EX1/Redrock M2 short film now online at DVinfo.net

Charles Papert · January 17th, 2008, 04:20 AM

Brian Valente from Redrock and I recently teamed up to make a short film to demo the Sony EX1 and his M2 35mm adaptor. It was an interesting project in that I worked somewhat backwards, writing a script around the layout of the stage that Brian had secured (he sent me pictures of the two existing sets on the stage and I picked one of them) as well as including certain elements that would show off the capabilities of the EX such as the 60 fps mode.

It was a short but intensive day; 3 hours of setup and 8 hours of shooting to capture some 23 setups, every one of which made in the final film. Brian did a great job of coordinating everything from the great food to making emergency pickups (viewing monitor was DOA), Mole Richardson provided their teaching stage and crew to us (finally--enough grips and electrics to get the job done right), Luis Sinabldi brought along the Carrion, his great onboard monitor; and I more than had my hands full pulling together the script, casting and shooting and directing duties.

The edit was something else; it didn't take long to assemble picture, but due to some location sound issues as well as a cast member with a heavy cold, I ended up doing a vast amount of painstaking ADR and foley.

Oh and--complete credits will be added shortly, this version is for a Sony presentation at Sundance.

Enough of the back story--here's the film.

http://web.mac.com/chupap/Films/tablemanners.html

Michael Stewart · January 17th, 2008, 07:40 AM

Awsome short, always enjoy your work. It seems that Cinevate has been having some issues with there adapter working with the EX1, no issues with the M2? Just received my EX1 2 days ago, so just putting it through the paces.

Cheers
Mike

Thomas Gregory · January 17th, 2008, 08:29 AM

Any help is greatly appreciated. I'm having trouble seeing the quicktime video. It says a file is missing for QT playback, and it is not available on the quicktime website. I get this error message alot. Any suggestions?

Tim Polster · January 17th, 2008, 09:28 AM

Thanks for sharing.

The look is very nice.

Steven Thomas · January 17th, 2008, 10:13 AM

Nice work Charles. Also, it looks like the combo works fine. Did you have any issues with this adapter combo?

Mathieu Ghekiere · January 17th, 2008, 11:52 AM

Nice work Charles. Funny story, good camerawork (love the dollyshots), a good set-up (it never became confusing at the table, which isn't easy, considering there are 4 to 5 persons, and all different axes to take in account), nice visuals, compliment to your actors also.

Best regards,

David Lorente · January 18th, 2008, 12:05 PM

First of all, the story was too funny, I was rolling on the floor since the boy appeared, so I had to watch it another time to appreciate the technical work.

Mathieu has said everything I want to say: the set-up is very well done, the actors are good, the camera work is just fantastic, as well as the editing.

In the first shot, when the focus is constantly changing from one character to another, what have you used to see and adjust the focus point? A follow-focus knob, a big external monitor, or just the camera's LCD screen and the prime's focusing ring?

Marc Faletti · January 18th, 2008, 02:33 PM

Lisa Darr! She was awesome in a short-lived but wickedly cool Fox show from the late 90s called Profit. She and Adrian Pasdar (now on Heroes) were terrific together. I always wondered what happened to her...

Jon Carlson · January 18th, 2008, 03:49 PM

Fantastic piece. Love the setup and the cinematography.

Does anyone know of a side-by-side comparison of the EX1 utilizing the native lens vs. something like the M2 with a decent 35mm lens? I understand you get closer to that elusive "film" look, but is there anything more than DOF effected?

Eric Pascarelli · January 18th, 2008, 04:08 PM

I've never tested it, but it seems that there's a film-like, very subtle halation in the footage I've seen.

The groundglass in the 35 adapters does to some extent what film does (but which Kodak has worked very hard to minimize) and overlays a soft glow on the highlights that complements the hard edges.

At least that's how it appears to my eyes.

On strong highlights this is not an effect easily achieved in post, because when speculars are clipped, the information needed to create this halation has been flattened out - it really needs to be "superwhite" to give the correct halation.

Vince Gaffney · January 18th, 2008, 04:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jon Carlson

Does anyone know of a side-by-side comparison of the EX1 utilizing the native lens vs. something like the M2 with a decent 35mm lens? I understand you get closer to that elusive "film" look, but is there anything more than DOF effected?

