x10 versus PD150?
 

Okay, I did this thread in the x10-biased x10 companion forum, so now I'd like the pd150-biased responses :)

Which is better, the x10 or 150? I'm looking to buy one of these in the very near future.

My testing of a vx2000 and trv950 (the baby-brothers of each camera) to me reveal the video quality in "good" lighting is indistinguishable and so for all intents and purposes, identical.

My intentions for either camera: independent filmmaking

My personal likes/dislikes for each:

pdx10:
* 16:9 native CCDs
* lower price
* utilizes the InfoLithium M battery and 37mm filter size, therefore I can use my current 1CCD cam's extras (battery, wide and telescopic lens adapter, filters, etc) on this cam
* no debate on this cam's XLR quality...aka no one says there's a hiss in the audio with this cam, unlike the pd150

pd150:
* better low-light resolution (low lux)
* more manual controls (ie independent Gain and Iris control vs. a combined "Exposure" control)

I'm not really considering the baby-brother versions because I want as much manual control as possible.

So...am I focusing on the wrong things? Give me any thoughs/advice. This is a big purchase after all. The PD150 costs extra for me if I want to get a wide angle (at least) and long-life battery too.

Thanks,
Derek

I shoot a lot of scenes from movies for the local Community College acting for TV class and I supply a camera for the work. For quick and dirty work, I use the PD150.

For the student finals, where we care how the finished look will, well, 'look,' I use my DSR-300.

If you are going to take a deliberate approach to the mechanics of making a picture. That is you are going to create a good setup, good lighting, careful blocking of the actors, then my take is that neither camera is the best choice for your application.

Why?

A camera with better characteristics is just hundreds of dollars more. Several cameras as a matter of fact.

What are those cameras?

JVC DV500/550, the Panny 200, the Sony DSR-300 or good used versions of these cameras.

Why?

Much better control. Control you will want when you make a film. Control over gamma response, black and white compression, skin tone detail control, and very good viewfinders with superb focus capabilities.

Much better picture resoluton. The 'cheap' lens that comes on these cameras is better than the lens on the smaller cameras. The ability to see the leaves on the trees in long shots is nice. Just the ability to do a rack focus is wonderful and just about impossible with the smaller cameras.

Better picture quality because of the image processing going on inside the camera. And the CCD block is of higher quality to start with.

Better sound all the way around.

Cost?
Last I looked, a DV500 with lens was selling in the low $4K range. Used they tend to be down around $3-$4K with batteries.
I purchased a used DSR-300 for $3500 not too long ago.
There are lots of good cameras out on the market as the marginal studios go under. You have to be careful but there are good cameras available for very little money.

I shoot with a PC110, a PD150, & a DSR-300. With out a doubt, except for very low light situations, the DSR-300 creates a noticably better picture.

Don't forget that if you blow your work up to 35mm, every defect in the picture gets magnified too. Corner-to-corner sharpness will become an issue at that point.

That said, the equipment just doesn't make as much difference as the story you are going to tell. Worry about equipment after your film has been picked up for distribution at Sundance and you are ready to make the next one with a $3 million budget for Lion's Gate. Then you can shoot with real 35mm film or HD video.

A friend of mine made his first movie for $7K with a GL1. It was distributed by Tom Cruise's distribution company. Then Lion's Gate gave him $3 million to make Narc which is currently in the theatres. Now he's got $120 million money to make the next film with Harrison Ford.

As I keep telling myself, it's the CONTENT, stupid (me, not you).

And if I had to chose between the camers you mentioned, I'd take the PD150. Better control and the picture quality is almost certainly better if you put it all to a very rigorous test. The 150 has the separate manual zoom control and that is worth a lot when you are trying to frame a shot precisely or need a smooth, not jerky start & stop to a zoom. BTW, the pro lenses have a smooth start and stop.

Ewa Marine Bag For PD150, any suggestions?
 

I've seen this waterproof bag system for the pd150 but have not heard anything about how it really works with the PD150. I will be needing a waterproof housing of some sort for my new camera for use in shallow rivers. Max depth would be 3 feet. Have any of you used any of the products out there, and how did they work? I have doubts about the bag system but its light and is a bit less expensive then the solid housings. It would be nice if the bag had some kind of underwater mic.

