Vinten Vision 3 head

Jaron Berman · February 9th, 2007, 02:05 PM

FINALLY I picked up a Vision 3 and Miller Solo legs for myself. For those looking at this combo, here are my notes:

First, congrats. Both pieces are beyond compare in this price range.

Second, I got a Petrol PTB-1 bag, which seems like it was built for this combo, and it's one of the cheapest options in terms of padded bags. Very nice quality.

Third, between the carbon and aluminum legs, I personally found the AL legs to be stiffer. Yes, I added about a pound to my kit, but whatever. They ended up a couple hundred dollars less and with a long lens, they look stiffer. I'll try to keep them dry.

Fourth, about the head - it's fantastic. Absolutely fantastic. The only thing you gain by moving to a higher-priced head is more convenience and more weight capacity. But 22lbs is a LOT of weight. A loaded Varicam is close to 19. I'm a freelancer, and after being handed 3 sets of sticks in a row, all non-working... I got pissed and bought this combo for myself. So whether I'm on a DVX (this evening) or Varicam, I can have a perfect setup. Now that said, with larger cameras, I find that production usually has the budget to get good sticks, so it's a toss up. But for the majority of small dv/hdv/hd stuff, the Vision 3 is probably the only head I'll ever need. And even using Sachtler 18's and 25's... I have no envy. Love the Vinten!

Mark Sasahara · February 9th, 2007, 08:27 PM

Welcome to the Vinten family Jaron. :~)

I think you'll be very happy with the Vinten.

I've been getting Ronford legs for my Jib and I now have a set of baby legs and regular legs, O'Connor mounts. I also have a 150mm ball regular legs. I love ebay. Now I just need to drop $5000 for a decent head. Though I may inload the 150mm bowl legs.

John Cox · February 21st, 2007, 11:27 PM

I recently purchased a vision 3 head (and miller legs) for my new XH-A1 (2.3 kg with battery). Looking at Vinten's site, they recommend spring #2 for both the GL2 and the XL-H1 (and don't list the XH-A1). According to canon's site, the GL2 weighs 1.25 kg without battery. The XL-H1 weighs 3.75 kg with lens and battery. I'm confused why the GL2 doesn't call for a #1 and why the XL-H1 doesn't call for a #4. I followed their advice (I thought) and bought a #2 for my XH-A1 and it springs back up when you try to tilt it... springs with quite a bit of enthusiasm actually.

Please tell me I am missing something here... or is Vinten's info screwed up? I'm thinking I need to go back and order a #1 now. Silly me, I also bought a #3 when I got the #2 because I thought I might be pushing 3 kg when I loaded more gear on the camera and they rate their springs "up to" (spring #) kg. Maybe that was Vinten's strategy all along... to sell more $40 springs?

Thanks

Pete Bauer · February 22nd, 2007, 05:04 AM

I purchased a Vision 3 a little over a year ago (with which I'm very happy) and when the setup I wanted was on back order due to a manufacturing issue, the retailer (a DVinfo sponsor, of course) referred me directly to Vinten. They bent over backwards to help me out, even sending a loaner by FedEx until they could fill my order. I suspect it is more a matter of just not updating the info on their web site than a plot to sell more springs. They were obviously very concerned about customer service!

So that said, I'm a little disappointed to hear that they've not gotten around to updating their spring info. During the time I had their loaner, I had direct personal phone and email contact with a Vinten rep who happily sent me various springs (2, 3, 4) to try with the then brand-new XL H1. While I was at it I tested the XL2 as well, and reported my findings back to them by email. Too bad that info didn't make it to their web site.

Anyway, to the point. For stock cameras, the XL H1 should use the #4 spring. Of course, if you have attached other gear to your camera, you'll have to adjust accordingly. At minimum tilt tension, for me this only causes subtle drift back toward level if the camera is tilted more than about +/- 20 degrees. Not at all noticeable in normal use -- and I know I can turn away without the camera unceremoniously drooping down or pointing skyward! If I remember correctly, the stock XL2 would use a #3 spring. I haven't tried the XH-A1 on that tripod; guess I should do that.

If a vendor sold you an incorrect spring based on erroneous information, they should be willing to exchange it for the correct spring.

Mark Sasahara · February 22nd, 2007, 12:10 PM

Center of gravity (COG) plays a part in which spring you use. If your camera is low and has a low COG, then it may not need as strong a spring as you think.

With the drag set at zero, try the springs you have. Slide the tripod plate back and forth and see if that alleviates the problem. If not, then you may need the #1 spring. Be sure to lock the plate down when tillting.

