Pavel&Julia wedding film, first part 8min. at DVinfo.net

Pavel&Julia wedding film, first part 8min. · September 8th, 2009, 06:04 PM

HI, colleagues!
I keep pushing a complete wedding film narrative approach.
In essence it's a documentary, with some set up shots
by a photographer, do my best not to be involved as much in a set up as I
used to do, some narrative done as pure reflection of thoughts by B&G.

Let me know what you think. It's not a promo, or a highlight, just first 8 minutes...
I will add subtitles if there's interest, to know what they say :)

"Pavel&Julia" A complete wedding film, First part By Oleg Kalyan On ExposureRoom

on my life journal ???? ?????? - ????. - "?????&????", ?????? ????? ?? 4? ?????????? ??????.

appreciate the comments..

PS also, working on mixing a self made soundtrack, together with my assistant Max we
work on writing the music, soundtracks...
I know the music is not a typical upbeat wedding track :)

Oleg Kalyan · September 8th, 2009, 11:49 PM

opinions please... well on Russian forum, I got questions,
"the bride half naked, how dare you"?
Well it was a set up shot of a photographer Ivan Smirnov,http://www.mywed.ru/photographer/vie...ile/vanhassel/
just thought it's a great documentary segment, and the bride there says "It's all for my love, my groom!", sorry if someone got a shock!

overall, if someone thinks it's a piece of cr.p, let me know, very important to know
all the opinions : )

Paul Mailath · September 9th, 2009, 06:05 AM

I thought it was terrific, I've got lots of comments but
it's late & I'm buggered - I'll write more in the morning

Oleg Kalyan · September 9th, 2009, 11:03 AM

Paul, would be great to hear your thoughts, a lot of narrative come from the B&G, does it make sense without knowing what they say.

Again, it's not a typical eye candy clip, highlight approach, and t.r.t. is rather long for the internet, so audience can get bored. I understand that.

Noa Put · September 9th, 2009, 11:40 AM

At first I thought it was weird but at the end I liked it, even though I couldn't understand what they were saying. At moments it looked a bit "rough" with all the handheld footage but since your approach is more related to documentary it makes sense to me. I think the reason why I liked it is that you make it look and feel real but you manage to give it a professional look by the way you keep it together in the editing. It sure changes my perspective in how a wedding can be captured.

Travis Cossel · September 9th, 2009, 11:47 AM

Oleg, I think the editing fits your style very well. It's not what I prefer, as I prefer a more cinematic approach, but everyone has different preferences (including brides and grooms). It's pretty difficult to comment much on the narrative since I couldn't understand anything ... and honestly I feel like most of us are missing half of what would make this a great edit because of that.

My only real comment I guess is that sometimes the coloring felt like it needed something more. Some of it felt like it was straight from the camera.

Also, some of the effects (like the use of light ray for example) felt a bit overdone at times, but I think that's just because I have a preference for a different style. I think it probably fits with your edgy, raw style.

Lukas Siewior · September 9th, 2009, 06:15 PM

I have also problem with "digesting" that piece. I'm not saying there is anything wrong with it - it's simply very different then cinematic approach. Reminds me more of reality shows. Unfortunately the music makes me feel like it's not the wedding day - it's too dark, sad :-( Some tunes reminded me intro to TV series from 90's "Twin Peaks".

But what I like is the editing, framing, camera-work, colors, effects. I only wish to be able to understand B&G.

And as far as the half-naked Bride - not offensive to me. It's their video and their day. If it's done with a taste and completes the project, then why not. But such a suggestion should come from B&G. I've seen beautiful photos of very "brave" bride - I would just leave those scenes and shots to B&G eyes only (unless they have nothing against public presentations).

Paul Mailath · September 9th, 2009, 06:53 PM

Okay - had my coffee, ready to go.

I really like the style of video even though I wouldn't do that - I'm still learning the simple clean style and I'm not ready to expirement in particular directions yet.