Thanks for the help,
Todd

I've used Ewa Marine bags for still cameras and they work fine. They keep everything dry. If your only going three feet you should not have much problem. You might want to try several different white balance settings. I'm not so sure AWB is going to give the best results underwater.

2nd Hand PD150 - What to look for
 

I am thinking of buying a 2nd hand PD150. I understand that somewhere there is a read out of the amount of time the heads have been used. Can anyone tell me where to access this on the camera? Also what would a reasonable amount of useage be to warrant buying a used camera - i.e. what is a reasonable life expectancy for the heads and what sort of numbers for head useage would give rise to concern?

Any other tips as to what to look for other than obvious marks, scratches dents etc. on the body?

Thanks

The hour meters are the last item on the last page of the Menu on the camera. Open the LCD and press the Menu button to open the Menus on the screen. Use the thumbwheel on the back of the camera to navigate them, pushing in on the wheel to select a function or make a choice.

DV heads require replacement somewhere between 600 and 1000 hours in normal life. Mileage may vary. I purchased a used DSR-300 with 620 hours on the heads and think I'm OK with that as I don't put hundreds of hours a year on anything but my PD150. Balance price vs the cost of new heads and you quickly know how much you want to discount (if any) for head hours.

PD150/2000 cameras can have transports that go bad even early in life. Listen to the camera when a tape is in the transport and playing. You should hear a smooth whirr. If you hear any kind of sound that is grinding or irregular, that is cause to reject the camera. Listen to the zoom. It should have a small whine but nothing more and it should be smooth at the slowest speeds.

Press the reset button which is on the control panel in a very small hole under the LCD. This puts the camera into the factory preset operation (ask the owner before you do this).

Check for bad pixels by leaving the lens cap on and placing the camera either in automatic or run the shutter speed all the way down and the gain all the way up in manual mode. You should see the salt and pepper of normal noise, not any fixed bright spots. Then look at a white smooth and uniform surface and check the visual field for any black pixels. These tests are better run with the camera on a tripod and feeding a large monitor or TV.

Call Sony's tech support that you can find here http://bssc.sel.sony.com/Professional/startpage.html and ask them when the camera was built. For this you need the serial number.

Oh yea. Try using the camera and make certain it records a clean image and that the LCD and viewfinder are OK and the camera responds to manual control input on all controls.

Ask what tapes have been run in the camera and how often the owner used cleaning tapes.

Also ask if the camera has been loaned out, rented or used by students.

Check the tripod socket and make certain it is not loose or the bottom punched out by use of an overly long screw. 1/4" or 6mm is the max screw length on most Sony cameras.

Bring the best out of the PD150
 

hi all,

May be shooting my short film on a PD150 and would like to know what are the settings that can bring the best quality out of this camcorder.

Below are some issues I though of

1) Colour intensity - Should be neutral. Its better to adjust this in Premiere or FCP.

2) Sharpness - Soft. Using the same logic as digital photo imaging, shapening of image should always be left at the last stage and in a much better software than the one in the camcorder.

3) WB - As of from a white paper

4) Auto Gain Limit - 0. The higher the gain, the higher the noise in the image. (Is it possible to use a photography light meter to meter for the camcorder when i set gain limit to zero? Is it the same as setting the ISO to a constant? If so, what is it most likely to be? ISO100? ISO200?)

5) Casette - Mini DV but shoot in DVCAM format (as suggested in the operating manual)

6) Progressive scan - should i set this on ?

7) Frame Mode - should i set this one? since this supposedly gives a "cinematic look"?

8) Audio - I know absolutely nothing about this as I am a photographer, only knows about image. Just set to the max volume during recording? Use a off camera mic? Please advise

9) 16:9 or normal - 16:9. As i still dunno where this film will be shown, 16:9 is more flexible because i only need to crop the sides if i want to achieve normal proportions. If i shoot normal and want to get back to 16:9, I have to crop top or bottom which may cut into the headspace of the foreheads on the actress.

Also, what are the equivalent focal length of the lens on the PD150 as that os a 35mm camera? eg. 28mm-80mm.

Please see if my logic on the above is right and advise on anything that I may have missed out.

Cheers

Re: Bring the best out of the PD150
 

<<<-- Originally posted by Ong Wan Shu : hi all,

1) Colour intensity - Should be neutral. Its better to adjust this in Premiere or FCP.

