DOF testshot

Carlos Moreira · November 22nd, 2007, 07:56 PM

Hello forum,

I am new here and just a few steps away to order a PMW-EX1 :-)
For me the main criteria is: How far can I get the DOF in a standard dialogue situation? Is the 1/2 sensor system that much better for that than 1/3 ?

So please If anybody could do one or two simple still shots with his PMW:

- medium close up
- close up

of a person (or something what has approx. the size of a persons head) in a room with something other (or the wall) in 2, 3 meters distance.
Iris full open, so the shallowest DOF possible can be archived.

I know getting good DOF outdoors is relatively easy, as I can use tele settings and higher distance to the actor, but indoors I am limited to work with shorter focal length.

Many thanks !

Chris Forbes · November 24th, 2007, 04:01 PM

This is setup really quick. The camera is 8 feet from the person the person is 8 feet from the wall.

Natural light 24p, 48 speed shutter, aperture all the way open. Sorry about the color I have been playing with the "picture profiles"

www.thevideodepartment.net/EX1/16005806.tif
www.thevideodepartment.net/EX1/16012201.tif

Peter Moretti · November 24th, 2007, 04:08 PM

DOF-wise alone, this camera really seems to make sense.

Eric Lagerlof · November 24th, 2007, 05:18 PM

Chris, on the .tifs, around the childs' nose, mouth and eye sockets, I see what looks like either some weird pixel stuff, or bits of makeup. Almost like macro-blocking. Is that just me or can you see it too?

Cute kid, BTW.

Chris Forbes · November 24th, 2007, 05:27 PM

Sorry about that I am pretty sure she had just finished eating a Hostess cupcake for breakfast. Mom was gone. Checking the video footage it is in the same place on her face throughout.

Eric Lagerlof · November 24th, 2007, 06:02 PM

(Note to self, don't let talent eat cupcakes right before their scenes.)
The small disadvantages to HD.

Joseph H. Moore · November 24th, 2007, 06:10 PM

Thanks for those, Chris.

How did you focus? Have you played with the hybrid focus yet?

Chris Forbes · November 24th, 2007, 06:28 PM

Actually, I don't think I have shot anything on auto focus. I have played with it to see how it works. And it works about as well as any other I have used, but I always shoot in manual focus mode. Too much of a control freak I guess. I like to know if I miss focus on a shot it is my fault.

The lens is the thing that really sold me on this camera.

Say no to servo. ;)

Joseph H. Moore · November 24th, 2007, 06:51 PM

Isn't their a hybrid mode that gives you creative control to focus manually, then the camera grabs to ensure perfect micro-focus?

Steven Thomas · November 24th, 2007, 07:13 PM

Nice.
That's great to know you can get only 8 ft from your talent and still frame a fairly wide shot with a tighter DOF. The 1/2" sensors sure makes a difference.

Steven Thomas · November 24th, 2007, 07:59 PM

Chris, I happened to notice these DOF example images looks a tad soft. This was using the XDCAM codec, not SDI, right?

Is it possible some settings may have changed that are causing the softer image. I say this since all you other stuff and footage from others looks real sharp.

Barlow mentioned the SDI stuff looks a bit soft too. Maybe a camera setting?

Chris Forbes · November 24th, 2007, 08:34 PM

Maybe, I really love to tinker. I will reset the camera to factory specs before doing anymore tests. It is amazing how configurable this camera is.

Carlos Moreira · November 25th, 2007, 02:57 AM

@Chris - thank you so much for the examples!
And congratulations to your nice daughter :-)

the DOF is surprisingly good for me and I think It is good enough to match the standard situations in storytelling, even indoors with limited space. No more need for 35mm adaptors!

If you do the math, the step 1/3 -> 1/2 should be 1 stop less DOF (equivalent), but this seems to be much more. PMW looks like super 16 mm for me.

I guess I am sold. I try to find a US Dealer now shipping to europe (bhphotovideo unfortunately don´t)

What is the biggest Iris on the PMW in wide or normal settings - 1.9 or 1.6 ?

Tom Hardwick · November 25th, 2007, 03:40 AM

The EX's lens certainly appears to be a non-ramping zoom that maintains its f/1.9 aperture (though not of course T stop) throughout the zoom range.

The 1"/2 sensors are much bigger than the 1"/3 variety - in fact they're very nearly twice the surface area at 30.72 mm2 as against 1"/3's 17.28 mm2. So this means that for any given image size you'll be using a much longer focal length. This is just what DoF freaks (like me) want and pray for. Big chips are much better in low light situations too of course.

On top of that you can use f/1.9 whenever you like, whereas all 1"/3 chipped camcorders have ramping zooms that rapdly tail off to f/2.8.

tom.