John Cox · February 22nd, 2007, 05:16 PM

Raising the center of gravity certainly seems to make a big difference. My TA-100 adapter plate came today and with that added height and additional 1lb of weight I am able to balance the camera to stay put at any angle using the #2 spring and no drag.

Now the only problem I'm running into is the smoothness of the head when tilting. There is a definite sticky spot when tilting the lens down. It happens on the way down and back up at approximately 45 degrees. It is most noticable with no drag, and gets less noticable the more drag I add.

Can anyone tell me if this is:
1. a known behavior of the vision 3
2. a defect
3. me doing something wrong

Thanks again.

Pete Bauer · February 22nd, 2007, 07:30 PM

Nope, no sticky spots. If that's the case, I'd recommend having them check it out.

Jimmy Alioto · February 25th, 2007, 10:26 PM

I am looking at the Vision 3 head and Miller Solo sticks and I am wondering is their anyone using this setup with the HVX 200? If so, which springs are you using? For now, I will only have the weight of my camera, battery, camera light, wireless receiver.

Thanks, Jimmy

Floris van Eck · March 5th, 2007, 03:07 PM

So for the Canon XL-H1, would I need a #3 or #4 spring? Vinten itself recommends a #2 spring but I cannot imagine that this will work. The camera weighs 3.75kg and I have a TA-100 tripod plate (not sure how much it weighs). But if the camera springs up with a #4, it means I need a #3 probably. But I cannot imagine it will work with a #2 (judging their own specificatons).

Floris van Eck · March 5th, 2007, 03:15 PM

With which legs is everyone using the Vinten Vision 3 head? How good are the Vinten pozi-loc 75mm legs supplied in the kits? I am thinking about a Miller/Gitzo 3-stage carbon fiber tripod (Gitzo 3540XLS or Miller 1505) as they can go anywhere from 200cm to 10cm in every imaginable situation. This is not possible with regular video tripods and for documentary (which I plan to do most) and wildlife/nature I think that is the way to go.

February 9th, 2007, 08:27 PM	#17
Mark Sasahara Major Player Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: NYC Posts: 649	Welcome to the Vinten family Jaron. :~) I think you'll be very happy with the Vinten. I've been getting Ronford legs for my Jib and I now have a set of baby legs and regular legs, O'Connor mounts. I also have a 150mm ball regular legs. I love ebay. Now I just need to drop $5000 for a decent head. Though I may inload the 150mm bowl legs. __________________ Mark Sasahara Director of Photography

February 21st, 2007, 11:27 PM	#18
John Cox Tourist Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Springfield, VA Posts: 4	spring confusion I recently purchased a vision 3 head (and miller legs) for my new XH-A1 (2.3 kg with battery). Looking at Vinten's site, they recommend spring #2 for both the GL2 and the XL-H1 (and don't list the XH-A1). According to canon's site, the GL2 weighs 1.25 kg without battery. The XL-H1 weighs 3.75 kg with lens and battery. I'm confused why the GL2 doesn't call for a #1 and why the XL-H1 doesn't call for a #4. I followed their advice (I thought) and bought a #2 for my XH-A1 and it springs back up when you try to tilt it... springs with quite a bit of enthusiasm actually. Please tell me I am missing something here... or is Vinten's info screwed up? I'm thinking I need to go back and order a #1 now. Silly me, I also bought a #3 when I got the #2 because I thought I might be pushing 3 kg when I loaded more gear on the camera and they rate their springs "up to" (spring #) kg. Maybe that was Vinten's strategy all along... to sell more $40 springs? Thanks

February 22nd, 2007, 05:04 AM	#19
Pete Bauer Wrangler Join Date: May 2003 Location: Eagle River, AK Posts: 4,100	I purchased a Vision 3 a little over a year ago (with which I'm very happy) and when the setup I wanted was on back order due to a manufacturing issue, the retailer (a DVinfo sponsor, of course) referred me directly to Vinten. They bent over backwards to help me out, even sending a loaner by FedEx until they could fill my order. I suspect it is more a matter of just not updating the info on their web site than a plot to sell more springs. They were obviously very concerned about customer service! So that said, I'm a little disappointed to hear that they've not gotten around to updating their spring info. During the time I had their loaner, I had direct personal phone and email contact with a Vinten rep who happily sent me various springs (2, 3, 4) to try with the then brand-new XL H1. While I was at it I tested the XL2 as well, and reported my findings back to them by email. Too bad that info didn't make it to their web site. Anyway, to the point. For stock cameras, the XL H1 should use the #4 spring. Of course, if you have attached other gear to your camera, you'll have to adjust accordingly. At minimum tilt tension, for me this only causes subtle drift back toward level if the camera is tilted more than about +/- 20 degrees. Not at all noticeable in normal use -- and I know I can turn away without the camera unceremoniously drooping down or pointing skyward! If I remember correctly, the stock XL2 would use a #3 spring. I haven't tried the XH-A1 on that tripod; guess I should do that. If a vendor sold you an incorrect spring based on erroneous information, they should be willing to exchange it for the correct spring. __________________ Pete Bauer The most beautiful thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the source of all true art and science. Albert Einstein Trying to solve a DV mystery? You may find the answer behind the SEARCH function ... or be able to join a discussion already in progress!