Good question. I usually leave it in the middle unless I want to be sure something is really saturated, like a blue sky. But I wonder if it's a good idea to punch it up a bit, because it's easy to de-saturate in post, but you can't create color where none exists.

2) Sharpness - Soft.

Experiment and see what you think when viewed on a monitor. I leave it in the middle usually. If you go all the way to soft, to my eyes it looks out of focus. Maybe one click left of center makes sense?

3) WB - As of from a white paper

May also want to tweak it one way or the other a bit in custom preset.

4) Auto Gain Limit - 0.

Sure, but it only has effect when the camera is in auto iris mode. Otherwise the manul f-stop you set stays constant

5) Casette

The quality won't be any different in DVCAM, but you're less likely to have dropped frames (which in my experience is rare anyway). It does limit your recording time however (and increases Sony's tape sales by 33% ;-)

6) Progressive scan - should i set this on ?

7) Frame Mode - should i set this one? since this supposedly gives a "cinematic look"?

Unlike the Canons, I don't think you'll want to mess with either of these... try it and you'll see why.

9) 16:9 or normal - 16:9.

This gets regularly beaten to death around here, browse through this forum, the PDX-10 forum and the Canon forums and you'll find extensive discussion. IMO, with the PD-150 you should shoot 4:3, but frame so you can crop to 16:9 in post if you think you might want to. This gives you the most flexibility, and there is no quality difference.

Some quick math: normal 4:3 is 720x480=345,600 pixels. 16:9 builtin mode reduces that to 720x360=259,200 which is a loss of 25% of the resolution. Now if you crop the sides as you suggest of that 16:9 later to get 4:3 it's really a disaster; that would be 480x360=172,800 pixels. You've just thrown away 50% of your image data... don't do it!

There is no quality loss to shooting 4:3 and cropping to 16:9 in post, you still lose 25% of the pixels just like built-in mode. Since you're unsure, why not just make some marks on the camera's LCD screen for 16:9 framing (put it into 16:9 mode and use a china marker on the screen), then shoot 4:3 and make your decision later.

1. color...depends on a) what look do you want b) how much work in post you are willing to do. Sounds like you are willing to spend some time, so leave it "neutral" as you say.

2. sharpness... come down one or two clicks. Unless you will be doing transfer to film, then check with your transfer facility.

3. white balance...all white paper is not the same white. Get a Kodak Grey Card Plus. Use either the white or grey portion of the chart to white balance. Shoot a couple seconds of the chart before each set up. This will help you in post color correction tremendously.

4. Gain...correct, no gain. the ISO for the camera has been suggested to be 320. Test this first!!!

5. Sure. Use minidv tapes, such as Sony Excellence, and record DVCAM mode. Be certain to set timecode format to "record run" and set each tape's code in sequence. Tape one = 01:00:00:00 Record "drop frame."

6&7...Absolutely not.

8...Audio. Get someone to do this for you, who knows what they are doing You cannot do this alone. Get help!

9...Shoot normal. Crop in post. Keep the frame clean!! No boom in the shots. In post, you can move the crop up or down on various scenes to improve the composition. Go to http://www.streamovie.com/vx2000.htm You can download a 16x9 mask that you place in your memory stick. You can use this to check your composition before you shoot. Then drop it when you roll. Don't waste a lot of time doing this or you will never finish.

The approximate multiplier is 7.2. The widest setting for the standard lens on the PD150 is 6mm. Multiply that by 7.2 and you get 43.2mm. Not very wide, is it? This is why everyone gets a wide lens converter ASAP. The long end is 72mm (times 7.2) equals 518.4mm.

Here is another site to help you with depth of field. http://www.panavision.co.nz/kbase/optics/calcFOVform.asp Of course, since there is no way to know exactly what your focal length is with these cameras, its of value only as an indication of depth of field. Scroll down to the very bottom of "format" where you see "1/3" video" That is the size of the chips in the PD150.

Good luck. You need it.