Phil Bloom's blog should have a piece called Piccadilly Furs (?) he used the letus and the stock lens. somewhere there's a reference to what's what. That i do not remember.

i do have the Letus and M2 and EX1. I can say that there is something aside form the DOF that feels different with the adapter. Party what Eric alluded to and partly a softer edge on the images. The letus adapter is being repaired right now, but i will try and do a side by side thing when it returns.

vince

Charles Papert · January 19th, 2008, 01:30 PM

Eric:

I did use a post filter for diffusion which really helped with the gal's look. It was pointed out to me on another board that the glow is a little disconcerting on the son's skin (somewhat "ghost-like"), which is something I hadn't thought about but the nice thing about it being a post filter is that I can dial it up and down as needed. I'm away from my project file this week so I can't tell you offhand which filter I used--might have been Nattress--but it worked out beautifully. The image with the M2 was actually very crisp and halation-free, but I wanted to soften it a bit as I lit it fairly contrasty so as not to look like a sitcom, so this was a good compromise.

David:

Your signature is quite apropos as we did go wireless for the focus technology! Because the Zeiss still lenses we used had limited markings for focus scale and a fairly short throw, I suggested to the AC that we use my Preston which would solve both issues (he could mark the disc out for each lens and use the full throw of the Preston knob). He started the shoot pulling at the camera and checking occasionally in the onboard monitor and ended up over at the large monitor. I have been finding that longtime AC's who are used to 35mm pulling are slow to embrace the use of the monitor but they are all finding ways to incorporate it into their process to double-check their work.

Eric Pascarelli · January 19th, 2008, 02:51 PM

Charles,

I actually wasn't referring to your footage, (which I admit I have not looked at yet) but to all footage I've seen with the groundglass based adapters. The halation is *very* subtle and does not call itself out, but it definitely affects, and in my opinion usually improves, the look.

I was responding to Jon who inquired about what, besides DoF, these adapters might be doing to create a film look.

Vince,

I'd love to see a side by side to confirm this. Real photography (with some strong speculars or light sources) as well as a chart with predominantly white areas and black areas.

Vince Gaffney · January 19th, 2008, 03:08 PM

my letus is in transit back here. i'll do it as soon as i get it back.

vince

January 17th, 2008, 04:20 AM	#1
Charles Papert Wrangler Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Los Angeles, CA Posts: 6,810	EX1/Redrock M2 short film now online Brian Valente from Redrock and I recently teamed up to make a short film to demo the Sony EX1 and his M2 35mm adaptor. It was an interesting project in that I worked somewhat backwards, writing a script around the layout of the stage that Brian had secured (he sent me pictures of the two existing sets on the stage and I picked one of them) as well as including certain elements that would show off the capabilities of the EX such as the 60 fps mode. It was a short but intensive day; 3 hours of setup and 8 hours of shooting to capture some 23 setups, every one of which made in the final film. Brian did a great job of coordinating everything from the great food to making emergency pickups (viewing monitor was DOA), Mole Richardson provided their teaching stage and crew to us (finally--enough grips and electrics to get the job done right), Luis Sinabldi brought along the Carrion, his great onboard monitor; and I more than had my hands full pulling together the script, casting and shooting and directing duties. The edit was something else; it didn't take long to assemble picture, but due to some location sound issues as well as a cast member with a heavy cold, I ended up doing a vast amount of painstaking ADR and foley. Oh and--complete credits will be added shortly, this version is for a Sony presentation at Sundance. Enough of the back story--here's the film. http://web.mac.com/chupap/Films/tablemanners.html __________________ Charles Papert www.charlespapert.com

January 17th, 2008, 08:29 AM	#3
Thomas Gregory Regular Crew Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Youngstown, Ohio Posts: 33	Can't see the video Any help is greatly appreciated. I'm having trouble seeing the quicktime video. It says a file is missing for QT playback, and it is not available on the quicktime website. I get this error message alot. Any suggestions? __________________ www.gregoryfilms.com (keep the faith....better yet, pass it on!)

January 17th, 2008, 11:52 AM	#6
Mathieu Ghekiere Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Belgium Posts: 2,195	Nice work Charles. Funny story, good camerawork (love the dollyshots), a good set-up (it never became confusing at the table, which isn't easy, considering there are 4 to 5 persons, and all different axes to take in account), nice visuals, compliment to your actors also. Best regards, __________________ http://productionsofthe3rdkind.com http://pr3k.com

January 18th, 2008, 12:05 PM	#7
David Lorente Regular Crew Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Cuenca (Spain) Posts: 92	First of all, the story was too funny, I was rolling on the floor since the boy appeared, so I had to watch it another time to appreciate the technical work. Mathieu has said everything I want to say: the set-up is very well done, the actors are good, the camera work is just fantastic, as well as the editing. In the first shot, when the focus is constantly changing from one character to another, what have you used to see and adjust the focus point? A follow-focus knob, a big external monitor, or just the camera's LCD screen and the prime's focusing ring? __________________ Wire telegraph is a kind of a very, very long cat. You pull his tail in New York and his head is meowing in Los Angeles. Radio operates exactly the same way, but there is no cat.