I don't find the bride shot at all offensive but I think she said it best "it's for my love, my groom" - not for general viewing. perhaps it would be great for a couple only version and cut it out for the general highlights that go to parents, friends etc. I guess it's really up to the bride. I'm interested in whay the photog came up with the shot, did the bride like the idea?

at 0:27 an older man is looking on (I think he's the grooms father) and it looks like he's watching the bride, that shot stood out to me, maybe because we've just seen her topless and being an old fella myself, I felt awkward.

Really like the shots of the car around 1:40, a real sence of movement, going somewhere. the camera movement seems to fit in and actually enhance the piece.

I'm not usually a fan of B&W but it really seem to fit in here and I loved the closing shot of the hands. The language barrier isn't a problem to me, I can make assumptions about the sort of things they are saying and the whole piece seems to flow and fit together well - it really is wonderful stuff.

Ken Diewert · September 9th, 2009, 07:33 PM

Oleg,

Another great piece of work.

I don't know why or how but you always seem to work with very 'open' couples, or the couples trust you, and you bring out the best in them. The bride Julia was radiant and so at ease in front of the cameras and this really makes the piece work. Personally, I didn't need to understand what was being said.

A lot of these shots could have been edited in a more typically slow, romantic style, (and compared to some of your early work, this may seem slow and romantic = ) ), but in true Kalyan style, you have added your distinctive signature to the work.

Serge Satkar · September 10th, 2009, 08:08 AM

Oleg very interesting approach thank you for sharing!

I'm one of those who can understand all the narratives and I can say that it makes viewer closer to couple's personalities.
I think the only reason for some "indigesting" of this piece that it most interesting and acceptable for quite narrow audience. Documentary, live action, reality show approach would make maximum effect on some global problem or some entertainment project or something else big audience would look with eyes wide open. So when I would do very detailed documentary film with narration, long speeches etc. I'd realize that it quite specific on audience and more suitable for close relatives and couple itself. So promo films, trailers, highlights not just the way to promote ourselves. They're the way for couple to show their wedding to wider audience, collegues, far relatives and any other people not being boring and not revealing too much of their personal life.

Imho the main thing is remembering that we shoot not particular styles or particular techniques but some reflection of the wedding day. And making all different weddings only one way steal something personal and couplewise. This is one more argument on my respect to this kind of videoproduction and wedding representation.

Oleg Kalyan · September 10th, 2009, 11:09 AM

thanks a lot colleagues, your input mean a lot, as a matter of fact, I am re editing it a bit, thanks to you.

The link is temporary made Private, thanks again, will post a reedit soon! ( with subtitles)

In brief, I am for cinematic approach, and the most important thing is creating a meaningful emotional experience. Also unique I should say!
A clipmaking approach, cutting a wedding video bits to a song is highly form oriented approach,
very often dependent on a song, soundtrack which regretfully we do not own, or produce.

Would love to talk more about cinematic approach, anyone could give a definition?

Serge Satkar · September 11th, 2009, 06:17 AM

Well, it's a very interesting theme..

I'm for balance and in most of the times doing two versions -- documentary and clip-like, representative, short-form approach. It solves many subtle problems in choosing shots, reflection of certain moments etc. No unique truth for this. And I don't want to prevail any direction in my works and vision.

My aim is shooting and directing some big and global project, I studying Hollywood practice learning many books that avail... But I don't wanna be boring if I truly guess what couple needs.. Such a thought.. So double package often is a good solution for me. Second part (documentary) is rarely becomes public. But I do documentaties of different length and mood for about 3-4 years.

Peter Ralph · December 12th, 2009, 01:01 PM

darn! it is private still? Sounded very interesting.

Cinematic wedding video: I think often it is used to mean more like a Hollywood movie than a home movie.

From the cinematography point of view it is a strong preference for closed over open framing/form - You know this distinction?

Closed: everything in the frame looks as though it were placed deliberately the shot looks professional
Open: messy "accidental" elements in the frame it looks more home movie.