PD150 questions
 

I have a VX-2000 now, and I am thinking of getting a 150. We need a better second camera for weddings and other events than the one that we have now. We are currently using a single chip Canon for a second camera, which besides having a so-so picture, forces me to do a lot of color correction in post to make the video colors between the cameras more consistent. I have been struggling to get good audio at my events, and I think the added audio capabilities of the 150 will really help. I especially like the fact that the 150 allows you to have one audio channel be under AGC control while the other is set manually. That would have helped me avoid a number of audio problems that I have run into when filming with the VX-2000. I do have some questions relative to the PD150.
1. Is the black and white viewfinder a positive or a negative? I've never used a black and white viewfinder and I wonder if this would be as easy to use as a color viewfinder.
2. Will the image on a PD150 be identical to the image on my VX-2000? I'd like the colors in the video from the two cameras to be identical assuming they are properly white balanced.
3. How does the mono microphone on the 150 compare to the stereo microphone on the VX-2000?
4. Other than price, are there any more reasons to prefer the VX-2000 to the PD-150?
Any thoughts would be appreciated.

heya,

----1. Is the black and white viewfinder a positive or a negative? I've never used a black and white viewfinder and I wonder if this would be as easy to use as a color viewfinder.----

Depends on how you use your camera, if you are in auto mode, then it is just another viewfinder, but for manual use, it is a dream, it allows you to so easily focus, and really makes it obvious when using zebra patterns. It is a positive.

2. Will the image on a PD150 be identical to the image on my VX-2000? I'd like the colors in the video from the two cameras to be identical assuming they are properly white balanced.

Well they use the same internals when it comes to the video portion of the camera, unless you do some custom presets on either, they will look the same. Well perceivably the same, not every camera is purely indentical but i really doubt you could spot the difference.

3. How does the mono microphone on the 150 compare to the stereo microphone on the VX-2000?

Well the pd150 can take up to 2 stereo mics but you need to drop your audio quality to 12bit and use special software to capture it. But you can run either 1 mono, 1 stereo, or 2 mono's and have no problems. The quality will show on the quality of the microphone you choose to use, i suggest the Sennheiser ME66 with the k6 power module, although the camera does provide phantom power for you.

4. Other than price, are there any more reasons to prefer the VX-2000 to the PD-150?

No there is not, the pd150 is a well rounded camera and for its function leaves nothing to be desired. I find the vx2000 is it's ugly brother. Really though, the pd150 just finishes off the nice package that the vx2000 is.

Zac
Any thoughts would be appreciated.

A clairification, Zac.
 

(3. How does the mono microphone on the 150 compare to the stereo microphone on the VX-2000?

"Well the pd150 can take up to 2 stereo mics but you need to drop your audio quality to 12bit and use special software to capture it. ")

The above answer is not entirely correct. You need to read the Sony manual but the short form answer is you can insert add audio to channels 3 & 4 on a tape that was recorded in 12 bit mode. But only through the mic/line connectors on the camera if you wish to use it for the task. I think 12 bit mode is a waste for almost all purposes.

The PD150 will record two mono tracks in 16 bit, 48 Khz digital format just like any other digital camera. There are only 2 input connectors available and therefore you can only record 2 tracks at a time.

The on-board mono microphone is OK and with a proper switch setting, can be sent to channels 1 & 2 simultaneously.

BTW, most movie sound is recorded mono. Only special effects and really obvious off-center sound sources are sent to other than the center channel. Even surround sound (which is usually artificially constructed) normally does not have speech content.

Mike wow, i did not know that, i assumed 2x stereo = 4 channel, which knocked the quality back.

Now i know. As i generally only use a single mono mic, as i prefer the control of just 1 channel, and then doing any pick up audio after i never re-read about it.

You learn something new everyday.

Zac

<<<-- Originally posted by Zac Stein : Mike wow, i did not know that, i assumed 2x stereo = 4 channel, which knocked the quality back.

Zac,

I may be mistaken but let me expand on my first answer by defining terms.

2X Stereo is 4 channels but you, I think, believe the 150 can record 4 channels simultaneously. Not so.

The PD150 has only two mono channels of input at any given time. You can treat them as a Stereo pair if you wish. So you cannot record more than 2 mono channels (or 1X stereo ) as you record the video.

If you recorded the original audio at 12 bits along with the video, then you can go back and INSERT an additional 2 channels (3&4) at 12 bits by going through the two XLR connectors on the camera. But you have to set the menus properly to do so.

