort to visit the Sony booth.

Re: Sony NEX-FS100 Camera Test
 

The only problem is such lenses are very large, however the nearest could be:

Welcome to Carl Zeiss Cinematography
http://www.angenieux.com/file/datash...talog_2011.pdf

Selecting a camera is a matter selecting the one that has the features that are important to you or has the most of these features. However, you won't get compact, wide aperture, large zoom range lenses on these large sensor cameras, at most you'll get two of these three features.

For a built in filter system, Sony would need to redesign and give a more box shaped body that allows the filters to move up and down into position, that being the most compact arrangement. The Bolex camera has an optical block, plus a film shutter in a C mount (17.52mm), so I don't quite buy the space argument. However, it wouldn't fit in the current FS100 arrangement with its sensor and lens mount forward of the main body inside a cylinder.

In the end, can you shoot a feature film with a FS100? The answer is yes, especially if you use a Nanoflash. You're in the same position as an Epic or an Alexa regarding NDs, but not as neat as the Aaton 4k prototype which has the option of both ISO 100 and 800.

If you want to record events, 2/3" and smaller are much more sensible choices than the large sensor cameras for your A camera, especially if you want a large zoom range.

People may wait for more complete tests to see how the AF100 and FS100 images compare before making a decision on that aspect.

It's a matter of picking the right tool for the type of work you're doing. Do you need a shallow DOF to produce cinematic work? Er... no you don't. many of the most cinematic films don't have it.

DOF & beauty

It's a matter of how you use your tools.

Re: Sony NEX-FS100 Camera Test
 

I went to those booths that had camcorders I was interested in: Panasonic, JVC, Arri, and RED. Sorry, but Sony had nothing interesting other than the F65 -- which alas has been true for years.

You keep thinking that looking at demo video and playing with a camcorder for a few minutes is going to increase a person's interest. Once Sony decided to build a camcorder without built-in ND filters -- and Panasonic did -- based upon far more experience than you have with the ND-less NEX family, as I said earlier, it was off my list. And, were had it been on my list -- I'd get one from Sony. No need to visit the booth.

Just as one hopes you are posting because you want to share your postive experience with NEX some cameras, I'm here to share my negative experience with some NEX camcorders.

"And nobody I know in the business gives a hoot about E-mount or Alpha lenses. We don't care. Every professional I know has Nikon, Canon, or PL lenses. Anything else is non-standard, so I fail to see any reason to go on and on ranting about E and Alpha lenses. Nobody I know is investing in those lenses."

What a great quote in support of the F3, but totally off the point when talking about the FS100 given that the entire FS100 pitch is for the E-mount system.

I'd be interested to know how the picture of the FS100 compares to the F3 using an 8 bit nanoflash?

Sort of thinking more how I could use this camera to compliment my EX1 and actually problems like moireing or 8 bits etc could be offset by the out of focus background and having a slightly lower resolution on mid shots and closeups usually of people may actually be a good thing and not noticeable unless in a theatre anyway.

Re: Sony NEX-FS100 Camera Test
 

The reason I use this forum is to try and make an informed and justified decision on what for me is a very big purchase and one that needs a lot of consideration in an ever changing market.

I want to give this camera every chance to prove its mettle and potential usefulness to my purposes as a DP and film maker. For me todays cameras are already at a high enough standard and produce fantastic pictures.

But thats not where I'm at. In todays world of matchmoving CGI and image manipulation then for me at least 10 bit uncompressed aquisition is a desired goal and something the EX1 has set the standard for. Anything new has to top this and has to be at the same level or better.

The FS100 has nice bokeh as standard but can it deliver to EX1 standards. Thats why I ask questions and I'm sure to its the same for others here.

I love the idea of this camera as a DP but I have to be sure that an investment of this size is right for me. I've read the review by Nigel Cooper who measures its resolution at 780 lines also some doubt cast if this is the same chip or/and the same image as the F3. Doug really rates the camera and image so I'm hoping to hear more about this and be persuaded by what to me had the potential to be a dream camera.

I think there are many who want to love this camera but will be disapointed by the lack of ten bit out and how it processes the image etc. The one thing that would have made this camera to my shopping list.

At this moment in time I'm erring on the side of the EX1 with letus as brilliant all rounder that still trumps the big chip consumer market. But I'm also intrigued by reports of the camera's abilities and look forward to hearing more.

Re: Sony NEX-FS100 Camera Test
 

There are other than aesthetic reasons for shooting short focus

eg

1 its cheaper to light F2.8 than F8

2 to blur out cheap sets, not everyone has a big set design budget

3 ...

Re: Sony NEX-FS100 Camera Test
 

Features usually don't light up to f8 unless it's a VFX, they usually go no more than f4, f2.8 is even more common, but you do still get a fair background detail at that stop, especially on the wider shots, With high speed sensors, you don't need much light for f2.8, commonly you end up putting on ND filters to get that stop because you have to balance the lighting with exteriors etc..

Art direction is a key part of any movie, just blurring it throws away a huge amount of the visual sub text. Why do HD when your sets are of SD quality? I know the answer, budget, but it was one of those things that tended to be passed over in the rush towards HD. It's also the thing that makes a big difference when you're looking at a film.. You have to use the DOF that's right for your story, not just the one fit all DOF.

Film noir was a work around for not having sets and other resources, so shallow DOF is not the only method..

Re: Sony NEX-FS100 Camera Test
 

In the first half of Scream 4 (out now) there was in my opinion too much shallow DOF. It can really get on my nerves if overdone. I liked the movie though. :) Last years "Monsters" shot on an EX3 with a DOF adapter was so shallow for soooo long that it actually effected my view on the movie itself. It was just too distracting.

Re: Sony NEX-FS100 Camera Test
 

I find the FS100 to be a very exciting camera and was looking forward to reading this post. But the more I read the more irritated I got.

Doug has used and shot beautiful images with this camera. Just look at the demo reel he has shot posted in another thread. I have only seen it online, but looks good to me. So why anyone is claiming otherwise and going at him again and again is beyond me. Seriously. Give him a break. He is interested to share his knowledge with us. And you should be grateful.

I remember when I started out. My very first camera was a VHS- C model from Orion, with a record button, an on/ off button and manual zoom. That was it. And I was happy with it. That was many years ago, however. But I worked hard, filming weddings for friends and family and made good money. Then I moved on. Today we are swamped with wonderful cameras and still complain?

Doug, thank you for sharing your knowledge with us. I am very grateful you are taking your time. I live in Norway and am not able to come to NAB.

Internet and technology however is a wonderful thing.

Re: Sony NEX-FS100 Camera Test
 

What an engineer calls "techno babble" is argument based on supposition rather than facts. The old instruction for professional engineers: "in argument clearly differentiate between 'I know' and 'I think'."

Re: Sony NEX-FS100 Camera Test
 

Atomos hardware supports HDMI 1.3 and uses well-respected chipsets. HDMI 1.3 supports 10-bit and even higher bit-depths. ProRes is intrinsically 10 bit.

Dave Shapton
President
Atomos EMEA