January 19th, 2008, 01:30 PM	#12
Charles Papert Wrangler Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Los Angeles, CA Posts: 6,810	Eric: I did use a post filter for diffusion which really helped with the gal's look. It was pointed out to me on another board that the glow is a little disconcerting on the son's skin (somewhat "ghost-like"), which is something I hadn't thought about but the nice thing about it being a post filter is that I can dial it up and down as needed. I'm away from my project file this week so I can't tell you offhand which filter I used--might have been Nattress--but it worked out beautifully. The image with the M2 was actually very crisp and halation-free, but I wanted to soften it a bit as I lit it fairly contrasty so as not to look like a sitcom, so this was a good compromise. David: Your signature is quite apropos as we did go wireless for the focus technology! Because the Zeiss still lenses we used had limited markings for focus scale and a fairly short throw, I suggested to the AC that we use my Preston which would solve both issues (he could mark the disc out for each lens and use the full throw of the Preston knob). He started the shoot pulling at the camera and checking occasionally in the onboard monitor and ended up over at the large monitor. I have been finding that longtime AC's who are used to 35mm pulling are slow to embrace the use of the monitor but they are all finding ways to incorporate it into their process to double-check their work. __________________ Charles Papert www.charlespapert.com

January 17th, 2008, 07:40 AM	#2
Michael Stewart Major Player Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Spokane, Wa. Posts: 445	Awsome short, always enjoy your work. It seems that Cinevate has been having some issues with there adapter working with the EX1, no issues with the M2? Just received my EX1 2 days ago, so just putting it through the paces. Cheers Mike

January 17th, 2008, 09:28 AM	#4
Tim Polster Inner Circle Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Arlington, TX Posts: 2,231	Thanks for sharing. The look is very nice.

January 17th, 2008, 10:13 AM	#5
Steven Thomas Trustee Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Gilbert, AZ Posts: 1,896	Nice work Charles. Also, it looks like the combo works fine. Did you have any issues with this adapter combo?

January 18th, 2008, 02:33 PM	#8
Marc Faletti Regular Crew Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Brooklyn, NY Posts: 50	Lisa Darr! She was awesome in a short-lived but wickedly cool Fox show from the late 90s called Profit. She and Adrian Pasdar (now on Heroes) were terrific together. I always wondered what happened to her...

January 18th, 2008, 03:49 PM	#9
Jon Carlson Regular Crew Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Reading, PA USA Posts: 61	Fantastic piece. Love the setup and the cinematography. Does anyone know of a side-by-side comparison of the EX1 utilizing the native lens vs. something like the M2 with a decent 35mm lens? I understand you get closer to that elusive "film" look, but is there anything more than DOF effected?

January 18th, 2008, 04:08 PM	#10
Eric Pascarelli Major Player Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Los Angeles, CA Posts: 498	I've never tested it, but it seems that there's a film-like, very subtle halation in the footage I've seen. The groundglass in the 35 adapters does to some extent what film does (but which Kodak has worked very hard to minimize) and overlays a soft glow on the highlights that complements the hard edges. At least that's how it appears to my eyes. On strong highlights this is not an effect easily achieved in post, because when speculars are clipped, the information needed to create this halation has been flattened out - it really needs to be "superwhite" to give the correct halation.

January 19th, 2008, 02:51 PM	#13
Eric Pascarelli Major Player Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Los Angeles, CA Posts: 498	Charles, I actually wasn't referring to your footage, (which I admit I have not looked at yet) but to all footage I've seen with the groundglass based adapters. The halation is very subtle and does not call itself out, but it definitely affects, and in my opinion usually improves, the look. I was responding to Jon who inquired about what, besides DoF, these adapters might be doing to create a film look. Vince, I'd love to see a side by side to confirm this. Real photography (with some strong speculars or light sources) as well as a chart with predominantly white areas and black areas.

January 19th, 2008, 03:08 PM	#14
Vince Gaffney Regular Crew Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Chicago, IL Posts: 146	my letus is in transit back here. i'll do it as soon as i get it back. vince