In what I consider normal operation, you can record two channels, however you wish to configure them, at 16 bits via the two XLR connectors.

I feel bad I left you hanging with your audio dilemma, Alan, so I'll try to make it up in this one.

As has been mentioned, the b/w viewfinder is way better for focusing, but plan on a bit of time getting used to it. It has to make you a little crazy if you have only been looking at color viewfinders, but remember this: most professional cameras use only b/w viewfinders. For long lens work, the b/w is a lifesaver.

The images between the two cameras will be the same, assuming the rules of proper white balance.

The microphone on the PD150 is only usable to about three feet. Therefore, it is OK for walking right up into someone's face and getting a sound bite, but it is not directional, so it picks up a lot of off axis sound.

There is only one drawback to the PD150 versus the VX2K for someone who shoots events: the PD will not shoot in LP mode like the VX. That means one sixty minute tape equals sixty minutes maximum record time. I know some event people like the longer times available with the VX2K.

The PD150 is a great camera that will serve you well. Here is a very un-official list of differences between the two cameras.

Note: These differences are listed for informational purposes only. They are not meant to imply that one camera is better than the other.

Major Differences

Black and white hi-res viewfinder in PD150

XLR inputs in PD150

DVCAM record only available in PD150

Settable timecode only in PD150

Gun metal gray exterior on PD150

Other differences

1. Gain works different on VX2; camera will increase gain in manual setting. PD150 allows user to set gain.

2. PD150 allows separate Left/Right channel audio control, VX2000 audio control ganged together

3. VX2000 has "intelligent" hot shoe, PD150 does not.

4. VX2K has built in stereo mic. PD150 has mono mic, which can be recorded on different channels at different settings for back-up purposes.

5. Can do time/date stamp with PD150, not with VX2000

6. PD150 auto stand-by (after five minutes of not taping) just stops drum whereas VX2000 shuts everything down.

7. Can do logo insert (i.e. client's corporate logo) with PD150, not with VX2000.

8. VX2K has certain picture effects not found in PD150.

9. PD150 has Noise Reduction (NR), VX2K does not.

10. Something about audio signal display.

11. The VX2K will record in LP mode for extended record purposes. The PD150 will not.

12. The PD150 can record user bit information.

I believe the PD-150 also allows you to set the black level (setup), doesn't it? As I understand it though, the only time you might want to do this would be for compatability with another camera if you were feeding a signal to a switcher during a live shoot.

Also, I don't understand the logo insert thing although I've seen it mentioned before. Couldn't you do the same thing with an image on the memory stick and "memory mix"? How does the logo insert differ from this?

Memory mix is the logo insert, Boyd.

Yes, you can setup the black level on the 150. Although most DV editing programs are set up to accept black at zero IRE.

You can't set black level with the VX2K? Well, thank you Boyd. I guess that's another one for the list, although Adam Wilt has a problem with this. Claims it is not true "set-up." You'll have to search his site for more info.

Actually I based my comments on an article that Adam wrote in DV mag recently. He says "setup" is something that would be provided on a studio VTR during dubbing, and should not be done in camera. If you don't use 0 IRE then your blacks will really be grays. But he suggested the one time you might want to change it would be if needed to match another camera if they were both connected to the same deck through a switcher during a live shoot.

<<<-- Originally posted by Mike Rehmus : Memory mix is the logo insert, Boyd. -->>>

The Vx2k does this. How is it different on the PD-150, or is that an error in Wayne's post? I only have a VX-2000...

Another item for the list...
 

I think there's one other thing Wayne. The PD-150 has a menu function that will display the number of hours usage on various internal components. The VX-2000 lacks this funtion (however it's rumored that Sony tech's can read this data using a special service remote unit).

2 more cents in the pile, i got my pd150 in january and every time i use it i am more and more impressed with it. i really like the flexibilty of the 2-XLR inputs for times that i'm shooting solo ( i added an ME66/K6 & evolution 100 ) and i think the manual control of the camera is amazing. in the middle of a 3-day intense shoot and am so pleased each day when i grab the camera and see the pictures i get.

oh yeah, to stay on topic more, i really like the b+w viewfinder for focusing. i also find it easier on the eyes then the color one.