September 8th, 2009, 11:49 PM	#2
Oleg Kalyan Major Player Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: MOSCOW Posts: 860	opinions please... well on Russian forum, I got questions, "the bride half naked, how dare you"? Well it was a set up shot of a photographer Ivan Smirnov,http://www.mywed.ru/photographer/vie...ile/vanhassel/ just thought it's a great documentary segment, and the bride there says "It's all for my love, my groom!", sorry if someone got a shock! overall, if someone thinks it's a piece of cr.p, let me know, very important to know all the opinions : ) Last edited by Oleg Kalyan; September 9th, 2009 at 01:07 AM.

September 9th, 2009, 06:05 AM	#3
Paul Mailath Trustee Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Central Coast - NSW, Australia Posts: 1,606	I thought it was terrific, I've got lots of comments but it's late & I'm buggered - I'll write more in the morning __________________ Cheers - Paul M. www.perbenyik.com

September 9th, 2009, 11:47 AM	#6
Travis Cossel Inner Circle Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Miami, FL Posts: 2,933	Oleg, I think the editing fits your style very well. It's not what I prefer, as I prefer a more cinematic approach, but everyone has different preferences (including brides and grooms). It's pretty difficult to comment much on the narrative since I couldn't understand anything ... and honestly I feel like most of us are missing half of what would make this a great edit because of that. My only real comment I guess is that sometimes the coloring felt like it needed something more. Some of it felt like it was straight from the camera. Also, some of the effects (like the use of light ray for example) felt a bit overdone at times, but I think that's just because I have a preference for a different style. I think it probably fits with your edgy, raw style. __________________ Black Label Films www.blacklabelweddingfilms.com

September 9th, 2009, 06:53 PM	#8
Paul Mailath Trustee Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Central Coast - NSW, Australia Posts: 1,606	Okay - had my coffee, ready to go. I really like the style of video even though I wouldn't do that - I'm still learning the simple clean style and I'm not ready to expirement in particular directions yet. I don't find the bride shot at all offensive but I think she said it best "it's for my love, my groom" - not for general viewing. perhaps it would be great for a couple only version and cut it out for the general highlights that go to parents, friends etc. I guess it's really up to the bride. I'm interested in whay the photog came up with the shot, did the bride like the idea? at 0:27 an older man is looking on (I think he's the grooms father) and it looks like he's watching the bride, that shot stood out to me, maybe because we've just seen her topless and being an old fella myself, I felt awkward. Really like the shots of the car around 1:40, a real sence of movement, going somewhere. the camera movement seems to fit in and actually enhance the piece. I'm not usually a fan of B&W but it really seem to fit in here and I loved the closing shot of the hands. The language barrier isn't a problem to me, I can make assumptions about the sort of things they are saying and the whole piece seems to flow and fit together well - it really is wonderful stuff. __________________ Cheers - Paul M. www.perbenyik.com

September 9th, 2009, 07:33 PM	#9
Ken Diewert Trustee Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Vancouver Island, Canada Posts: 1,200	Oleg, Another great piece of work. I don't know why or how but you always seem to work with very 'open' couples, or the couples trust you, and you bring out the best in them. The bride Julia was radiant and so at ease in front of the cameras and this really makes the piece work. Personally, I didn't need to understand what was being said. A lot of these shots could have been edited in a more typically slow, romantic style, (and compared to some of your early work, this may seem slow and romantic = ) ), but in true Kalyan style, you have added your distinctive signature to the work. __________________ C100, 5DMk2, FCPX

September 9th, 2009, 11:03 AM	#4
Oleg Kalyan Major Player Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: MOSCOW Posts: 860	Paul, would be great to hear your thoughts, a lot of narrative come from the B&G, does it make sense without knowing what they say. Again, it's not a typical eye candy clip, highlight approach, and t.r.t. is rather long for the internet, so audience can get bored. I understand that.