Stelios Christofides · November 25th, 2007, 04:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Carlos Moreira

I guess I am sold. I try to find a US Dealer now shipping to europe (bhphotovideo unfortunately don´t)

Carlos, just make sure that the camera is PAL for Europe

Stelios

November 22nd, 2007, 07:56 PM	#1
Carlos Moreira Regular Crew Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Spain, Barcelona Posts: 27	DOF testshot - person in a room, closeup Hello forum, I am new here and just a few steps away to order a PMW-EX1 :-) For me the main criteria is: How far can I get the DOF in a standard dialogue situation? Is the 1/2 sensor system that much better for that than 1/3 ? So please If anybody could do one or two simple still shots with his PMW: - medium close up - close up of a person (or something what has approx. the size of a persons head) in a room with something other (or the wall) in 2, 3 meters distance. Iris full open, so the shallowest DOF possible can be archived. I know getting good DOF outdoors is relatively easy, as I can use tele settings and higher distance to the actor, but indoors I am limited to work with shorter focal length. Many thanks !

November 24th, 2007, 04:01 PM	#2
Chris Forbes Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Salt Lake City, Ut Posts: 155	DOF test This is setup really quick. The camera is 8 feet from the person the person is 8 feet from the wall. Natural light 24p, 48 speed shutter, aperture all the way open. Sorry about the color I have been playing with the "picture profiles" www.thevideodepartment.net/EX1/16005806.tif www.thevideodepartment.net/EX1/16012201.tif

November 24th, 2007, 04:08 PM	#3
Peter Moretti Trustee Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Sherman Oaks, CA Posts: 1,259	DOF-wise alone, this camera really seems to make sense.

November 24th, 2007, 05:18 PM	#4
Eric Lagerlof Major Player Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Pacifica, CA Posts: 348	Chris, on the .tifs, around the childs' nose, mouth and eye sockets, I see what looks like either some weird pixel stuff, or bits of makeup. Almost like macro-blocking. Is that just me or can you see it too? Cute kid, BTW.

November 24th, 2007, 05:27 PM	#5
Chris Forbes Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Salt Lake City, Ut Posts: 155	Sorry about that I am pretty sure she had just finished eating a Hostess cupcake for breakfast. Mom was gone. Checking the video footage it is in the same place on her face throughout.

November 24th, 2007, 06:02 PM	#6
Eric Lagerlof Major Player Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Pacifica, CA Posts: 348	(Note to self, don't let talent eat cupcakes right before their scenes.) The small disadvantages to HD.

November 24th, 2007, 06:10 PM	#7
Joseph H. Moore Major Player Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 362	Thanks for those, Chris. How did you focus? Have you played with the hybrid focus yet?

November 24th, 2007, 06:28 PM	#8
Chris Forbes Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Salt Lake City, Ut Posts: 155	Actually, I don't think I have shot anything on auto focus. I have played with it to see how it works. And it works about as well as any other I have used, but I always shoot in manual focus mode. Too much of a control freak I guess. I like to know if I miss focus on a shot it is my fault. The lens is the thing that really sold me on this camera. Say no to servo. ;)

November 24th, 2007, 06:51 PM	#9
Joseph H. Moore Major Player Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 362	Isn't their a hybrid mode that gives you creative control to focus manually, then the camera grabs to ensure perfect micro-focus?

November 24th, 2007, 07:13 PM	#10
Steven Thomas Trustee Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Gilbert, AZ Posts: 1,896	Nice. That's great to know you can get only 8 ft from your talent and still frame a fairly wide shot with a tighter DOF. The 1/2" sensors sure makes a difference.

November 24th, 2007, 07:59 PM	#11
Steven Thomas Trustee Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Gilbert, AZ Posts: 1,896	Chris, I happened to notice these DOF example images looks a tad soft. This was using the XDCAM codec, not SDI, right? Is it possible some settings may have changed that are causing the softer image. I say this since all you other stuff and footage from others looks real sharp. Barlow mentioned the SDI stuff looks a bit soft too. Maybe a camera setting?

November 24th, 2007, 08:34 PM	#12
Chris Forbes Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Salt Lake City, Ut Posts: 155	Maybe, I really love to tinker. I will reset the camera to factory specs before doing anymore tests. It is amazing how configurable this camera is.

November 25th, 2007, 02:57 AM	#13
Carlos Moreira Regular Crew Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Spain, Barcelona Posts: 27	@Chris - thank you so much for the examples! And congratulations to your nice daughter :-) the DOF is surprisingly good for me and I think It is good enough to match the standard situations in storytelling, even indoors with limited space. No more need for 35mm adaptors! If you do the math, the step 1/3 -> 1/2 should be 1 stop less DOF (equivalent), but this seems to be much more. PMW looks like super 16 mm for me. I guess I am sold. I try to find a US Dealer now shipping to europe (bhphotovideo unfortunately don´t) What is the biggest Iris on the PMW in wide or normal settings - 1.9 or 1.6 ?

November 25th, 2007, 03:40 AM	#14
Tom Hardwick Inner Circle Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Billericay, England UK Posts: 4,711	The EX's lens certainly appears to be a non-ramping zoom that maintains its f/1.9 aperture (though not of course T stop) throughout the zoom range. The 1"/2 sensors are much bigger than the 1"/3 variety - in fact they're very nearly twice the surface area at 30.72 mm2 as against 1"/3's 17.28 mm2. So this means that for any given image size you'll be using a much longer focal length. This is just what DoF freaks (like me) want and pray for. Big chips are much better in low light situations too of course. On top of that you can use f/1.9 whenever you like, whereas all 1"/3 chipped camcorders have ramping zooms that rapdly tail off to f/2.8. tom.