Just recently sold my Vx2K to get a PD150 and yes the viewfinder is something to get used to since the VX2K had a nice color one, but having the VX9K I kinda got the hang of it. The logo instertion is mor ethan just the memory mix, it can also have some kind of protection, mainly used by broadcast companies, so that you don't go using CNN's camera to shoot for ABC. It can restrict or allow insertion of a logo.

<<<-- Originally posted by Garret Ambrosio : yes the viewfinder is something to get used to since the VX2K had a nice color one -->>>

Wow, I have a VX-2000 and there is no way I would consider its viewfinder "nice". The colors look lousy, it isn't very bright and the image looks really coarse. Very difficult to focus. The BW finder on my PDX-10 is (I think) pretty much the same as the PD-150, and it's much brighter and sharper. You can always use the LCD screen to check color.

One other correction to waynes post, when the VX2k is in manual exposure mode it won't alter the Gain, the difference here is that on the PD-150 you can set the exposure and gain independantly but on the VX you can't, it's only when the iris is fully open that going further on the dial will start to add gain. I hope I explained that right :)

John.

Hi,

I did come across some reviews that compares VX200 and PD-150. Although they are identical in terms optics, but the internal image processing is slightly different.

PD-150 being a more professional cam produces slightly less vivid colors than the VX2000-which is suppose to impress casual viewers.

Also, try recording on DVCAM format on DVCAM tapes (not DVCAM format on DV tape) and take a closer look. DVCAM helps preserve more details and saturation. I can't believe my eyes when I first saw the difference, especially when everyone thinks that DVCAM only delivers better reliability not better quality.

Yik, your comments are contrary to everything I've read. DVCAM stores data in the same format as DV, but should be less prone to tape errors. There shouldn't be any difference in the color saturation, etc. I'm sure Sony would like us to believe that those very expensive DVCAM tapes give better results! For that matter, they also like it when you record in DVCAM mode since they sell 33% more tape ;-) It's interesting how everyone raves about the quality of the XL-1s and DVX-100, but they record in standard mini-DV format. Sorry, I tend to be just a *little bit* skeptical about Sony's motives at times... for example their goofy floppy disk based Mavica still camera... remember, they are the biggest producers of magnetic media in the world and have a vested interest in selling you as much as possible. But don't get me wrong, I love Sony products, have two of the camcorders and a pile of other stuff.

Digital is digital. You are correct Boyd. There is no difference. I shoot both and I switch my PD150 back and forth depending on need.

Absolutely, that was my very first belief too. But when we did the experiment, indeed, we got unexpected results!

My very good friend owns a PD-150. We tried shooting in the same environment, object, lightings and settings. To our surprise, shooting DVCAM mode on DV tapes and DVCAM mode on DVCAM tapes yields different results. We were puzzled too.

That was done one month ago. If we can still find the clips, I'll post some shots for comparison.

But the differences aren't that significant and hardly distinguishable through casual viewing.

Boyd, I guess beauty lies in the hands of the beer holder, but I liked my VX2000's color VF it, to me, was much better than the grainy and hard to see especially in bright conditions 2.5" LCD monitor. One more thing to consider, though the VF is smaller in size, but because it is right up your face and close to the eye it seemed larger than the 2.5" LCD. At least using my own eyes.

Yik, this is puzzling as well because according to all logical conclusions and knowledge about the digital format that these images "captured" by our cameras are merely converted to ones and zeroes using data that is collected from the optics and CCD sensor with compression applied. If DV and DVCAM uses the same compression ratio and the same optics and same CCD then logically it should be the exact same, unless ofcourse of oneor both of two things: 1: during the data stream, some of the bits are gets malformed (as it does in digital audio production) and error correction has been used to create a form interpolation to account for the missing or error bits. 2. The tape itself has microscopic defects that may record some bits incorrectly and the DVCAM tape may have a better material to insure against this from happening or lessen the frequency in which this has happen. I suspect the latter. Can you give a detail account on what you have captured and how or even post some screen shots of the two in comparison. Another suggestion is to shoot DV in a DVCAM tape to see if you notice a difference in quality if so then it is definitely the tape (media) and not the format in which you are shooting.

DV and DVCam have heavy error correction. Small tape defects do not cause problems.

Look at a Hi-8 recording (8mm tape) and a DV recording (6mm tape) and you know that the combination of digital data and error correction is working even with a physically inferior tape format.