February 22nd, 2007, 12:10 PM	#20
Mark Sasahara Major Player Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: NYC Posts: 649	Center of gravity (COG) plays a part in which spring you use. If your camera is low and has a low COG, then it may not need as strong a spring as you think. With the drag set at zero, try the springs you have. Slide the tripod plate back and forth and see if that alleviates the problem. If not, then you may need the #1 spring. Be sure to lock the plate down when tillting. __________________ Mark Sasahara Director of Photography

February 22nd, 2007, 07:30 PM	#22
Pete Bauer Wrangler Join Date: May 2003 Location: Eagle River, AK Posts: 4,100	Nope, no sticky spots. If that's the case, I'd recommend having them check it out. __________________ Pete Bauer The most beautiful thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the source of all true art and science. Albert Einstein Trying to solve a DV mystery? You may find the answer behind the SEARCH function ... or be able to join a discussion already in progress!

February 9th, 2007, 02:05 PM	#16
Jaron Berman Major Player Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 439	FINALLY I picked up a Vision 3 and Miller Solo legs for myself. For those looking at this combo, here are my notes: First, congrats. Both pieces are beyond compare in this price range. Second, I got a Petrol PTB-1 bag, which seems like it was built for this combo, and it's one of the cheapest options in terms of padded bags. Very nice quality. Third, between the carbon and aluminum legs, I personally found the AL legs to be stiffer. Yes, I added about a pound to my kit, but whatever. They ended up a couple hundred dollars less and with a long lens, they look stiffer. I'll try to keep them dry. Fourth, about the head - it's fantastic. Absolutely fantastic. The only thing you gain by moving to a higher-priced head is more convenience and more weight capacity. But 22lbs is a LOT of weight. A loaded Varicam is close to 19. I'm a freelancer, and after being handed 3 sets of sticks in a row, all non-working... I got pissed and bought this combo for myself. So whether I'm on a DVX (this evening) or Varicam, I can have a perfect setup. Now that said, with larger cameras, I find that production usually has the budget to get good sticks, so it's a toss up. But for the majority of small dv/hdv/hd stuff, the Vision 3 is probably the only head I'll ever need. And even using Sachtler 18's and 25's... I have no envy. Love the Vinten!

February 22nd, 2007, 05:16 PM	#21
John Cox Tourist Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Springfield, VA Posts: 4	Raising the center of gravity certainly seems to make a big difference. My TA-100 adapter plate came today and with that added height and additional 1lb of weight I am able to balance the camera to stay put at any angle using the #2 spring and no drag. Now the only problem I'm running into is the smoothness of the head when tilting. There is a definite sticky spot when tilting the lens down. It happens on the way down and back up at approximately 45 degrees. It is most noticable with no drag, and gets less noticable the more drag I add. Can anyone tell me if this is: 1. a known behavior of the vision 3 2. a defect 3. me doing something wrong Thanks again.

February 25th, 2007, 10:26 PM	#23
Jimmy Alioto New Boot Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 5	Vision 3 Head I am looking at the Vision 3 head and Miller Solo sticks and I am wondering is their anyone using this setup with the HVX 200? If so, which springs are you using? For now, I will only have the weight of my camera, battery, camera light, wireless receiver. Thanks, Jimmy

March 5th, 2007, 03:07 PM	#24
Floris van Eck Major Player Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 993	So for the Canon XL-H1, would I need a #3 or #4 spring? Vinten itself recommends a #2 spring but I cannot imagine that this will work. The camera weighs 3.75kg and I have a TA-100 tripod plate (not sure how much it weighs). But if the camera springs up with a #4, it means I need a #3 probably. But I cannot imagine it will work with a #2 (judging their own specificatons).

March 5th, 2007, 03:15 PM	#25
Floris van Eck Major Player Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 993	With which legs is everyone using the Vinten Vision 3 head? How good are the Vinten pozi-loc 75mm legs supplied in the kits? I am thinking about a Miller/Gitzo 3-stage carbon fiber tripod (Gitzo 3540XLS or Miller 1505) as they can go anywhere from 200cm to 10cm in every imaginable situation. This is not possible with regular video tripods and for documentary (which I plan to do most) and wildlife/nature I think that is the way to go.

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