September 9th, 2009, 11:40 AM	#5
Noa Put Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Belgium Posts: 9,509	At first I thought it was weird but at the end I liked it, even though I couldn't understand what they were saying. At moments it looked a bit "rough" with all the handheld footage but since your approach is more related to documentary it makes sense to me. I think the reason why I liked it is that you make it look and feel real but you manage to give it a professional look by the way you keep it together in the editing. It sure changes my perspective in how a wedding can be captured.

September 9th, 2009, 06:15 PM	#7
Lukas Siewior Major Player Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Lyndhurst, NJ, USA Posts: 408	I have also problem with "digesting" that piece. I'm not saying there is anything wrong with it - it's simply very different then cinematic approach. Reminds me more of reality shows. Unfortunately the music makes me feel like it's not the wedding day - it's too dark, sad :-( Some tunes reminded me intro to TV series from 90's "Twin Peaks". But what I like is the editing, framing, camera-work, colors, effects. I only wish to be able to understand B&G. And as far as the half-naked Bride - not offensive to me. It's their video and their day. If it's done with a taste and completes the project, then why not. But such a suggestion should come from B&G. I've seen beautiful photos of very "brave" bride - I would just leave those scenes and shots to B&G eyes only (unless they have nothing against public presentations).

September 10th, 2009, 08:08 AM	#10
Serge Satkar Regular Crew Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Moscow Posts: 107	Oleg very interesting approach thank you for sharing! I'm one of those who can understand all the narratives and I can say that it makes viewer closer to couple's personalities. I think the only reason for some "indigesting" of this piece that it most interesting and acceptable for quite narrow audience. Documentary, live action, reality show approach would make maximum effect on some global problem or some entertainment project or something else big audience would look with eyes wide open. So when I would do very detailed documentary film with narration, long speeches etc. I'd realize that it quite specific on audience and more suitable for close relatives and couple itself. So promo films, trailers, highlights not just the way to promote ourselves. They're the way for couple to show their wedding to wider audience, collegues, far relatives and any other people not being boring and not revealing too much of their personal life. Imho the main thing is remembering that we shoot not particular styles or particular techniques but some reflection of the wedding day. And making all different weddings only one way steal something personal and couplewise. This is one more argument on my respect to this kind of videoproduction and wedding representation. __________________ http://openproduction.ru/ http://magicbride.ru/

September 10th, 2009, 11:09 AM	#11
Oleg Kalyan Major Player Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: MOSCOW Posts: 860	thanks a lot colleagues, your input mean a lot, as a matter of fact, I am re editing it a bit, thanks to you. The link is temporary made Private, thanks again, will post a reedit soon! ( with subtitles) In brief, I am for cinematic approach, and the most important thing is creating a meaningful emotional experience. Also unique I should say! A clipmaking approach, cutting a wedding video bits to a song is highly form oriented approach, very often dependent on a song, soundtrack which regretfully we do not own, or produce. Would love to talk more about cinematic approach, anyone could give a definition?

September 11th, 2009, 06:17 AM	#12
Serge Satkar Regular Crew Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Moscow Posts: 107	Well, it's a very interesting theme.. I'm for balance and in most of the times doing two versions -- documentary and clip-like, representative, short-form approach. It solves many subtle problems in choosing shots, reflection of certain moments etc. No unique truth for this. And I don't want to prevail any direction in my works and vision. My aim is shooting and directing some big and global project, I studying Hollywood practice learning many books that avail... But I don't wanna be boring if I truly guess what couple needs.. Such a thought.. So double package often is a good solution for me. Second part (documentary) is rarely becomes public. But I do documentaties of different length and mood for about 3-4 years. __________________ http://openproduction.ru/ http://magicbride.ru/

December 12th, 2009, 01:01 PM	#13
Peter Ralph Major Player Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Denver/Vail Colorado Posts: 254	darn! it is private still? Sounded very interesting. Cinematic wedding video: I think often it is used to mean more like a Hollywood movie than a home movie. From the cinematography point of view it is a strong preference for closed over open framing/form - You know this distinction? Closed: everything in the frame looks as though it were placed deliberately the shot looks professional Open: messy "accidental" elements in the frame it looks more home movie.