Sony has all the reasons in the world to tell us DVCam delivers a better picture and they don't. That should tell us something right there.

There is no picture quality difference between the two recording formats. Remember, the data format is the same in DV and DVCam. Anty true differences are in pre or post handling of the signal.

I agree Mike, but what if defects on the tape causes a one to be read as a zero by the head because it simply can not read the value. A minor defect may cause the head to read the wrong value when reading the tape.

Furthermore error correction is not an exact science it simple replaces the values according to an algorythm that it has been program to follow.

For instance streaming video through the internet. Even with an OC-12 or OC-3 connections you will intermintently receive errors in data transporting thorugh the net. This can also be caused by the errors in the interpreter on the other end as well, i.e. media player.

Error correction will replace these error bits with bits that will follow the algorythm or with zeroes. From a distance or if it happens infrequent enough these errors are dismissed by the brain, but if it is done frequently, the brain will start seeing a difference that many times we can not explain, we just know or see. That si one of the reasons why if you stream with a larger pipe the picture looks better, it is because you can stream more data at one time minimizing the frequency of the errors. I know there are others and others that are more of a factor, but this is definitely one of the issues in streaming data.

Stereo with PD150
 

How would I use my stereo microphone which has a stereo mini jack to record sound on a PD150? Would seem to me that a stereo mini female to 2 xlr males would do it. I looked at many places but nobody had such a thing.

Andrew,

I don't think there is such a thing as "a stereo mini female to 2 xlr males."

Make your audio stereo in post.

Check out this link; you'll find mini F to XLR M
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bh1.sph/FrameWork.class?FNC=CatalogActivator__Acatalog_html___CatID=4172___SID=F588D647BF0

PD-150 being a more professional cam produces slightly less vivid colors than the VX2000-which is suppose to impress casual viewers.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Did you use the same monitors?

The custom preset can be used to match the VX2000 to the PD150 via the saturation levels.

try this...
http://www.mmjp.or.jp/ippinkan/vx2000vs.htm

or this...
http://www.dvworld.com.tw/product/sony_pd150_vs_vx2000.htm

Yes, on the same monitor, same location, same light same settings.

Tested becoz that was the very 1st time using DVCAM tapes instead of normal DV tape on PD-150. Curious about the differences, we took some very close look and examinations.

I believe, in the Digital world, zero is zero and one is one. They should be exact. The only explanation to this is could it be that due to the robustness of the media, more 'correct' information is held on every inch as compared to normal DV tapes?

In other words, I believe there are rooms on every inch of the media for error and some corrective information. With DVCAM tapes and its lesser error rate, the extra bits is used to hold more precise information?

I'll post some images for your reference soon.

Does the tape in DVCAM mode move at the same speed as the tape in DV mode? I always assumed that the DVCAM tape was the same length as a DV tape, and that it moved faster, thereby yielding a shorter playing time. The advantage of this is that the helical scan lines on the tape would be more widely separated. This improves the signal to noise ratio because there is less interference from adjacent scan lines, making it easier to reliably read the tape. (Sort of like LP vs SP mode on a VHS tape). However, given that the signal is digital, the signal to noise ratio is not nearly as important as in analog recording schemes. If the read head can distinguish the 1's and 0's reliably, it doesn't matter that there may be a lot of background noise from adjacent scan lines. Hence a DV recording will be just as good as a DVCAM recording. My suspicion is that the DVCAM format was developed first, before tape and head technlology was able to guarantee reliable read performance with closely spaced scan lines. As the technology improved, the DV format was deemed reliable enough for general purpose use. This is pure speculation, but it makes sense to me. Perhaps someone can tell me if my speculation is indeed the case.

I suppose it is possible that the PD150 processes the image differrently for DV and DVCam.

The signal is digital and in the exact same data format. Therefore, all other things being equal (the supplied image) the signal is the same. There is no better error correction, S/N or any other tape-related arcana that will/can change the signal as long as the ones and zeros get recorded and can be retrieved. Or someone is not telling the complete truth about DV and DVCam data formats being equal. Again. Sony has every reason and incentive in the business world to say that DVCam has a better image. They do not make that claim because it is not true.

Look elsewhere for the difference. Perception, image processing in the camera before the tape, or something else.